Originally Posted by tony de wonderful (Post 10071968)

Do you not think that promising illegals benefits might attract many more?

Originally Posted by ALi-B (Post 10072008)

Are we mixing up Asylum seekers with illegal immigrants still? :D

Old Asylum Seekers: One time only offer to old/outdated asylum applicants. It would not apply to new/current applications. The aim is to clear up the mess that is the thousands of people who are already here.

And only asylum applicants. Not illegal immigrants who totally evaded our boarder controls. Rejected asylum applicants, technically are; but if they want to stay here, they should make themselves known...a last chance to hold up their hand and be counted, otherwise, we'll kick them out as and when we find them.

Any new asylum applicants would only be accepted for review if the applicant has proof they are from a country of conflict and can explain how they ended up in the UK and had valid reason for not applying for asylum in any of the countries they passed through beforehand (and adopting the same Asylum laws of those countries in which they passed). And also making themselves known at the point of entry; not claiming after being found working in the back of a Chinese take away.

Originally Posted by hutton_d (Post 10072112)

Asylum seekers - don't care how long they've been here - cannot get to the UK without crossing other countries where they are LEGALLY obliged to seek asylum. Send them back to France/Ireland/Holland/wherever they've come from.

Illegals - throw them out anyway.

Dave

Originally Posted by Puff The Magic Wagon! (Post 10071904)

Do you remember that NI commedian of the 70s/80s with the song

"Belfast, Belfast, what a wonderful town
It doesn't matter if your skin is brown"

Racist overtones apart, it summed up the situation perfectly :freak3:

Originally Posted by ALi-B (Post 10072008)

Are we mixing up Asylum seekers with illegal immigrants still? :D

Originally Posted by David Lock (Post 10072167)

So you'd be happy to uproot an established family that could very well be a happy part of a community with friends and young kids at school? Not very nice.

And are you sure that UK could legally do as you suggest. I'd lay a pound to a pinch of snuff that we would be breaking some international or European law.

dl

Originally Posted by ALi-B (Post 10071984)

I feel this could be a way to make it right for those who applied at a stage when Labour's asylum system was dysfunctional and who actually want to be part of the UK a chance. i.e to make what is currently wrong, better....If they stand up and be counted we'll reward them for it. We'll know who that are, where they are currently, and given them the chance to be a UK taxpayer ( ;) ).

Originally Posted by bigsinky (Post 10072201)

that would be George Jones and his Clubsound band. Shankill airways and all that. That was funny back then. we may have been laid back then but there were so few immigrants over here and we were too busy killing each other to notice any way. Not so now. eastern euopeans, poles, lithuanians have all been the target of violent racist attacks and petrol bombings and intimidation. the chinese seem to get away with it mainly because all the chinkys would close down overnight and where would the piss heads get their feed at 2am on a saturday morning.

Originally Posted by tony de wonderful (Post 10072232)

It's also about our social fabric and society.

Originally Posted by tony de wonderful (Post 10072236)

The Chinese diaspora have always been highly adept at slotting into other countries whilst creating minimal ripples, and they suffered lots of discrimination in 19th century America for example. And they did it all successfully in the days before welfare, human rights etc.

Originally Posted by David Lock (Post 10072167)

So you'd be happy to uproot an established family that could very well be a happy part of a community with friends and young kids at school? Not very nice.

And are you sure that UK could legally do as you suggest. I'd lay a pound to a pinch of snuff that we would be breaking some international or European law.

dl

Originally Posted by f1_fan (Post 10072255)

LOL, OK you try and open a business in Chinatown in Manchester and see how integrated they are then :thumb:

Originally Posted by jonc (Post 10072293)

Does the fact that the Chinese have been able to setup businesses in Manchester and contribute socially and ecomonically to the area not proves TDW point?

Originally Posted by bigsinky (Post 10072201)

that would be George Jones and his Clubsound band. Shankill airways and all that. That was funny back then. we may have been laid back then but there were so few immigrants over here and we were too busy killing each other to notice any way. Not so now. eastern euopeans, poles, lithuanians have all been the target of violent racist attacks and petrol bombings and intimidation. the chinese seem to get away with it mainly because all the chinkys would close down overnight and where would the piss heads get their feed at 2am on a saturday morning.

Originally Posted by f1_fan (Post 10072322)

He implied they had integrated, I don't call chasing non-Chinese businesses off their patch integrating. If you think that's OK then that is your opinion, but surely then you think Bradford is also a fine example of integration :thumb:

Originally Posted by f1_fan (Post 10072255)

LOL, OK you try and open a business in Chinatown in Manchester and see how integrated they are then :thumb:

Originally Posted by f1_fan (Post 10072255)

LOL, OK you try and open a business in Chinatown in Manchester and see how integrated they are then :thumb:

Originally Posted by urban (Post 10072462)

Is that still ongoing then?

I remember working in manchester many many years ago, and it was a nightmare then with the Triads

Originally Posted by bigsinky (Post 10071594)

thank fcuk i live in northern ireland where we live in a province of racial intolerence, not only do we kill each other still because of our religion, we pay special attention to those immigrants and suffer none to pass. we just petrol bomb them out or intimidate them. not something to be proud of but i don't have to pass a begging eastern european every 10 yards in belfast. you guys in engerland are too soft. send them all back home again. dole scrounging dodgy fcukers

Originally Posted by tony de wonderful (Post 10071482)

Utter madness it would seem?

I was listening to a debate on R5 this morning, it was interesting. It would seem that despite the fact that many people are sick or and worried by the flood of people into this country, the lefty pro-unconditional immigration/asylum for all etc just seem to totally have the debate cornered and owned.

It just seems they have to cry racism and 'discrimination' etc and 'right to family life' or other 'human rights' and the other side of the argument just packs up and goes home.

Is there an articulate voice against immigration, or just voices beyond the pail, i.e BNP?

What is legitimately wrong with not wanting to over-populate this country too much and being a social conservative?

These awful lefty types just seem to think that we'll have this multi-cultural utopia if we let anyone come here. So much injustice and so little time to fight it! We can save everyone who is oppressed and suffering!

Now I have to be honest, and years ago I might have believed that crap, but having traveled a fair bit especially to some less than savory countries, I've come to believe that (stable) western democracy is an exception and something to be conserved...it's a good thing...and more fragile than you might think! And it doesn't just 'happen' it needs to be maintained! Much of the world is dysfunctional and poorly socialised, bad regimes, bad education, bad institutions, bad cultural norms and conventions.

I don't believe that flooding our country with a) these people who have never been through our education system (education perpetuates democracy by socialising i.e John Dewey) b) over-populating c) causing social tensions and instability - is in anyway a good thing! Why do it?

I don't believe we have any unconditional duty to save everyone who suffer. It's hubris and arrogance to think we can. People will always suffer. Leave saving people to the individual and his/her conscience not to the state. These lefty idiots just don't seem to get that.:mad:

Originally Posted by bigsinky (Post 10071594)

thank fcuk i live in northern ireland where we live in a province of racial intolerence, not only do we kill each other still because of our religion, we pay special attention to those immigrants and suffer none to pass. we just petrol bomb them out or intimidate them. not something to be proud of but i don't have to pass a begging eastern european every 10 yards in belfast. you guys in engerland are too soft. send them all back home again. dole scrounging dodgy fcukers

Originally Posted by DYK (Post 10073481)

The UK as been exploited for far too long,these lefty do gooder types will still cry Human rights as we are all packed together like sardines in a can,and we are falling off the edge into the sea.

We all know why they come to the UK because other countries in Europe don't just hand out benefits,you have to of worked ex amount of years before you are entitled to claim if needed.People of the same race are sticking together in groups dotted throughout towns etc,maybe is the odd exception.Its got out of hand and the powers that be do realise we are a very small country with limited resources that are already struggling,but as soon as someone speaks out they are branded a racist..

Originally Posted by tony de wonderful (Post 10072569)

I never said they integrated as such. Fact is they haven't but otoh they never asked anything of the host countries really, they are self-reliant and just about commerce. You never see them demanding this and that and blaming everyone else, never demanding their own laws or special rights.

Originally Posted by dpb (Post 10075242)

So which particular sub species does do all the demanding /blaming would you say ??

- apart from Wyanne and wyanetta that is ?

Originally Posted by DYK (Post 10073481)

The UK as been exploited for far too long,these lefty do gooder types will still cry Human rights as we are all packed together like sardines in a can,and we are falling off the edge into the sea.

We all know why they come to the UK because other countries in Europe don't just hand out benefits,you have to of worked ex amount of years before you are entitled to claim if needed.People of the same race are sticking together in groups dotted throughout towns etc,maybe is the odd exception.Its got out of hand and the powers that be do realise we are a very small country with limited resources that are already struggling,but as soon as someone speaks out they are branded a racist..

Originally Posted by tony de wonderful (Post 10075289)

Not sub-species, but one group especially is especially vocal about how much victims they are...or at least has vocal spokespeople.

Originally Posted by dpb (Post 10076311)

Well come on then , voice your particular zenophobia :rolleyes: