I drive an Alfa Spider ... :D

Jezus, If it looked small to Birdy we must be talking Tic tac Dick :D
;)

Isnt such a comparison purely academic?

Ok....for the attention of the ;)ers

http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/flip.gif

:D :D :D

agree on the image thing.

dont agree with the ratio thing.

10+:1 M3(E46):imprezas round here.

am about to drive home, 8 miles, would be surprised if I see less than 3 M3s. Will see no imprezas, except maybe Ya Na in his P1.

The annoying thing is the M3 really is a great car, I hate the fact that most people I know who have bought them, have done so because it has the iomage of being what it is, not because of what it is capable of. These are the same types who had the E36 when it was new, and for greatness that car was not in the same league.

Within a few months, with any luck, I hope to have one of the most powerful imprezas in the country. If I were turning up to a wedding or a funeral, or meeting my girlfriends parents, I guarantee I would take my dads S2000 before choosing the 22B.

that I cannot argue with, and in that respect it is M3 anyday.

If it were a gun to my head and I had to choose. M3 wouldnt get a second glance.

Tough choice when a gunman makes you decide which lovely car you have to choose!! (bad analogy but you know what I mean!)

I've turned up to meet an ex-g/f's perants in the Scoob... one case the Mother was really interested... ;)

Arron, So it's toys that make the difference then ? Have to take it thats the case because you've mentioned nothing else in your posts other than hurl abuse.

I don't want toys in my spare car - My P1 still doesn't have a radio.

I'd be interested to see a M3 do an Exmoor run with us SW boys. From what EVO mag said about the car, "brakes only lasted two laps of spirited driving" I don't think we'd have any trouble !! But then, i suppose thats not what it was intended for, like the Scoob is not a motorway cruiser/speed thing is it.

Steve.

I just cannot believe that no one here speaks about the Alpina modified 4WD 3-series. Should be the best of both worlds- P1 and M3????

Ive driven an E46 Alpina B3 and believe me the M3 is the better car, I dont think Alpina do 4wd on the E46, certainly didnt feel like it!

Its an awesome car but the power delivery is very different, the alpina is more refined whilst the M3 is rip roaring!!

OOOh. now you got my goat up. The M3 is a marvellous car. The looks are a big improvement over the E36 which I always thought was fairly rotten and about 5 year behind where it should have been like every previous 3 series but looks are very much a personnal thing so we won't go into that.

What REALLY pi55es me off is this status rubbish. It's because of this, pretty much UK/Irish and some of euro, nonse that allows people like BMW/AUDI/VW etc to charge the same money for a reasonably specced A2 as a new Civic Type R. It's balls. German cars are no better built (most worse judging by your JD power survey) than Japanese cars. There are more toys in the Japanese stuff when you compare like with like. I wish we would all get over it and vote with the walllets. A BMW 318i is not half the car of a Lexus IS200 and it DEFINITELY is not better built, not even close, so why does it cost more when you spec it the same? Not sure of prices over there but in Ireland the new WRX costs the same as a base spec. BMW 320i????? I've owned a lot of cars and even though the Impreza doesn't feel as solid as a Toyota it's not that far off in new form and the last Toyota I had was better put together than that last (and only) 3 series I had.

The motor industry as a whole recognise that Toyota are the best built cars in the world but you can get a 190bhp Corolla for the price of a 1.6 Golf????

I know a lot of UK mags slag the yanks off for their cars but at least the snobbery level is at a real minimum over there. When the Lexus came out there the people voted with their wallets and it outsold Merc, BMW and Jag together in it's first year. Now all those cars are reduced in price and increased in spec as a result.

This goes for the entire range of cars from them as I think that the E46 in the UK is reasonably priced (compared to over here) and a par with the Skyline in price is probably right.

Forget the snobbery. It's only in your heads and it just means they hike the price of cars that are no better built then anything else on the roads. It's not the 70s now :)

Oh I feel better already

Errrr...good point ...I think! :D

BMW's do indeed have an "image", but it's not one that I would choose to be associated with.

Um. On another point regarding the spec of cars. When I asked warrender to spec me a WRC320 ( comparable output and performance to the M3) to the level of interior refinement that the M3 comes with as standard, all be it £40k +. I ended up with a £45k Impreza.
Now I wonder which would give me the best return over 3years. Answer: the M3.
Next we'll all start debating if the Scoob is a better performance car than a 911 or 360 modena.
I've heard of brand loyalty but some of the scoobynetters take it a little too far. There are better cars out there boys & girls!

I believe the current evolution process to go something like this if it's practical performance motoring you're after:

Cooper S
Focus RS
STi V7
Evo 7 or M3
911 Carrera 2 or M3
911 Turbo or Merc 55AMG
Zonda (ok it's not practical but certainly the best super car until put head to head with the Enzo!!)

All IMHO of course. Go on give your list......

Mine didn't cost anywhere near £45k ..............

the funniest thing is that you'd get the p1ss taken out of u if ur seen driving a BMW in germany - something a german friend told me, can anyone cofirm?

Anyone remember EVO with the E46 M3, STi 7, Mini, Civic Type R, Porsche 996,

1st Place, Yup, STi 7!! http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/wavey.gif

Well they use the 7 series as Taxi's!!!. I was in one last year, theres loads of them!!!!

Tom,

That Alpina you drove was most probably not a 4WD. And yes Alpina does make them- with 280hp 3.3 engines and sport suspension! I am told by a friend who has driven one that the 4WD conversion sharpins the steering and front-suspension over the 2WD.

Well said Sorehead. I would rather have an Evo or 22b than an M3 anyday. M3 is a really nice car but not my cup of tea. My Evo on the other hand is. Could have had a Porsche or a new M3 but I don't quite get German cars. It's a bit like that Clarkson programme on the best supercar. Maclaren F1 is the daddy - the fastest - the best - end of story...but Ferrari F40 was his choice and for the same reasons I'd choose a 22b or Evo everytime.(And no an M3 is NOT the daddy like the F1)

BTW A friend of mine with a Porsche always takes the p1ss out of my plastic Evo but someone drove into the back of my Evo the other day and wrote off his car - my bumper was scrached and cracked. Jap cars are fundementaly built like tanks.

I thought my initial note might provoke a little response!!!

My attitide is the same as healeyb...it's horses for courses but come on guys, if we can warrant debate about these two cars when one costs more than twice the other then who's pulling who's plonker.

My mate has just got a 3yo Carrera 4 for £40k, cost £87k new! Do you still think the M3 is a good choice?

ive got a P1 youve got a M3, i'll blow your doors off on Exmoor but youll drive with gadets, quality and cruising and your ears wont be ringing because of the decat:D
Wno cares, both are mint cars, both different. Enjoy:D:D

Let's face it, the M3 has only one purpose - so tossers and hooray henry's can pose in the carpark at David Lloyds. Badge snobbery at its worst.

https://www.gamers-forums.com/smilie...finger_red.gif

Ken

Certainly not on the M3!

guys

P1 v M3 on the papper alone M3 is abit ahead.Maybe on the road it should be ahead but(P1 4WD, M3 2WD) I think this is the key factor to decide who win. on a motorway ONLY i will give it to M3,On the others A, B, CITY ROAD etc P1 sure WIN!!!!

But at the end of the day the king is still SKYLINE.I ve to admitt it, even i own a scooby. We all try to be fair aren't we?

At what point did BMW become a icon? a car to be seen in?

I see alot of people buy BMWs for the wrong reasons, well probably right for them, but alot associate having one to show to there friends they have arrived, albeit a kreg 318i and think theyre posh.:)

I mean werent they motorbike manufactuers then 3 wheelers?

The old bimmere were a pile of crap!

i just wondered if other countrys regard it as a "status symbol"
like the guy said earlier in america they bought the lexus, but over there they probably would vote with there wallets, over here they vote with what other people are going to think, what will the neighbours think, will people think im loaded?

My mate bought a new 318i with 17 inch alloys etc but left his personel number plate off, i asked why he didnt put it on, he said coz its a new registration and thought id leave it off for a while!
sums it up for me, to impress the neighbours!

if i get a new motor i stick number on straight away, as id rather people didnt know id gone out and bought a brand new motor.

i do like M3s but would not like the image that goes with it, great car but unfortunately in this country there is definately a stigma attached.
i think id loose half my customers if i turned up in one.

i think the P1 is better VFM perfomance car and is probably more driver friendly in bad conditions, and even with the big wing it wont be sneered at s much as the m3.

suppose it depends what area ou live in.

At the end of the day where do you want to go fast. Some cars are fast on the straights, round the bends, in the dry or in the wet. To be fast on all of them you need 4WD a big firk off turbo and at least 300hp.

At what point did BMW become a icon? a car to be seen in?
-Lee P

About 20 years ago when the old Motorsport CSL's were blitzing the touring car championships. I also think the first M3 has a damn site more "EVO'ness" than most other cars on the road. Let's think, the Scoob has been around about ten years and finally emerged as an icon about 4-5years ago. Not knocking it - I own one. Just think the M series BMW's have a bit more pedigree than the relatively recent impreza discovery.

All IMHO and I love both.

only comment i can add is a fine incident recently on the m180 when myself and a friend happened upon an e36 m3 which hit the limiter at about 155,we didnt (99 model impreza running prodrive exhaust otherwise standard)and thus proved that we had purcheased the better value of the two in views of laughs???we then felt guilty as he did have more power but could not use it !so waited for him after leaving the motorway and took pleasure in making it two out of two!!(top marks to the guy though what a good sport!)e36 m3 ve impreza no competion,however i will agree the new m3 is something else,but so is the price!!not really a fair comparison,try matching a new m3 with say a skyline at similar money??jap ve german jap always !!! only my opinion though