LG John

It amazes me the power the government has to slowly influence and turn people.

I recall 4 years ago when I first joined scoobynet that pretty much everyone on it was anti-speed camera. Slowly but surely though the general feeling in threads are changing and now if you post up on SN that you were speeding or having a bit of fun with another car you deserve the book thrown at you, etc. People that post up, '61 in a 50 what can I do' are now being told, 'take your points like a man - you deserve them'. Where speeding was once seen as an accepted norm (provided its not excessive) its now seen as unsociable and I do get more people flashing when I cruise past at 90mph!! The governments campaign on this matter has worked. Maybe thats a good thing but its not the point of this thread to debate that.

But the best one is fuel.

I remember SN being up in arms around the time of the lorry blockades. I remember 95% of poster being in full support of them, that fuel was rediculous and the government were taking the p*ss. Now, fuel is MUCH more expensive than it was then (not proportional to inflation) and yet again people on SN are turning to the governments thinking, 'I'd rather they tax my fuel than my wages' one poster said, 'it's not the governments fault' said another, 'well where else are they going to get the revenue', 'we really don't need fuel guzzlers like scoobys', etc, etc. Where a few years ago we set up road blocks at the thought of 70-odd pence a litre we now are accepting £1 a litre with little fight. I honestly think the price could hit £1.10p tomorrow and you'd still not see the resitance we saw a few years ago.

I.D cards next people. There doesn't seem to be much support for them yet but give the government a few years to influence and you'll be scrambling for them....trust me.

what would scooby do

spin spin spin - they have even demonised drink driving !

Dream Weaver

Bent over a barrel, we've all been brain washed now be new labia

Everyone just accepts whats happening to us and PC is going crazy. The problem is, when you know everyone else is just bending over and taking it you tend to think why should I bother trying to fight when no-one else is.

In 10 years time, the UK will be a nasty place to live.

OllyK

Submission by attrition. Keep hammering away and people's resistance will crumble and before long they wander about as NL zombies chanting the mantra.

When the big crash comes like it did in the 70's people will jump ship and NL will be the bad guys instead of the Tories, then it will start all over again.

paul-s

why do other countries not have this problem ? i think i a nice little villa down on the coast of spain will do me in a few years no more pc bullcrap

ajm

Social engineering of the weak minded.

Leslie

I have not been brainwashed yet, and i don't intend to be either. Nil carborundum etc!
Got to fight it Dream W.

Les

ScooBStu

Agreed it seems everyone on here says speeding is wrong but they all drive scoobies - Whats the point in owning one if you drive it like a *****!!!

Also agreed about the having a bit of fun with another car - People are going to jail because they were seen as racing when the other car comes off the road and kills the driver - Rubbish it is the others responsibility full stop. If you pulled up at a set of lights and put your foot down and the guy next to you came off the road should you go to jail - Not a chance!!!

Also this country is full of soft t*ats - I am ready for a fuel protest and ready to do one - When and where is there going to be one in the North East.

Most of the country voted labour back in - useless f*ckers!!!

Reality

Times change.

The post about drink driving is a good one.

I was once stopped for driving all over the road through being drunk and the copper told me to take it easy on the rest of my journey

We were also once stopped on the M4 trying to get 150 out of a quattro sport - the cops admired the car and sent us on our way.

Resources reducing, people wanting them increasing.

Roads have too many cars on them now to allow speeding like it used to be

Change essential if we are to survive.

I'd be quite happy to see petrol at £2 a litre - removing all other road type taxes - then the ***** that don't Insure, tax, MOT, look after their cars wouldn't be able to be on the road !

Reffro

I'm still against speed cameras, but if someone is too ******* stupid to avoid getting caught by one, then they don't get any sympathy from me, and get told to take it like a man.

Supply and demand is what's caused the the vast majority of the recent rise in fuel prices. Remember there has been no increase in the fuel duty or vat rate since the start of the year. If the price hits £1.10 I'd be out protesting as that is near as damn it £5 a gallon.......... But the current price is a consequence of many factors, tax being one of course, but Brown is not going to reduce the fuel duty, he simply can't afford it for reasons I explained in this thread

http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthread.php?t=454787

And I ain't never going to agree with or get an ID card.

Spring Heeled Jack

We even have people on here advocating people should not drive cars at all and cycle everywhere at all times.

No doubt a diet of cold turnip soup and self-flagellation is on the agenda too.

And I thought this was a performance car forum.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

My opinions have never chnaged. Probabaly not been as vocal as I used to though:

Speeding, never really had a problem on the open road when its quiet. In town always been against it, and my stance was if you were caught, well you should have kept your eyes open (unless said van/camera was well hidden). I've aways been digusted at the governments factless "Think and "Speed Kills" campaign, and the privatisation of speed enforcment to thrid parties (safety partnerships) who operate on purely financial basis. And through all that, I still go to the pub and have pint and drive back home - but I have always agreed with the drink driving laws.

Fuel, it is the govenments fault for relying so much on fuel duty for its income and grossly inefficient and massively wasteful spending through pure imcompetence. But this time I'm on the fence with the potential protest...due to government future proposals...if we protest, they may scrap the current system and introduce vehicle tracking, and variable rate pay per mile charging - which will be worse than the current system. So I'm not complaining purely through fear of what they will do.

I am against ID cards purely because it will never address the issues and problems it is intended (identity theft, fraud etc.) Although, I feel it would be handy to use as opposed to lumbering a passport everytime I need to draw the company wages out the bank - but it won't be anymore secure, so waste of time IMO.


I'll bookmark this page and check backj to see if I get brainwashed

Dracoro

SaxoBoy:
Speeding - I'm still with you as I was 4 years ago.
Fuel - As per my other posts, since the blockades there has been NO RISE in fuel duty. In other words, the govt. have done nothing since. The current rises are very little to do with the govt (from 70p to £1 a litre, the vat element is about 5p, so that's 25p due to other forces).
ID cards - can't see the point unless done properly (which it won't) and fraud-proof (due to be implemented the same day as the annual flying pig convention).

imlach

Yeah, sorry Kenny, but fuel prices this time are very little to do with the goverment.

JTaylor

Is the thread not more to do with the Governments ability to change public opinion then the minutiae discussed above?

I find it increasingly hauting that agendas can be set and that the masses can be manipulated to comply.

In my brief visit to this planet I really feel that my will should be that given to me by God or Mother Nature (dependant on your beliefs) and not NL. Yes, of course there needs to be a sensibly interpreted Law, I am not an anarchist, but I am a libertarian. I increasingly feel that many aspects of my day to day life are being dictated by a centralised organisation.

This Government is in place to act on behalf of me and you - as an essentially law abiding citizen (some times resentfully, but law abiding none-the-less) I don't feel as though I get a fair deal.

The best example I can offer is this; I was brought up in an area called Derriford in Plymouth (on the ouskirts of the City and the edge of Dartmoor). I clearly remember an abundance of green fields and the freedom to play safely and at will. Now when I return to the area to see my Mother, almost every visit is greeted with another souless "Retail Park" with the obligatory American fast food outlets. Where was the consultation? Why was my fondest slither of our green and pleasant land snatched from me without discussion. Those fields were as much mine as the local Councils and their older brother in Whitehall.

I believe we ought to change the country's name to Britain PLC. Citizens should become known as employees. Trouble makers can be sacked, we can be logged as we move around, placed under strict control and fearful of not adhering to the mission statement. Our masters can reap the rewards - and we'll keep letting it happen. Sound familier? It wouldn't be so unbarable if the bosses were competant and the hard working employees saw better conditions. But this is simply not the case.

It's imperative that we remind the Government that they act on our behalf - before apathy gets the better of us.

SJ_Skyline

I believe the term is called "Social Engineering"

His Tonyness & co. seem to have lost sight of the fact that government is there to govern, not to rule.

imlach

Again, being apolitical, I'm not really seeing any difference in the Blair goverment from goverments of past times. Goverments are never popular. Who enjoys taxation?

Vegescoob

All you have to remember is that any form of Government is only there to ensure the survival of a few at the top. That is not necessarily the politicians.That is why the gap between rich and poor is growing, which of course seems contradictory under a Government with Labour somewhere in it's name.
Greater control of the law abiding majority, by for instance the increasing use of the potential of digital technology, merely assists that task. As JTaylor says above it all helps to keep the population "on message".
Please don't believe you live in a democracy.

imlach

Well if you really DO think that, then why aren't people like you out there forming a new political force which presumably the MAJORITY will agree with and get you into power?

If it's that simple to run a government, why hasn't this happened?

It IS, after all, a democracy, and you are free to stand for parliment. Perhaps it's just easier to moan eh?

JTaylor

OK that's it. Your obviously a NL stooge. I'm going to form an SN party and it will be a Neo Facist single issue party called Repel Imlachs Godforesaken Hinderingly Tiresome Spouts.

Seriously, were you taken to oneside at Uni by a slightly suspicious looking character and told "if we do what we ask of you, you'll be OK ".

imlach

Why do ppl assume I support NL?! Good grief, I've never voted Labour in my life!

Mr Taylor. I don't really care what you think of my posts, but no-one seems to dispute them All facts & common sense is what my agenda is.

JTaylor

As it happens Imlach I think you're a bright spark . I'm simply not used to someone being so openly compliant with the state agenda. Those junior recruiters outside the Student Union must have been watching you since the sixth form.

imlach

I look at things from an economic viewpoint, not a political one. Politicians bore me.

JTaylor

What isn't politics Imlach?

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I'm with Jeremy Clarkson.

"Democracy? Pah! Never trust anything invented by the Greeks"

Two prerequsites of democracy would, I'd argue, be:

-A population where the majority is sufficiently clued up to contribute constructively.
-A population where the majority care enough to actually contribute.

Both are sorely lacking in the UK. Partly due to the NL substitution of politics for spin, but lets not kid ourselves; the rot has been there for a long time!

NS04

The Zohan

Voting in Labour for a second term kinda rubber stamped their approach to spin and deciet IMHO.

They are powerful and, have no real opposition which is the big problem.

Big Den

Haven't you seen/read all the news items about the Brits in Spain being mugged/robbed/burgled - and it's on the increase apparently!!

Don't think moving ot another Country is the solution.

I wonder if all these folk that constantly complain about New Labour actually go off their butt's & voted - voter apathy is a real problem in elections.

IF YOU DON'T VOTE, YOU CAN'T COMPLAIN!!

We are supposed to live in a democratic society so IMO, if the majority of people in the Country are really opposed to something - ID cards, etc, then surely they have a right to voice that opinion & be taken notice of.

Having said that the Government may lsiten and not do anything different anyway - they're in for another 4 years after all as the duly elected representatives of the British population.

Den

Vegescoob

To imagine that anything resembling a true democracy could be established is wishfull thinking.
There will always be individuals and organisations with greater influence than the individual voter.
How about if everyone entitled to vote was given access to a computer such that, instead of MPs voting in Parliament every voter did so by computer. Parliament would then be the means by which "the will of the people" was enacted.
That would mean a move towards democracy instead of the so called representative democracy we are supposed to have.
Now that would be a use of digital technology I would approve of.
Ah, but we can't trust the population to make the right decisions. Can we?

JTaylor

Beware of the ILLUMINATAE

Big Den

Haven't you seen terminator then? That would be the first step to machines ruling the world