jjones

PLEASE NOTE THIS IS NOT A POLE OF WHAT RELIGION (IF ANY) THAT YOU FOLLOW!!

popeye

Doesn't look like a poll full stop.

ajm

He may still be editing the poll......

Pending a "proper" poll: No, I am not religious - I see it as weak mindedness.

jjones

****ed it, then press back button as instructed and it loses all the data. nice.

popeye

No, he ***ed it.

ajm

So I see!

The benefit of doubt was thrown back in my face!

popeye

Sorry - I agree with your comments on this (and the Sikh thread) BTW.

*scratches head*

Tiggs

a common view....but history/current affairs show us many strong minded religous people.


if people arent thats fine but to to say "no...because its crap/for the weak/cause of probs" etc is like that person crediting faith with more than they suggest its worth by their apparent need to CLEARLY distance it from the "right" way.

andypugh2000

Amen to that

ajm

I think you'll find that most of them would be better described as strong willed rather than strong minded. You'll also find that most of them were leaders, not the drones.

I make the distinction between strong wills and strong minds because strong will drives us to physical extremes, whereas a strong mind is required to venture outside of the protective shell of a religion to make desicions for ourselves and to accept that we are responsible and ultimately answerable for ourselves and our actions, not some omnipotent being. A strong mind is required to conduct oneself in a becoming fashion without the threat of eternal damnation or the dangled carrot of heaven to constrain our behaviour.

There are pleanty of weak minded non-religious people as well by the way!

CrisPDuk

I do believe in a higher being, I also think it is supremely arrogant to believe that we are the superior race.

But I also believe that organised religion is the oldest, and still the best method for deeply corrupt & morally bankrupt people to gain control over huge masses of people. Witness the religious & political leaders of India & Pakistan whipping up trouble in the previously peaceful Kashmir region, or Greece & Turkey, and their continual sabre rattling over Cyprus. Or look at the way religious fundamentalists managed to hijack an election to ensure the return of the most unpopular president the US has ever had

Drunken Bungle Whore

I think religious beliefs are deeply personal and not to be judged by others. I've got a scientific background - but for the life of me can't explain how we got here and what makes us 'alive'.

I'm not a fan of organised religion - too often people are busy being religious and simply not christian enough. They'll bash you over the head with the bits of the bible they like and ignore the bits that make things uncomfortable for them ("Judge not lest ye be judged" seems to go right over many of their heads!)

This life isn't easy for any of us - and whatever helps you get through it in one piece is your own personal choice.

Religious beliefs should never be forced on others - and I find it hard to accept that there is only 'one way' - after all if there is a God that is clever enough to create a whole planet of different people - surely you'd allow for them to all make their own way too you? (Rather like going from London to Manchester - same destination, but lots of different routes)

I'm not usually this philosphical until I've had a few!

Leslie

I have always found that those who follow religious teachings are very strong minded. They have to be to keep to that kind of self discipline.

I was brought up with a scientific background as well and cannot see why that should affect one's religious or not beliefs in all honesty. One does not gainsay the other in any way in fact.

Les

FrenchBoy

I find organised religion to be a cancer of the human spirit. It is one of the main obstacles to any hope we have of developing as a race/species. I dont think we can ever expect to reach our full potential until we throw off our superstitious shackles.

Religion feeds on the insecurity, doubt and existential fear that most of us experience at one time or another. I have no problem with the central tenets of religion but i don't need a supernatural overlord to tell me how to live my life and treat other people. It is humanist common sense.

ajm

I don't agree. People who are disciplined in a religious sense are that way either out of fear of what would happen if they were to question why they are praying to an unseen being x times a day, why they are having to make sacrifices in their life in order to please the aforementioned being with no tangible benefit. They are frightened that once they lose that belief they will find they cannot live without guidance and hence they cling to it.

It takes a strong will to make oneself adhere to such a lifestyle regardless of doubt, but it takes a strong mind to question the rationality of what they are doing.

If you were to take all the "good" bits out of a religion, i.e. all the bits about selfless living, respecting others you will find that they can all be achieved without having to perform rituals or even the essential religious ingredient, an unshaking belief in the existence of a god.

People who can live a virtuous life without the promise of a place in heaven, or the threat of a place in hell are the truly strong minded.

I don't consider myself amongst them by the way, as my life is far from virtuous!

Jerome

I am atheist, but have a strong respect for religion and those that follow it.

I think religion was essential for civilised society - most of our laws are derived from the 10 Commandments. As soon as mankind became intelligent enough to ask "where did we come from?", religion sprouted up as an answer to an unanswerable question. It has been a much needed crutch for peoples all around the world for millennia.

However important it was in the formation of civilised societies though, it has also had its disadvantages - corrupt religious leaders and many (if not all) wars over the centuries for example.

For the record, I had a religion neutral upbringing. Interestly, I am atheist, yet my sister is very religious.

Buckrogers

Nope, not religious.

Jap2Scrap

Not at all. Closest I come to religious is shouting "CHRIST THAT F**KING HURT" if I hit my thumb with a hammer. I also DO have a problem with those that are overtly religious to the point of using it as an excuse for what many would deem unethical behaviour (I'm talking about the ethics of humanity not religion). I also hate the way religious issues and racism are so often confused, the two are not inextricably linked. The most annoying thing however is that, as a Muslim, Abu Hansa can stand on his soapbox, in what is traditionally a Christian country, and denounce Christianity to the point of calling all Christians in general evil infidels, yet if a Christian were to do the same about Muslims in general they'd soon see the wrong side of a cell door.

It's wrong and it's inconsistent. As a religion Christians are so afraid of upsetting anyone that they'll allow the majority to be walked over by the minority.

Personally I have no prejudices whatsoever. I think they're all tossers.

r32

I'd like to think that I have Christian values ........

Apparition

I'm Pagan. I believe in the seasons, the Earth, water, air etc. I have no problem with what or who others believe in but I do despise those who try to thrust their beliefs upon others. Or those who insist that what /who they believe in is/are better than anything else.
Having said all that, I truely believe that we are placed here on this earth to live out our lives as best we can without harm nor hindrance to others. I work my belief on the basis of an all surrounding being and do not pretend to ask any favours, because we get ourselves into our own messes and have to learn how to get out of them . Belief to me is a comfort. Nothing more. Nothing magic, nothing supernatural. Just there.

imi

YES, and you guys let him....Freedom of speech, even though this no good piece of worthless being preaches hatred left right and center and is breading terrorism in this very own country of ours.

Yup, nothing to with being a Christian, but if the same were to happen in another country, regardless of whether it was Islamic or not, I dont think a person like Hamza should be tolerated.

He can have his views, but if he preaches hatred and provokes, then he has to be shut.

Leslie

ajm,

I agree with your point about some religious teaching instilling a fear of what might happen to those who behave badly with respect to the doctrines of that religion. I think that is usually a personal trait of the particular teacher involved as much as anything. I dont subscribe to that sort of thing.

As people gain experience of life however, and gain self confidence, they tend to take a more overall view of life and temper their beliefs with their own common sense. I remember during my 6th form education attending Apologetics classes where all religions including paganism, atheism, agnosticism, and satanism were thoroughly discussed and investigated with no bias being shown in any one direction. We were absolutely free and expected to give our own honest views without prejudice. We were also free to follow our own beliefs. I think that is how it should be.

As you say, religions generally have good bits and they do encourage people to live good lives with diue regard to the welfare of others. I think that if people are not shown some form of guidance when they are young in how to lead their lives in a responsible manner, then the most likely course they will follow is a bad one. We see that everywhere now and I think a lot of that is because of the extremely secular society that we live in today. No one is perfect and we all do regrettable things in our lives. Its all a matter of degree of course. Those who have had no education in how to live in a peaceful and fair society are the ones who will be most likely to commit the really shameful acts.

Religious teachings did a lot to reduce that possibilty.

Jap to Scrap,

It really is most unfair and particularly ill mannered if you don't mind me saying so, to call religious followers a bunch of tossers, if that is how I read your post.

Incidentally Abu Hamza is entitled to denounce Christianity if he wishes, its when he encourages his young followers to commit murderous terrorist acts that he is promoting sedition and that is quite rightly not allowed.

Les

Jap2Scrap

I wasn't calling all religious followers a bunch of tossers, just those who preach their views and have no consideration for what others may or may not choose to believe.

I also think you contradict yourself there Les because if Abu Hamza has the right to denounce Christianity then surely I have the right to denounce any or all religions and if my way of denouncing them is to call them tossers then it's not unfair in the slightest.

Leslie

Jap2Scrap,

You are of course as entitled to denounce religious beliefs if that is what you believe. I did not say that you are not.

The impression I got from your post was that you regard all Christians as "tossers" and that is why I said it was ill mannered and unfair to be insulted like that for one's honest beliefs. It does nothing to strengthen the argument either. Not all Christians are prepared to allow themselves to be "walked over" either.

I would go along with the idea that someone who is not prepared to accept that everyone is entitled to his own personal beliefs and not just to those of the bigoted person himself is wrong to take such an attitude.

Les

DEEDEE

I have my religion and believe what I have been bought up to believe, I do not impose my self on anyone else. So I do not expect to have other religions imposed on me. And regarding Abu Hamza there is no wonder people are accused as being racist having to listen to his vile preaching. Best thing for him and his followers is a holiday back to Afghanistan. I also believe this is why Britain has never been attacked, reason we are to tolerant with these people. We let them operate from this country

yoza

I believe in no religion...

And have been to a church less than 10 times in my life.

But.

A funny thing happened last year on Christmas Eve.

I got ****faced, as usual, but stopped off at a church for midnight mass, dont ask...

I havent the faintest idea why.

Anyway, I was drinking white spirits and I shouldnt, it makes me cry, and try to find the meaning of life, you know how it is.......

So Im sat there bladdered, asking these questions in my head.

Then the next day thought nothing of it, my mates on the other hand thought it was most amusing.

10 months later my son was born, mad as ****. Not planned, not even talked about.

I remember most of the questions, and they revolved around, "What am I here for, there must be more to life that getting bladdered and having a fight at the taxi rank."

Anyway, I go quite often now..

Edited to say.

I did post at the time of the incident, but cant find the post.

Jamo

iTrader: (23)

imho it was a story that was told to kids, that got out of proportion, I think its all just that a story, dont believe in it never have never will.

if there was a god, would YOUR god have done what he did to all those 59k and counting people?

I do however believe in aliens, because if we can exist here, then id say there must be other living organisms out there, be it algy form, or being form, (not little green men) as thats doubtfull, but if we can exist, then surely in the same/similar conditions elsewhere other "organisms" could live/exist.

just my 20 and a half pence

jamo

jimbrit

Internet Professional JJones

King RA

I worship the alien algae.

jjones

how is your summer sale going?