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chancellor cuts 100,000 civil service jobs

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Old 12 July 2004, 04:32 PM
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imlach
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Default chancellor cuts 100,000 civil service jobs

So, 100,000 people are deemed to be "inefficient" in the civil service

Say the average wage of each one is £20,000 per annum (not even factoring in costs of their pension contributions, NI, cost per employee to the civil service in terms of facilities etc! - which probably means more like £40k real cost per employee on average).

That's £2bn per year AT LEAST in us currently funding these 100,000 "inefficient" civil servants!!!

£2bn!

Last edited by imlach; 12 July 2004 at 04:41 PM. Reason: oops....got my billions confused with US billions!
Old 12 July 2004, 04:34 PM
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J4CKO (looking worried)
Old 12 July 2004, 04:41 PM
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Freak
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And what will the savings be spent on?

Old 12 July 2004, 04:43 PM
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Redundancy payouts....?

Old 12 July 2004, 04:44 PM
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TelBoy
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That he *can* cut 100,000 speaks volumes imo.

Overdue, and most civil servants know it.
Old 12 July 2004, 04:44 PM
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Prepare your wallets for a mugging.
Old 12 July 2004, 04:45 PM
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SPEN555
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+Redundancy

+Lost tax & NIC

+Payout in Jobseekers allowance

= Stuff all savings
Old 12 July 2004, 04:46 PM
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imlach
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Hmm....goverment departmental spending in 2007/08 will total £340bn.

There are approx 50m people in this country, and therefore, that comes to £6800 spent per person by the goverment of this country....
Old 12 July 2004, 04:59 PM
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Brendan Hughes
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Excellent! Almost enough to invade another country!


(BTW, I thought it was 80 000 going and 20 000 being relocated out of London.)
Old 12 July 2004, 05:10 PM
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MattW
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I used to work in the civil service and I would suggest your average is way to high

Most people do f*** all though
Old 12 July 2004, 05:18 PM
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imlach
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Originally Posted by MattW
I used to work in the civil service and I would suggest your average is way to high
The salary may be too high, but the cost per employee will not be.

The cost to the company of each engineer in our company is probably approaching £100k per seat. The salary is probably half of that.

Remember, the employer has to budget for the following over & above the employee's salary :

- employer NI contributions
- pension contributions in most cases
- lots of other benefits (sick pay, life insurance, etc)
- equipment (PCs, desks, etc)
- facility running costs (heating, water, sewage, etc)
- rates on the building, as well as perhaps rent
Old 12 July 2004, 05:27 PM
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imlach
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Originally Posted by Brendan Hughes
(BTW, I thought it was 80 000 going and 20 000 being relocated out of London.)
No, 104,000 going (84,000 in England, and 20,000 in Scotland, Wales, and NI).

20,000 in addition being moved out of London.
Old 12 July 2004, 05:41 PM
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completely unsurprising, I always wondered what the hell most of em do, apart from sit there and try and invent the wheel!!!!

I have always believed that if local government were run as businesses that had to go and win new business, provide a good level of customer service and have staff that were accountable if they didnt do their job properly I would give them at best 2 months before going bust!
Old 12 July 2004, 05:44 PM
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Other hidden costs of mass redundancies which I've never seen any organisation take into account:

Firstly, many people above the 104,000 will leave (after seeing whether they get a fat redundancy cheque) because of fears for the security of their once considered "safe" jobs. The first people to go are normally the best people, simply because they are the most re-employable. Yes, even the civil service has a few good people.

Secondly, years of difficulty in recruiting. Initially this isn't a problem because you've just got rid of people and don't need to hire. But, the people who will abandon the sinking ship will need to be replaced. As people will be more reluctant to join an organisation seen to be insecure, they will need to increase salary offers to encourage people to join. Either that or you end up hiring a bunch of biffa's who are incompetant and lazy.

Either way costs will increase a few months/years down the line. Gordon Brown-Nose will then be forced to either increase taxes (again!) or make more people redundant, perpetuating the cycle.
Old 12 July 2004, 06:05 PM
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Thumbs down

What they forget to mention are the **500,000** they created in the first place.

More spin and half truths I'm afraid.

UB
Old 12 July 2004, 06:05 PM
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Hmmm, funny one for me this. I work for a Non Departmental Public Body, so I'm not a civil servant but everything we do is funded by the government; my gran is trying to put the ***** up me! UR, what is your source?

Cheers

C
Old 12 July 2004, 06:10 PM
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Source here
Old 12 July 2004, 06:12 PM
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imlach
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You've got to laugh - the most jobs to go are in what dept??.....

"Work & pensions" - 40,000, or about 40% of the cuts.

Oh, the irony......
Old 12 July 2004, 06:48 PM
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having worked with hundreds of civil servants i can say that most of them will not be missed.
Old 12 July 2004, 06:56 PM
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Right then...all he needs to to do now is get rid of all the middle man sapping the NHS funds and employ doctors and nurses instead.

And stop renaming departments...such as DETR to VOSA, or whatever it's called now, and wasting a few billion in new officies, thinking up another catchy acronym, designing logos, new letter heads, computers, software, websites etc.
Old 12 July 2004, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by eClaire
UR, what is your source?

Cheers

C
Not sure if you mean't UB? In case you did, my source is from the Mail - a clipping I saved for discussions such as this one. Quote:

"The number of Pulic Sector Jobs has swollen by more than 500,000 in just 5 years. Labout hit the half-million mark after 162,000 taxpayer funded workers were taken on last year - a rate of 444 extra state jobs a day."

There's plenty more too. I'll roll that out as required.

UB
Old 12 July 2004, 07:22 PM
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LOL Cheers for that UB but UR is a codename for imlach!

Looks like I am safe then (fingers crossed) no planned cuts in my area *phew*!
Old 12 July 2004, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by ALi-B
And stop renaming departments...such as DETR to VOSA, or whatever it's called now, and wasting a few billion in new officies, thinking up another catchy acronym, designing logos, new letter heads, computers, software, websites etc.
Yes, sure I read recently that the Scottish Executive spent £200k on working out a new marketing logo for Scotland....

....and what was it? The Saltire....

Hmm...wish I'd been given £200k to think of that one....
Old 12 July 2004, 08:01 PM
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This is a load of cr@p.

It doesn't matter whether I'm getting served in a shop, on the phone to my bank, getting my motor serviced, sorting out insurance, getting work done on the house......about half the people I deal with are lazy, workshy, incompetent, stupid or all 4. Civil service doesn't have a monopoly - it's just human nature for a lot of people.

Me? I work in local government
Old 12 July 2004, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by unclebuck
Not sure if you mean't UB? In case you did, my source is from the Mail - a clipping I saved for discussions such as this one. Quote:

"The number of Pulic Sector Jobs has swollen by more than 500,000 in just 5 years. Labout hit the half-million mark after 162,000 taxpayer funded workers were taken on last year - a rate of 444 extra state jobs a day."

There's plenty more too. I'll roll that out as required.

UB
The Mail bless 'em

Out of interest does it give details of where these extra 500,000 work, as I'm sure even they'd not claim they are all desk jockeys.
Old 12 July 2004, 09:01 PM
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unclebuck
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Originally Posted by MooseRacer
The Mail bless 'em

Out of interest does it give details of where these extra 500,000 work, as I'm sure even they'd not claim they are all desk jockeys.
Fair point, but they are just showing the numbers, not making opinions.

"The Government hired just 4,000 teachers last year among 88,000 new staff working in education."

"Recent studies show that 6 out of 10 NHS staff are clerks or managers while only 7% are doctors and fewer than a third are nurses."

My opinion is that they are buying votes with our taxes, creating completely pointless 'non jobs'. They can readily cull 100,000 of these without any impact on services and dress it up to make themselves look good, claiming to cut waste etc.
Old 13 July 2004, 07:18 AM
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r32
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Red face

What do those 100.000 do that we dont need doing any more?

I guess some of them dont do much but at least 50% work surely?
Old 13 July 2004, 07:31 AM
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Originally Posted by r32
I guess some of them dont do much but at least 50% work surely?
i beg to differ.
Old 13 July 2004, 09:48 AM
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The question isn't what do the 100,000 do. The question is what do the 500,000 new civil servants that have been brought in by new labia actually do? That's half a million 'new' jobs.

There are lots that do stuff and there are a hell of a lot of pen&paper pushers who admin the admin who are admining the admins.


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