Living with a diesel for short trips
16 July 2019, 03:50 PM
#1
Living with a diesel for short trips
so im having a bit of a dilemma at the minute as im trying to source a new suv for me and the mrs. i really really wanted a sporty petrol version such as....
jeep srt
jaguar f-pace 3.0v6 supercharged
bmw x5m/50i
range rover sport supercharged
my budget is around £30k but prefer less if im honest, all the petrol models i have seen (or want) are around £35k+ which has led me to start looking at the diesel versions. the problem being is the amount i travel, on a working week over 6 days i do 5 mile each way so barely enough to get it warm. i know short trips are not in favour of the diesel engine so how would i get around it?
perhaps a blast up and down the motorway every few months? if so how long would i need to do it for? 30 mins or 2 hours?
for example the cheapest rr sport supercharged is around £41k through the approved used scheme and the 3.0 v6 diesel is around £30k
jeep srt through jeep is around £40k where a nice diesel version will be around £23k
same with bmw, an x5m is £40k+ where the m50d or a 40d would be around £27k-£30k
i had an e53 3.0d m sport a few years ago and that was pretty much faultless BUT it had no dpf filter.
any ideas guys?
jeep srt
jaguar f-pace 3.0v6 supercharged
bmw x5m/50i
range rover sport supercharged
my budget is around £30k but prefer less if im honest, all the petrol models i have seen (or want) are around £35k+ which has led me to start looking at the diesel versions. the problem being is the amount i travel, on a working week over 6 days i do 5 mile each way so barely enough to get it warm. i know short trips are not in favour of the diesel engine so how would i get around it?
perhaps a blast up and down the motorway every few months? if so how long would i need to do it for? 30 mins or 2 hours?
for example the cheapest rr sport supercharged is around £41k through the approved used scheme and the 3.0 v6 diesel is around £30k
jeep srt through jeep is around £40k where a nice diesel version will be around £23k
same with bmw, an x5m is £40k+ where the m50d or a 40d would be around £27k-£30k
i had an e53 3.0d m sport a few years ago and that was pretty much faultless BUT it had no dpf filter.
any ideas guys?
16 July 2019, 06:25 PM
#2
Girlfriend is having a similar dilemma. Well , she wants a RR Evoque but does same miles as you which i think is mad. Not only for clogging up the DPF but even not benefiting from better MPG makes me wonder whats the point !
Is another option getting the DPF removed ? Not sure if its doable when talking about a 30k car, especially with warrenty etc.
I'm thinking to just go petrol and avoid any grief.
Is another option getting the DPF removed ? Not sure if its doable when talking about a 30k car, especially with warrenty etc.
I'm thinking to just go petrol and avoid any grief.
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16 July 2019, 06:45 PM
#3
Girlfriend is having a similar dilemma. Well , she wants a RR Evoque but does same miles as you which i think is mad. Not only for clogging up the DPF but even not benefiting from better MPG makes me wonder whats the point !
Is another option getting the DPF removed ? Not sure if its doable when talking about a 30k car, especially with warrenty etc.
I'm thinking to just go petrol and avoid any grief.
Is another option getting the DPF removed ? Not sure if its doable when talking about a 30k car, especially with warrenty etc.
I'm thinking to just go petrol and avoid any grief.
16 July 2019, 07:45 PM
#4
Honestly forget the diesel with that mileage I'm tortured with customers DPF associated problems. 99% of the time if there's any faults i.e. heater plugs swirl flaps etc etc the ecu won't allow the vehicle to regenerate which in turn runs into extortionate bills. New MOT rules in May also classes an engine management light as a fail on later vehicles.
16 July 2019, 07:52 PM
#5
Honestly forget the diesel with that mileage I'm tortured with customers DPF associated problems. 99% of the time if there's any faults i.e. heater plugs swirl flaps etc etc the ecu won't allow the vehicle to regenerate which in turn runs into extortionate bills. New MOT rules in May also classes an engine management light as a fail on later vehicles.
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16 July 2019, 09:59 PM
#9
Being honest you’re stuffed. To keep the particulate filter happy the engine HAS to be used long enough for it to get to full operating temperature (which takes at least 20mins depending on ambient temp and heater blower setting...set the heater high enough and the engine will take a lot longer, if at all if it’s cold enough outside and you’ve set it at 28 with fans on high ).
It also has to be driven above 20mph without stopping for at least 15mins after reaching operating temp on a routine basis
If you wait for a fault light to come on it maybe too late to fix by ‘going for a drive’.
That said, we do have a 535d GT it’s now done 95K and is used for local 5miles daily commutes with two trips to and from Spain every year or so. Inbetween that it does airport runs once a month, so far so good,
Although I do believe the DPF maybe getting to the end of its life in terms of ash accumulation as it does regen quite frequently (easy to notice..hot exhaust, cooling fans going flat out). There are cleaning services but results vary, I’ve seen cases where it hasn’t worked as the ash is caked so hard within the filter it won’t just ‘clean out’. Swirl flap motors is also on the fritz, but that doesn’t prevent regens on this particular engine.
BTW: There is no way an Evoque (PSA DW12 engine) will pass the emission test with the DPF removed
It also has to be driven above 20mph without stopping for at least 15mins after reaching operating temp on a routine basis
If you wait for a fault light to come on it maybe too late to fix by ‘going for a drive’.
That said, we do have a 535d GT it’s now done 95K and is used for local 5miles daily commutes with two trips to and from Spain every year or so. Inbetween that it does airport runs once a month, so far so good,
Although I do believe the DPF maybe getting to the end of its life in terms of ash accumulation as it does regen quite frequently (easy to notice..hot exhaust, cooling fans going flat out). There are cleaning services but results vary, I’ve seen cases where it hasn’t worked as the ash is caked so hard within the filter it won’t just ‘clean out’. Swirl flap motors is also on the fritz, but that doesn’t prevent regens on this particular engine.
BTW: There is no way an Evoque (PSA DW12 engine) will pass the emission test with the DPF removed
Last edited by ALi-B; 16 July 2019 at 10:05 PM.
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16 July 2019, 10:18 PM
#10
I’d be dead if I cycled my 5mile route. Tried a few times on occasions, they narrowed a dual carriageway to single and chevron’d the middle with giant refuge islands to protect right turning traffic. So where I could use the left lane and stay out the gutter and vehicles could happily overtake easily in the right lane, now I’m forced to ride in the gutter over drains as HGVs try to squeeze past because what was an overtaking lane is now turning areas with central reservations! Zero endorphins on those journeys!
Last edited by ALi-B; 16 July 2019 at 10:19 PM.
17 July 2019, 11:40 AM
#14
Scooby Regular
Don't even **THINK** about a DPF equipped Diesel if you only do short journeys - its absolute murder for them - if you live on the motorway, or do long commutes they are fine - for just popping to the shops/school/nearby work - absolute nightmare in the making!
17 July 2019, 03:43 PM
#15
ok guys thanks for confirming all of this, the hunt for a sporty petrol suv continues..........
i do like the volvo xc90 t6 r-design
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...1&modal=photos
i do like the volvo xc90 t6 r-design
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...1&modal=photos
18 July 2019, 06:26 AM
#19
Yes its the hybrid. fine for 20 mile journey on electric, but just another petrol for anything further. Completely sold on EV transport now, We placed an order for another Tesla and will sell the Nissan Leaf.. Daughter is selling her little petrol car and using cycle or train to commute. Son is debating selling his Merc A and getting an EV when he finishes uni
18 July 2019, 07:13 AM
#20
Yes its the hybrid. fine for 20 mile journey on electric, but just another petrol for anything further. Completely sold on EV transport now, We placed an order for another Tesla and will sell the Nissan Leaf.. Daughter is selling her little petrol car and using cycle or train to commute. Son is debating selling his Merc A and getting an EV when he finishes uni
An electric future will certainly be a boring one...........
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18 July 2019, 08:19 AM
#22
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Fair enough mate I totally understand why they are pushing for electric BUT I'm not behind it one bit,I'm a petrol head always have been and always will be and the thought of a car that has no soul or character or even a nice sound is not something I wish to be part of. The modified car scene will collapse and so will enthusiast sites and tuning companies.
An electric future will certainly be a boring one...........
An electric future will certainly be a boring one...........
without the proof hes getting a decent proportion from renewables its just virtue signalling
18 July 2019, 08:46 AM
#23
18 July 2019, 10:53 AM
#24
Scooby Regular
cant see many people being in the fortunate position like yourself to be spending $$$$ on electric.............
its also currently only moving the issue further upstream and in the longer term (IMO) it isn't the solution but is going to be just another Government induced **** up like the Wiesel crisis..........
its also currently only moving the issue further upstream and in the longer term (IMO) it isn't the solution but is going to be just another Government induced **** up like the Wiesel crisis..........
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18 July 2019, 01:46 PM
#25
I've nothing to prove, whether my electricity is offset, or supplied by renewable sources. The fact that I've saved over 5000KG of CO2 emissions from running the Leaf is good news to me. Going forward we will save even more on CO2. I was already ahead of most using far less CO2 by having GSHP for our heating hot water needs for the last 12years- And you thought I wouldn't use a green electricity supplier.
Hows your GSHP for running/service/repair costs?
Just bought a house with a IVT GSHP, logged its usage in spring in mild weather with heating set at 18 and just maintaining hot water with barely any use and it guzzled 26KWh of electric a day! That’s in eco mode in mild weather with sanitisation mode disabled - as you are probably aware it periodically kicks in a 9kw immersion element if enabled. So not entirely won over by it, nor the HW recovery/reheat times requiring a absolutely mahoosive thermal store to be able keep enough hot water for more than two bathrooms (500litres IIRC...that’s ignoring the additional 100litre buffer tank for the heating). Also somewhat disappointed that a unit that is so expensive doesn’t have a change-over valve fitted to provide cooling in the summer if wished...a feature fitted on €300 air conditioners
Add to that servicing (to maintain warranty) at ) £250, to which found the compressor run capacitor was leaking (replaced FOC) and it was noted the ground loop circulation pump has already been replaced once on a 3yr old unit.
It has occured to me that the cost of repairing or replacing this thing should warranty lapse, or digging up a group loop should it spring a leak could run up a bill that could cover the installation of several oil boilers!
Suffice to say as I’m re-renovating the house to my standards/taste I’m also pre-plumbing for a more conventional fossil boiler (Propane or oil) to act as auxiliary to go in the garage to provide backup heat, and possibly boost HW recovery rates and maybe sanitize the hot water if the 9kw immersion proves too costly to run if electric prices increase. The alternative plan is to install a Lister CS configured as a CHP generator providing electric and heat off whatever fuel I run it on (they aren’t that fussy so long as its filtered and passed through a water/separation trap).
Anyway, I digress
Shrek: How about a Lexus RX?
Got to admit not my cup of tea, and can look tatty underneath on older models but the ones I have driven and worked had very little to fault them on, especially when some were over 10trs old and had over 150k on the clock!
Last edited by ALi-B; 18 July 2019 at 01:49 PM.
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18 July 2019, 07:21 PM
#26
Hows your GSHP for running/service/repair costs?
Just bought a house with a IVT GSHP, logged its usage in spring in mild weather with heating set at 18 and just maintaining hot water with barely any use and it guzzled 26KWh of electric a day! That’s in eco mode in mild weather with sanitisation mode disabled - as you are probably aware it periodically kicks in a 9kw immersion element if enabled. So not entirely won over by it, nor the HW recovery/reheat times requiring a absolutely mahoosive thermal store to be able keep enough hot water for more than two bathrooms (500litres IIRC...that’s ignoring the additional 100litre buffer tank for the heating). Also somewhat disappointed that a unit that is so expensive doesn’t have a change-over valve fitted to provide cooling in the summer if wished...a feature fitted on €300 air conditioners
Add to that servicing (to maintain warranty) at ) £250, to which found the compressor run capacitor was leaking (replaced FOC) and it was noted the ground loop circulation pump has already been replaced once on a 3yr old unit.
It has occured to me that the cost of repairing or replacing this thing should warranty lapse, or digging up a group loop should it spring a leak could run up a bill that could cover the installation of several oil boilers!
Suffice to say as I’m re-renovating the house to my standards/taste I’m also pre-plumbing for a more conventional fossil boiler (Propane or oil) to act as auxiliary to go in the garage to provide backup heat, and possibly boost HW recovery rates and maybe sanitize the hot water if the 9kw immersion proves too costly to run if electric prices increase. The alternative plan is to install a Lister CS configured as a CHP generator providing electric and heat off whatever fuel I run it on (they aren’t that fussy so long as its filtered and passed through a water/separation trap).
Anyway, I digress
Shrek: How about a Lexus RX?
Got to admit not my cup of tea, and can look tatty underneath on older models but the ones I have driven and worked had very little to fault them on, especially when some were over 10trs old and had over 150k on the clock!
Just bought a house with a IVT GSHP, logged its usage in spring in mild weather with heating set at 18 and just maintaining hot water with barely any use and it guzzled 26KWh of electric a day! That’s in eco mode in mild weather with sanitisation mode disabled - as you are probably aware it periodically kicks in a 9kw immersion element if enabled. So not entirely won over by it, nor the HW recovery/reheat times requiring a absolutely mahoosive thermal store to be able keep enough hot water for more than two bathrooms (500litres IIRC...that’s ignoring the additional 100litre buffer tank for the heating). Also somewhat disappointed that a unit that is so expensive doesn’t have a change-over valve fitted to provide cooling in the summer if wished...a feature fitted on €300 air conditioners
Add to that servicing (to maintain warranty) at ) £250, to which found the compressor run capacitor was leaking (replaced FOC) and it was noted the ground loop circulation pump has already been replaced once on a 3yr old unit.
It has occured to me that the cost of repairing or replacing this thing should warranty lapse, or digging up a group loop should it spring a leak could run up a bill that could cover the installation of several oil boilers!
Suffice to say as I’m re-renovating the house to my standards/taste I’m also pre-plumbing for a more conventional fossil boiler (Propane or oil) to act as auxiliary to go in the garage to provide backup heat, and possibly boost HW recovery rates and maybe sanitize the hot water if the 9kw immersion proves too costly to run if electric prices increase. The alternative plan is to install a Lister CS configured as a CHP generator providing electric and heat off whatever fuel I run it on (they aren’t that fussy so long as its filtered and passed through a water/separation trap).
Anyway, I digress
Shrek: How about a Lexus RX?
Got to admit not my cup of tea, and can look tatty underneath on older models but the ones I have driven and worked had very little to fault them on, especially when some were over 10trs old and had over 150k on the clock!
Our electricity bills are about £1500-1800 a year. We dont have gas or oil. We have either been lucky or its a decent system. Ive had two issues outside warranty. The soft start unit burnt out. I sourced and replaced myself. The second issues which is the first time its happened. When we were in Aus last year tbe system was shutdown for extended time. I found the ground loop had lost alls its pressure, first time in 12 years.
Due to mine being USA built and with unusual pipe unions, there was no facility to re pressure the system easily. It has thermo couple micro holes in the large connectors. I made up a temporary feed loop with a stainless needle inflator. I re pressurised the system and it held. So I assume the seals had dried out letting air into the system. I researched a few designs and forums- which led me to fit an autoair bleed valve, fill loop and expansion vessel to stabilise the ground loop pressure .
It seems common practice now for installation companies to install a manifold box outside to service and have access valves to pipework for the field. Mine hasn't any of these, but has run very well all these years- touch wood
I never took up service agreement, because its a lot for not much worth.
If my system fails, I will plump for air source.
We have underfloor on both floors and well insulated house. No radiators throughout house. Our gshp heats the water tank upto 50 degree s, only used back up element two or three times in 12 years
Edit. Oil and gas are being rapidly phased out. In a few years all new builds and retro fit repairs will ban fossil heating. Its either airsource, gshp, electric or solar or combination to meet SAP and building regs
Last edited by andy97; 18 July 2019 at 07:29 PM.
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