Russian mig downed by Turkey
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Russian mig downed by Turkey
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=bfe_1448354227
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34907983
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34907983
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From: Notts
russia has been pushing the boundrys for a while now so had to happen sooner or later, just depends now if its an excuse for more russian land grabbing.
Worrying thing is the retoric, actions and sentiments of russia are very comparable with germany before ww2
Worrying thing is the retoric, actions and sentiments of russia are very comparable with germany before ww2
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This is the start of many more issues to come regarding Russia's military intervention backing Assad. They weren't bombing IS but Turkey backed rebels on the Turkish border so it was inevitable Turkey would protect it's own interests.
There is going to be more and more airspace conflict as the West increases it's campaign and moves into Syrian airspace where the Russians are heavily active.
There is going to be more and more airspace conflict as the West increases it's campaign and moves into Syrian airspace where the Russians are heavily active.
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I heard an interesting comment on the TV yesterday. Russia lost 20 million citizens, military and civillian, in WW2 to what they see as a conflict caused by Western aggression. This statistic was quoted as a reason for their subsequent persistent cold war attitude to anything associated with the West.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
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From: Notts
I heard an interesting comment on the TV yesterday. Russia lost 20 million citizens, military and civillian, in WW2 to what they see as a conflict caused by Western aggression. This statistic was quoted as a reason for their subsequent persistent cold war attitude to anything associated with the West.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Russia have a alot to answer for as far as war crimes in WW2 so i have little sympathy for them claiming to be aggrieved by it
But if that is their POV then you can see where their hostility comes from.
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other thing to point out is Russian held talks with germany to divide polland between them before the start of ww2 and for the first. It wasnt untill Germany then turned on them and began operation barbarossa that russian and german started fighting.
Kinda pints a different picture on the whole 'western' aggression thing considering they started it as well
o wasnt having a go matey, just saying about it.
other thing to point out is Russian held talks with germany to divide polland between them before the start of ww2 and for the first. It wasnt untill Germany then turned on them and began operation barbarossa that russian and german started fighting.
Kinda pints a different picture on the whole 'western' aggression thing considering they started it as well
other thing to point out is Russian held talks with germany to divide polland between them before the start of ww2 and for the first. It wasnt untill Germany then turned on them and began operation barbarossa that russian and german started fighting.
Kinda pints a different picture on the whole 'western' aggression thing considering they started it as well
You are right about pot calling the kettle black, the Ruskies have a lot to answer for. Had the Germans not got greedy the Russians would have been in it doing a bit of land grabbing for themselves.
I heard an interesting comment on the TV yesterday. Russia lost 20 million citizens, military and civillian, in WW2 to what they see as a conflict caused by Western aggression. This statistic was quoted as a reason for their subsequent persistent cold war attitude to anything associated with the West.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Made by the actor Mark Rylance.
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Russia already does flights to deliberately test our response. Would it ever come to an engagement, i doubt it but would depend on how far russia pushed.
In reality i don't think it will ever come to a 3rd world war, russia is too vulnerable, doesnt have the funds and in a modern world only really america could stand on its own.
Russia will just push as far as they can get away with.
I heard an interesting comment on the TV yesterday. Russia lost 20 million citizens, military and civillian, in WW2 to what they see as a conflict caused by Western aggression. This statistic was quoted as a reason for their subsequent persistent cold war attitude to anything associated with the West.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
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From: Notts
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From: K
I heard an interesting comment on the TV yesterday. Russia lost 20 million citizens, military and civillian, in WW2 to what they see as a conflict caused by Western aggression. This statistic was quoted as a reason for their subsequent persistent cold war attitude to anything associated with the West.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Not saying it's right or justifiable, just repeating what was said. But if it's correct it explains a lot.
Russia did not exists as a separate country in WW2 - it was the Soviet Union
so that figure would have included places like Georgia, The Ukraine etc etc
but the point is correct - the soviet union lost many many millions - and it has to be said some ruthlessly sacrificed by Stalin
but nevertheless a common theme amongst old Russians is that WW2 was won with Russian blood
I am not sure of the UK, US and French causalities but they were tiny in comparison
This is not the first time Russia has deliberately encroached on air space they're not entitled to use, they do it to the UK all the time. I don't think this action by Turkish forces would have been taken without the greatest consideration as to what the consequences might be, but having had previous incidents such as this and then warned the crew of this Mig ten times (apparently), can you blame them for enforcing their rights?
a pedantic point - but worth noting
Russia did not exists as a separate country in WW2 - it was the Soviet Union
so that figure would have included places like Georgia, The Ukraine etc etc
but the point is correct - the soviet union lost many many millions - and it has to be said some ruthlessly sacrificed by Stalin
Russia did not exists as a separate country in WW2 - it was the Soviet Union
so that figure would have included places like Georgia, The Ukraine etc etc
but the point is correct - the soviet union lost many many millions - and it has to be said some ruthlessly sacrificed by Stalin
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From: Notts
a pedantic point - but worth noting
Russia did not exists as a separate country in WW2 - it was the Soviet Union
so that figure would have included places like Georgia, The Ukraine etc etc
but the point is correct - the soviet union lost many many millions - and it has to be said some ruthlessly sacrificed by Stalin
but nevertheless a common theme amongst old Russians is that WW2 was won with Russian blood
I am not sure of the UK, US and French causalities but they were tiny in comparison
Russia did not exists as a separate country in WW2 - it was the Soviet Union
so that figure would have included places like Georgia, The Ukraine etc etc
but the point is correct - the soviet union lost many many millions - and it has to be said some ruthlessly sacrificed by Stalin
but nevertheless a common theme amongst old Russians is that WW2 was won with Russian blood
I am not sure of the UK, US and French causalities but they were tiny in comparison
then shot 160,000 that retreted/deserted.
They gave little to no care to try and keep their men alive. Theie fighting strategy was based purely on win by attrition.
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From: K
agreed on both points
but Stalin was pushing for a second front in 1942/3, the Americans where quite keen too
Churchill played a rather Machiavellian game by insisting on a push through Italy - his tactics where often framed by the deep desire to keep the Empire
Stalin did have a point when he complained that allies dragged their feet
but Stalin was pushing for a second front in 1942/3, the Americans where quite keen too
Churchill played a rather Machiavellian game by insisting on a push through Italy - his tactics where often framed by the deep desire to keep the Empire
Stalin did have a point when he complained that allies dragged their feet
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Sounds like the pilots survived the ejection, but were killed by Syrian rebels (who are allegedly the CIA backed ones) whilst parachuting down...
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-1...-turkish-media
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-1...-turkish-media
Last edited by Petem95; Nov 24, 2015 at 02:53 PM.
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From: Scoobynet
US-backed rebels have also shot down a Russian rescue helicopter with a US supplied anti-tank missile now
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-1...i-tank-missile
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-1...i-tank-missile
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From: Notts
US-backed rebels have also shot down a Russian rescue helicopter with a US supplied anti-tank missile now
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-1...i-tank-missile
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-1...i-tank-missile
looks very staged to me
