NEILB1

iTrader: (9)

Acording to this magazine they got an extra 14hp by fitting a fmic with no remap, now from reading various posts on here and else were i was under the impression you have to have one when fitting something like this,

Seems they also fitted a induction kit with no remap, i am baffeled

https://www.scoobynet.com/767407-jap...ler-kit-6.html

Rob Day

iTrader: (78)

It does seem a little strange, but without reading the whole thread nor reading in depth into the magazine feature maybe they didnt do a thorough comparison test, maybe all the bhp runs were on the RR's where the tmic didnt get a good breath of fresh air and yet the fan supplied ample to the fmic?!?! or the car was idling for a while with the tmic getting hot prior to the run, thus the lower fmic wouldnt get quite as hot?

Either way you would expect a remap for sure. I certainly wouldnt risk it for a longterm conversion. For a quick test for a mag feature fine..... not for everyday use or track time

NEILB1

iTrader: (9)

think they should of stated that before ppl go and bang a fmic on and make a fair bit of trouble for them selves

ScoobyForLife27

iTrader: (14)

Hi Neil. Don't know about FMIC but I'm running K&N 57i IK on my Classic Sti for about 1 year with no remap and I've had no issues at all. Also fitted custom made heat shield to separate hot air coming from engine bay, felt quite difference after that. Especially on cold days - colder air = Better response on acceleration.
Hope this help a bit.

NEILB1

iTrader: (9)

thanks but everyone i have spoken to says i will have to have a remap no matter what, i woulkd like to put a fmic on one week and another month a induction kit but will need a remap every time i add something to the engine lol, Best prob buying everything and putting it on in one go and then a remap

dont know if the newage and classic are set up different or the newage is a bit more delicate

pinkypurkhardt

iTrader: (9)

i fitted a kn typhoon kit on mine just before duncan remaped it and it was running very very lean on the first run obvious duncan did his magic and its fine now

NEILB1

iTrader: (9)

my point

4ndy

iTrader: (7)

Ran a couple of my old classics (MY94 and MY98) on K&N 57i induction kits, fmics and de-cats with no remaps, never had any problems.
I've been out of scooby circles for a few years and now, come back and everyone pipes on about remaps if de-catting, induction kits and now for a fmic install, never once had a scooby engine go on me in past and ran them hard with mods above, back in the days of PECCYs mad derbyshire evening tours, lol

pinkypurkhardt

iTrader: (9)

i think that newages are more delicate when it comes to things that will make it run lean

4ndy

iTrader: (7)

People need to buy a nice classic then, Simples !

STI Glenn

To do it properly all Scoobs need a remap ,to get the max out of it

Knighty99

iTrader: (1)

well worth the re maps though, on my old 95 wrx i had a a pipercross air filter fitted, FMIC and a full HKS supper dragger exust and went from 265 mapped to 305.......

budd

iTrader: (5)

The fact is you don’t HAVE to get your car re-mapped after a major change like FMIC, de-cat , induction kit etc, nobody will insist on it, it’s not mandatory, and there are plenty of owners who will be happy to tell you ‘their car is fine’ and in some cases this may be true the ECU may just be able to adapt the fuelling to compensate, however in all cases it is wise to at least get the fuelling checked, even something like fitting a catch tank can change the fuelling.

At the end of the day it’s all about personal choice some people are prepared to risk it and don’t bother, after all the damage done is usually a long term thing and the car won’t fail immediately but after a few 1000 miles when the cumulative effects finally cause something to break.

Re magazines tests / project cars etc I tend to treat all results with a big pinch of salt, the need for interesting articles and advertising revenue could be seen to influence the outcome in not entirely an unbiased fashion.
Sure magazines are great for reference, checking other cars spec lists is great fun and often shows a common trend in how Imprezas react to tuning, but I feel the best way to approach tuning is in a logical, step by step approach decide what you want, how much your prepared to spend and set a realistic time scale for the proposed mods.
It’s all to easy to buy your new car and right away start looking at the myriad of tuning options, when in fact the most sensible course of action would be to get the car properly serviced, make sure it is basically sound before embarking on a series of mods that will undoubtedly cause problems on a car in less than tip top shape.
I know spending £250 on a FMIC is much easier than spending the same on a through service or to remedy basic wear and tear issues but getting the basics right will reap dividends long term.

My own car isn’t a daily driver so I can leave it sitting on the drive till all the bits are on (swirl pot, exhaust, air filter, 3 port solenoid etc ) and when the spec is finalised it will be mapped and that will be that, in theory the remap should get it all running nice and safe, I realise it’s difficult for owners who use their cars everyday, and the temptation is to do mods one at a time but by far the best way to assemble all the bits chosen and get it all fitted and mapped in one go, that way your going to see the best , safest results for your hard earned.

But as I said at the beginning it’s up to the individual, nobody is forcing you to do anything, people often believe everything they read and a 14hp gain with a FMIC is very tempting and I sure lots of people reading the article will think it’s worth the risk, but it’s not there is a reason that Scoobynet, NASIOC etc repeat the remap mantra because it’s the only way to be sure.

T0M HV

you dont need a remap.. but it will help get the most from the mods.. easy.

Tidgy

you can't simply say you do or you don't need a remap.

no doubt you get the best results from having a remap, but the question is will it be running safe with the change in airflow?

unless you get it checked out you won't know. If the increased airflow makes it run dangerous afr you need a map, if not well your choice.

just blanket saying its ok with out is asking for engines to go bang.

Jamz_

iTrader: (12)

Front mount on mine, without a remap (for now)... had it checked out on dyno and was running fine, but to get the most out of it (and more mods) I'll be getting a remap...

My car is running 310bhp on a standard ECU

Pervy_Paul

Shame you have to break into it at times tho Jamz How is the track car now fella?

NEILB1

iTrader: (9)

newage ?

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi Neil best bet is fitting everything what you want fit before are you going on remap(injectors,FMIC,turbo,induction kit,decated exhaust etc.),drive off the boost to your mapper.

NEILB1

iTrader: (9)

this is what i was going to do fella, but was seeing why they fitted it without a remap

jura11

iTrader: (7)

I run several month without remap decated exhaust,FMIC and induction kit,without the issue.But i never have courage for RR days

Jamz_

iTrader: (12)

What i get for leaving the key for the door 250 miles away Its alright atm, away for winter, gonna strip some more out of it, and add my new bits ive got sat in the house and a remap

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

The chances are they will gain more power through lower charge temps, BUT the car will most likely be running leaner, perhaps dangerously so in which case it'll most likely result in piston damage. At the very best, it won't run optimally without a remap.

Every Subaru tuner I spoke to said the same thing when I was looking into an FMIC. You NEED to get it remapped; don't drive it on full boost until then.

Look at it this way: They're wrong and you're 500 quid down and have a car that'll run better with the FMIC, even if it would have been "ok" without

You're wrong and you'll do some internal damage to your engine and be looking at 3k for a rebuild!

Re-map every time!!!

Ns04

nick type r

iTrader: (2)

I got an extra 30bhp from FMIC and K&N. 310 mapped to 340. Well worth a remap if you ask me.

dunx

iTrader: (3)

Many cars are fine without a re-map, mine was quicker after I fitted the FMIC, but once mapped it was MUCH faster, and more economical too !

dunx

Scooby Arthur

iTrader: (2)

My car was underfueling alot after fitting the induction kit, would not liked to have run it without a remap.

Broxi

iTrader: (11)

I am bassing this on Past experiences on 93-95 Impreza's i have modified and this is at least 5 different cars. all had previously been on Rolling road at engine Tuner.

I have fitted Induction Kit FMIC, open neck Decat downpipe and full decat back, walbro 255 fuel pump.

all vehicles were running safe before and after the fitting of these modifications.

What some people seem to forget is your car has a MAF to calculate the amount of air flow. So if you are running a FMIC the maff sees this extra air and uses your O2 Sensor to calculate the correct fueling.

On the rolling road at aj's after their was no running lean on any of the vehicles now had been mapped.

However i have to say this cannot be said for every car, as their afe many factors that can cause issues.. The service condition of the vehicle for on. worn plugs can provide weak spark worn / failing maff old tired fuel pum / Injectors etc etc..

Yes you can fit these parts and not need a remap.. is it safe to do??? IMO yes as long as your car is well maintained. However it's always advisable to have your car checked on a rolling road by means of a diagnostic power run to confirm all is well. I would expect this to cost £30 - £60 for peace of mind.


I have also in the past Fitted to my own car a 2.5 engine with the same Mods as above, running the standard Injectors but with a FSE regulator, TD06 20G Turbo and standard unmapped ECU. this was checked at Aj's and also found to be running spot on.

I have since changed to a Simtek ECU to get the most om my modifications, something you will never achieve if you do not Map..

4ndy

iTrader: (7)

So for the sake of fitting an induction kit to your newage, you went to the expense of a remap, am I reading into this wrong ?

Mark82

iTrader: (3)

while we are on the topic of remaps are they or can they be expensive?
never had one done before, sorry to hijack the thread,

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The M@trix

What some people seem to forget is your car has a MAF to calculate the amount of air flow. So if you are running a FMIC the maff sees this extra air and uses your O2 Sensor to calculate the correct fueling.

It's not quite that simple, mate. I'm quoting user Splitpin (very knowledgeable about ECU mapping) here:

"Fitting the front mount will require you to remove the standard induction tract - and therefore you will need to reflect the alterations in mass airflow to sensor voltage scaling, or the open loop mixtures will go to pot."

And now I'm quoting Harvey who has about as much experience as anyone when it comes to FMIC fitting

"Fitting an efficient FMIC without a remap is foolhardy. You MIGHT get away with it but there is a chance you will not and nipping a piston in the bore from weak running or destroying an engine from DET is an expensive experience and a hard learned lesson.

What is certain is that without a remap you will only achieve partial performance from your set up. Why spend money to improve performance, accept only a partial gain and create a risk situation that threatens the well being of your engine?

The more mods you have the more essential the remap with the FMIC.
Surely the best course is to save up until you can afford an ECU or re-map. Far more sensible and probably cheaper with more enjoyment in the long run.

The reason for fitting an FMIC is to reduce charge temperatures. A colder charge is denser and requires more fuel. Because of the FMIC the shape of the map will also be somewhat different and without proper mapping you will have increased lag and delayed spool."