Why is fuel surge called 'fuel surge'
#1
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
And then you **** yourself big time, and start looking for all sorts of excuses as to why it happened
[Edited by Dave T-S - 11/6/2002 8:23:49 PM]
[Edited by Dave T-S - 11/6/2002 8:23:49 PM]
#2
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Bradford
Posts: 13,720
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Please don't start a fight/debate or I'll report this thread to the mods!
I just want to know why fuel surge is called what it is because if you look up the word 'surge' in a thesaurus it says stuff such as 'flow' and 'rush forward' My understanding of the word is that if you said, 'there was a surge in water levels' it would mean there was a sudden 'increase'
My experiences of this problem have involved the engine pretty much stalling because of an apparent lack of fuel and I can't see how an increase in fuel would cause a problem. Its no doubt my lack of grasp of English but I thought I'd ask just to be sure I wasn't missing something
I just want to know why fuel surge is called what it is because if you look up the word 'surge' in a thesaurus it says stuff such as 'flow' and 'rush forward' My understanding of the word is that if you said, 'there was a surge in water levels' it would mean there was a sudden 'increase'
My experiences of this problem have involved the engine pretty much stalling because of an apparent lack of fuel and I can't see how an increase in fuel would cause a problem. Its no doubt my lack of grasp of English but I thought I'd ask just to be sure I wasn't missing something
#4
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Class record holder at Pembrey Llandow Goodwood MIRA Hethel Blyton Curborough Lydden and Snetterton
Posts: 8,626
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
yep basically the fuel surges to one side of the tank, you experience the effects of fuel surge if the line is on the other side.
Trending Topics
#10
Subaru Tuning Specialist
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: 7.74 @179 mph 1/4 mile - road legal
Posts: 6,654
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
A stated previously it is the surging of fuel in the tank to one side which causes a starvation at the fuel pump pick up point.
An Impreza fuel pick up is on the drivers side of a wide fuel tank which straddles the propshaft.
When you corner to the right the fuel 'surges' to the left side of the tank, the fuel pump draws in air and the fuel pressure to the engine drops causing the power to cut instantly.
The effect is actually worse than just lifting off the throttle. If the throttle is open then the engine braking is greater due to the pumping losses.
Andy
An Impreza fuel pick up is on the drivers side of a wide fuel tank which straddles the propshaft.
When you corner to the right the fuel 'surges' to the left side of the tank, the fuel pump draws in air and the fuel pressure to the engine drops causing the power to cut instantly.
The effect is actually worse than just lifting off the throttle. If the throttle is open then the engine braking is greater due to the pumping losses.
Andy
#15
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (48)
Exactly as Andy says but you can also get it under hard straight line acceleration when at low fuel levels. The fuel in the tank surges to the rear away from the pump pick up causing a temporary loss in acceleration. There is no danger of stalling unless the clutch is depressed but even then fuel flow is restored as soon as the cornering force or acceleration reduce.
#16
I thought there were baffles within the tank to prevent this?
Also: When I had the GTIR I fitted a resevoir just before the fuel pump to prevent this. Dunno if you can do the same on the scoobies?
Also: When I had the GTIR I fitted a resevoir just before the fuel pump to prevent this. Dunno if you can do the same on the scoobies?
#17
Scooby Regular
I still don't understand why you'd get this on a long sweeping bend though.
I've only ever had this sort of problem pulling away sharply or going around a roundabout whilst running on (literally) vapours (i.e. praying that I can make it to the petrol station with 2 litres of fuel left).
In 3.5yrs of Scoob ownership, I've never had this at any other time, including fast driving with low fuel levels (i.e. warning light on).
Only times I've heard folk complaining is hard-rights, quick launches, hairpins after heaving braking (i.e. Knockhill). In fact, those who mentioned getting this at Knockhill haven't said they got it at any other corner other than the hairpin.
Stefan
I've only ever had this sort of problem pulling away sharply or going around a roundabout whilst running on (literally) vapours (i.e. praying that I can make it to the petrol station with 2 litres of fuel left).
In 3.5yrs of Scoob ownership, I've never had this at any other time, including fast driving with low fuel levels (i.e. warning light on).
Only times I've heard folk complaining is hard-rights, quick launches, hairpins after heaving braking (i.e. Knockhill). In fact, those who mentioned getting this at Knockhill haven't said they got it at any other corner other than the hairpin.
Stefan
#18
Subaru Tuning Specialist
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: 7.74 @179 mph 1/4 mile - road legal
Posts: 6,654
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
The reason many people have not experienced this on corners is because it is most likely to occur when you are on the power fairly hard ie needing lots of fuel flow and pressure. Knockhill hairpin is the type of corner you turn in then give it plenty to get round the uphill corner !
The inlet filter to the fuel pump also acts as a sort of reservoir, it absorbes probably a few seconds worth of fuel. This is why you don't always get the 'surge' effect instantly ie you may be able to accelerate hard in 1st then it bogs in second as the air gets through to the pump.
Andy
The inlet filter to the fuel pump also acts as a sort of reservoir, it absorbes probably a few seconds worth of fuel. This is why you don't always get the 'surge' effect instantly ie you may be able to accelerate hard in 1st then it bogs in second as the air gets through to the pump.
Andy
#20
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: 32 cylinders and many cats
Posts: 18,658
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
K/hill hairpin is the only place I got it too, except when I had one of the early Walbro uprated fuel pumps when we did not know to use the original pickup which is longer.
And it isn't really THAT unsettling to the car it just dies like a slow version of fuel cut. I'm not too worried about it becuase if you have a high enough lateral g like the knockhill hairpin you are not flat out around it, it is when you floor it onto the straight that it happens after a second or two. It has that slow dying swan oh **** my engine has blown, but then it comes back and you carry on chasing whatever you were chasing (or in my case accelerate away from the driver behind who caught me in the corner but hasn't enough power to pass on the straight - well some of them like Andy F and those Mitsoobi$hi things )
And it isn't really THAT unsettling to the car it just dies like a slow version of fuel cut. I'm not too worried about it becuase if you have a high enough lateral g like the knockhill hairpin you are not flat out around it, it is when you floor it onto the straight that it happens after a second or two. It has that slow dying swan oh **** my engine has blown, but then it comes back and you carry on chasing whatever you were chasing (or in my case accelerate away from the driver behind who caught me in the corner but hasn't enough power to pass on the straight - well some of them like Andy F and those Mitsoobi$hi things )
#24
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: 32 cylinders and many cats
Posts: 18,658
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Andy mine is already in MY sweet zone thanks very much LOL.
I was logging yesterday and had an 830 mV lambda reading on full load and thought of you and smiled The lambda sensor was hot though. Will be using the wideband to get it right with the 550s and induction kit which both mess it all up a bit.
I was logging yesterday and had an 830 mV lambda reading on full load and thought of you and smiled The lambda sensor was hot though. Will be using the wideband to get it right with the 550s and induction kit which both mess it all up a bit.
#25
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Bradford
Posts: 13,720
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I get surge all too easily I think? I'm surprised by the number of people that have never had it?? Hmmmm? Maybe I'm just particularly brutal!
The difference with the knockhill hairpin is by the time your likely to get surge the speed must be pretty low (sorry don't know KH that well but I'd guess maybe 40mph) At the time I got it I was doing twice that which is maybe why the effects were so much more severe?
The difference with the knockhill hairpin is by the time your likely to get surge the speed must be pretty low (sorry don't know KH that well but I'd guess maybe 40mph) At the time I got it I was doing twice that which is maybe why the effects were so much more severe?
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Mattybr5@MB Developments
Full Cars Breaking For Spares
28
28 December 2015 11:07 PM
Mattybr5@MB Developments
Full Cars Breaking For Spares
12
18 November 2015 07:03 AM
Pro-Line Motorsport
Car Parts For Sale
0
27 September 2015 11:19 AM