subfreak

anybody tried both these products for a comparison?If not what is the benefit of chip swap against manual controller?

Katana

The price..

subfreak

Well yes but forget about that for the time being!

Katana

I think the Prodrive ECU thingy can map your fueling too. But since Imprezas run rich anyway, I'd go for the Dawes. Its simple and it works and thats all that matters to me..

David_Wallis

what year is your car...

David

[Edited by David_Wallis - 7/29/2002 4:44:29 PM]

ozzy

Well, the good Dr Banks went from PPP to Dawes+PPP, to Dawes + FCD to EcuTek 3.

I've only tried PPP and Tek3 myself and was VERY disappointed with PPP. The PPP is very conservative and only boosted to around 15/16psi on my car.

I've seen cars Deltadashed with just a Dawes and (as long as you don't go mad with boost) were running very well. From the ones I've seen going from nowt to Dawes, there were no worries reported on the Deltadash software at all.

I'd go for the Dawes first, then if you want more consider a Tek re-map. (unless you want to keep your warranty).

Stefan

Katana

I've got an MY93 boosting at 21 psi and its still rich.

mega_stream

Which one is kinder to your engine though?
Which one is totally bypassing the safety threshold of the ECU?

I ran a Dawes for a month or so, the increases for the money were fantastic, but you've gotta ask youself is it worth running the risk (plus you're always tempted to give it another 1/2 turn)

I'm by no means an expert on this, I've heard that running an AFR and FCD gives you more of a cusion from damage running a Dawes or similar manual device, I guess its a you pays ya money type thing..

ozzy

Katanna ya nutter

ozzy

Well from what I've been told, even the PPP mapping is debatable in some parts of it's map.

AFAIK, all the safety features of the ECU are still in-place

John would tell us what the risks, but he's on his hols this week; lucky beggar

Stefan

Katana

Ozzy, yeah I'm a nutter.

But to be honest, it shouldn't really matter to my engine or turbo as its a closed deck block and i've got a larger turbo. As long as the fuelling is okay, it shouldn't be that bad.

Devil's Refugee

I've just come from having a Dawes to a Tek3 mapping.
Have to say, the Tek3 delivers the boost really smoothly and I'm chuffed that the fuelling seems to be mapped accurately too.

Both gave similar power over standard and the car is currently running 17.6psi at the mo.

subfreak

My car is 02WRX and has dawes fitted running 16.5psi which is noticable but everytime i speak to people that have had PPP fitted they say its changed the car but i would say the dawes has given it an edge but thats about it?I felt more gain from Magnex sytem and downpipe!

ozzy

To be honest, what you need to do is try them out (both if possible).

People's perceptions are very easily influenced. I've heard people tell me how wonderful the PPP is and how it transformed the car, 2nd gear was like 1st, 3rd was like 2nd, etc....

But having lived with a PPP for 3 months, I don't agree. Did it improve the std MY99 - yes. Was it a lot? no.

Upping just the boost with the Dawes will get you that increase in performance, but a re-map (like the PPP or Tek) will give you the same or more (for a Tek3) and make the car deliver the power more smoothly and more efficiently.

I'm going to try a Dawes myself to see what it's like, but after testing a Tek3 with John, I'm still planning on going that route in a couple of months. Yes, it's more expensive than a Dawes, but it's just as safe as a PPP (IMHO) and way much better VFM.

Stefan

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

The Dawes on my MY99 was excellent fun, but like Stefan I'm moving to a Tek3 from John during August.

I don't think you can beat the vfm.

Cheers
Richard.

Dizzy

How do you know you've got a closed deck block?

More on potential failures though.. whats likely to let go? I thought head gastkets are much more likely to let go that the actuall block. Can't too much boost raise the inlet temps by too much and therefor melting pistons even if you are overfueling? Mind you after seeing a MY94 WRX engine (that wasn't a closed deck btw) with a cosworth piston that had let go I'm much more conservative.

I'm just about to pop the Dawes on mine now i've the the AFM on and may get a FCD later (as fuel cut on mine is about 1.1 bar iirc).

Katana

Lets not start this debate again.

Anyway, my WRX is not only a first gen Impreza, but one of the first few to be manufactured. This was when Subaru still used closed deck blocks as standard. Its only the later models that they started using the open decked one to cut on cost. Besides, thats what the breakers told me.

Turbo_Steve

Hey Katana?
(BTW 21 PSI is Still crazy boost!)

Does this mean mine is a closed deck block too?
And more to the point can I run 21PSI of boost?

And then can I try against you at Santa Pod?
(and yes, I DO know you will win)
(and NO I haven't got my bumper fixed yet )

CHRIS_D

off topic-

but while you two are here (turbo-steve/katana)

are you going up to santa pod on sunday still?

Turbo_Steve

Unlikely: Start my new job on Monday and I have a hole in my windscreen the exact size and shape of my head at the moment. And no money to fix it with.

(In fact, the car is frankly a bit of a state at the moment)
Sorry.

NOTE TO ALL: ALWAYS remember to bolt the drivers seat back in.

David_Wallis

Turbo_Steve

Yeah.
Let's just say ouch was not the first word I used.

I only moved the car up the road to be out of the way of the builders, too.

Now whose idea was it to put the seatbelt-clips mounted on the seat? =fume=

ozzy

You trying to get into the Darwin awards or something ya nutter.

Glad your OK.

Stefan

Turbo_Steve

Thanks dude. It wasn't so bad: Just a light tap.
Very very humiliating: made me wish I had persevered with the seat the night before when it was getting dark.

To add insult to injury, later that day I was putting the car back on the driveway and scraped the rear bumper on the brick gatepost. Really really was a bad day all in all. Katana saw the crack in my bumper from earlier that week too.

I will be buying shares in my local bodyshop very soon.


So: Anyone else managed to run 21PSI without rupturing anything?

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

I've tried cars with both the Dawes and PPP. The dawes was good for the money and certainly gave a bit of the wow factor, but if you commute a lot then the power delivery could get you down. The DD delivers all the grunt in an oof-on manner, which can be tiresom in traffic.

I tried a PPP ECU'd car next and the power level was similar in total but the delivery was smoother and lower. This made it great in traffic and fun out of roundabouts and hairpin bends.

Both examples were with de cat DP, which IMHO makes a whole lot of difference.

My conclusion is that although the PPP is 15 times more expensive in some cases, it makes for a better car and that's what you want at the end of the day isn't it?

F