supersai101

As some of you know I have been learning and remapping my own Subaru. For me anyway, the process takes a long long time (mainly because I'm still learning) but even pros take some time, on the rollers or on the road, logging data, making fine adjustments then trying again until it is setup perfect for the car.

Now, most people charge around £300 for an open source map which after doing it myself, think is a very good price considering how much work is involved. (Although I suppose if you had a set of base maps to start from after doing it for a while it would make it a lot faster).

I keep seeing on facebook people offering remaps for as little as £100. I assume they buy maps from a dealer and just flash them to the car. My question is, without actually road tuning / logging any data, how can these maps be safe / work with every car? I'm guessing if your car is modified then these maps won't work.

On-the-bog

Some makes are fine with flash maps, subaru's its a big no no.

supersai101

Oh yeah. I would never use one of these maps, I really enjoy remapping my car myself. Just curious as to how the system work. When the company writes these maps for people to flash. Do they have a car of that make and model to work on? Seen on one website it says you send them a file they have someone tweek it and send it back to you within 20 minutes :/

On-the-bog

typically manufacturer maps are pretty gentle to allow for tolerances. They're prob a tad over safe so leave a bit of head room. Turbo cars have more to gain because you can increase the boost as well

supersai101

Yeah I suppose if the car is relatively standard and there are big safety margins then these could work well for someone who just wants a bit of extra poke out of their car. But I would always be sceptical of a map going on a car without any checking of det, fueling etc afterwards.

On-the-bog

for some reason some other makes of cars work well with them. no idea why some do and some dont tbh

boosted

Beacause other a lot of other makes have far more complex engine management systems, VAG for example use proper wideband closed loop and closed loop knock control, far superior To the jap stuff. These systems adapt and get on with it

bludgod

iTrader: (3)

as boosted says, a lot of the german/other marques are using bosch ECU's and a lot more advanced sensor setups. The ECU table layout is entirely different from what you'd see on a subaru so it's a lot easier to get improved generic results. That being said, you'll still see better results in most cases getting a tailored map for your TDI/TFSI car compared to an off the shelf job.

with the subarus, the only comparable would be the prodrive map which is still kinda generic but only really applicable to a stock car as once the exhaust restrictions come out they tend to drive worse than a standard map until they are tweaked. You can make some simple adjustments to a standard map and see small gains, but regardless of if you do the tune yourself or have someone e-tune it you should still be checking the AFR's with a wideband (because the stock sensor isn't usable) and confirming the non-existence of det with your own knock sensing equipment. You won't get anywhere near that level of attention to detail with a 100 quid off the shelf flash and go remap - it's not just the base map that saves you time it's also knowing what to look for when things aren't going right. That's where the years of experience from an expert mapper like Andy Forrest, Bob Rawle, Duncan Graham or the late JGM comes to light (first set of names I could think of not promoting or excluding anyone there!).

As you know from mapping your own car now, you understand a bit more of the process and the theory but even if you had a base map to start with if it wasn't running right on your car or the AFR was swinging wildly/inconsistent boost etc. it's the specialist experience and in-depth knowledge is what you are bringing to the equation with having an expert on hand. Some chap with a kess slave clone bought off ebay will never come close, that being said there are always those who are drawn in by the price so you pay your money and you takes your chances.

supersai101

Great explanation bludgod!

Yeah I completely know what you mean about experience is important. When I am mapping and something isn't doing what I want, I end up spending hours researching before trying again, and if that doesn't work, repeat until it does. An experienced mapper would know what to do there and then.