911

Have an Sti v3 with 407 x 340 motor, runs a stock trans.
I seriously hill climb the car and it all works well so far.
Wanting to run Avon slicks next year (forward planning or what?!)

Thinking of a v7 trans from an Sti v7 with rear diff and lsd's

How do the ratios compare to my Sti v3 trans (4.11 diffs)

I drive it to and from the events and do about 3000 miles a year as a weekend warrior car.

Welcome any thoughts.

Graham.

Tim-H

I have the jdm 6 spd dccd box in a 96 sti RA, very nice box, ratios are similar to the original RA`s close ratio`s with an extra gear on top, best of both worlds, afair just over 21 mph per 1000 rpm in top( very good on motorway`s etc) , I already had a rear (3.9) plate dif , Not sure if they all have , Mine with dccd also has a "suretrack" front dif as standard, which after you have got used to the feeling that someone has undone your steering bolts, does work very well, (feel`s a bit like a very soft quaif atbd) I was going to go for the active dif controler but have never got round to it,
If you use a top mount intercooler you may have problems , due to the size of the box filling the tunnel up, restricting air flow, it is also a lot heavyer than a 5 spd, but the weight being so low , did not seem to do much damage, also dccd would allow you to do rear wheel burn out`s, To get some well needed heat into those avon`s :-) ( won`t they put you up with the quatro`s ? )
any q`s or if you are up round Hereford way, give me a shout and I take you for a ride in it,
Have a good one
Tim

911

Excellent info Tim, much appreciated.

Graham.

FB Tuning

iTrader: (30)

I've put a jap 6 speeder in the girlfriends MY00 UK car.

Gearing took a while to get used to after coming from a UK 5 speeder,especially finding the right gear for the speed when coming down the box.
The car feels like it's got a bit more urgency on WOT due to the closer ratios.

IMO, 1st gear on the jap spec box is a bit of a waste of time - There's not much time to make any boost, and before you know it, you've bounced it off the limiter.

As mentioned above, you can certainly feel the extra weight on the front of the car. - The standard Subaru 4 pots feel inadequate when braking hard, due to that extra weight. - I've got a set of Alcons sat in the garage to replace them

AFAIK, the jap spec boxes have steel selectors, as opposed to the Ally ones on the UK box (i may be wrong though?) - An educated guess says the steel ones are more resilient to wearing/bending

If you want to be 'king of the 1/4 mile' you may be better off with the longer ratios of the UK box, for less gearchanges

Enjoy fitting it - I had fun with it, on my own, on Mum's gravel drive, with the car precariously high on axle stands, bits of wood, 2 trolley jacks, engine crane over the top round the bell housing.... - You probably get the picture

Richard

911

Richard, I have been there 4 times now, but in a double width garage...

Do people think the UK 6 speeder ratios are = to the Sti v3 ratios and the Jap 6 speeder = RA spec generally?

Bothered about the weight gain too.

Parr gearsets start to become more attactive!

Graham.

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

i have a jdm version 8 box in my car and i think my car accelerated quicker with the 5 speed RA gearbox in

colin c

Graham, speak to Pavlo he does some nice gear sets for the 5 speed box, should be stronger than the 6 speed and you can specify your ratios. 2 of the 3 quickest cars at Scooby shootout were running these gear sets

911

Colin:
Have looked at Pavlo's site already and it reads well.
As you say, the quickest cars there were running those gearsets.
I need synchro, but I'm ok with a little trans noise due to the gear form; but the real crunch is the cost (no dig at Paul), plus the fitting into the trans case etc.

IIRC, the Zen gearsets are about 2 x that of a Jap 6 speeder, maybe 3 x if you take the instal into the box cost.
You do save on the rear diff etc though.
Other bright side to the 6 speeder is the lsd's you get which is part of the need for me in the hill climb context, grip and robustness to tolerate slicks.

Have you experience of the Sti v3 level trans on 4.44 diffs and very sticky 200mm wide slicks?
It is running realy well so far with the semi slick Kumho V70A's, but real slicks are another matter...(drag starts etc)

Graham.

Peanuts

iTrader: (15)

G,
I thought the PPG gearsets were on about a par with a 6 speed conversion, maybe a little less.
Ive gone for an sti5/6 box with a P1 rear diff, if/when I have to uprate the gearset I was going to go with PPG and maybe stick a UK (longer) 5th in.
Andy

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Erm...IIRC, one of the three was running a PPG dog kit (Andy's) and the other two (Paul's and Mark's) were running Parr/PPG hybrids...

Graham, PPG kit from Zen for the 5 speed appears to be £2 226.63 to this you need to add the cost of building (£300-500) plus any bits that need replacing like syncros, bearings, selector forks etc...so budget for 3k all in...how much is a 6 speed going to cost? bearing in mind the compromised ratios, extra weight etc...

911

I can buy a 6 speder with prop/rear diff/shifter/crossmember on a pallet delivered to my door for £1400
A weekend of hard labour later I can drive it on the road.
For he £1000 I save i can buy the Lateral paddle clutch and a lightened big diameter flywheel.
If I'm lucky then I get the 'lsd' diffs also!

To the 5 speed gearset you need to add the clutch assy too.

Negative is the weight, but seems little else?

Thanks to all for the thoughts.

Graham

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

its the extra weight that will make all the difference as they are about 30kgs heavier. thats why im assuming my car feels slower now. but since i have it in place im looking at a bigger engine and turbo rebuild nothing too silly just about 420/450lbs

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Graham, 1400 is a damn good price at the moment...I paid 1500 for my Type UK 6 Speed and another 80 for a prop...still looking for a gear **** though

Forgot to say you need to add 600 to the 5 speed price for an ATB Quaife/Modena front diff...

I'd still rather have the 5 speed, but I just couldn't afford it at the time so the 6 speed was the only thing I could consider....

Peanuts

iTrader: (15)

no matter how hard I try I cannot find anywhere who will discount a Quaife diff!?!
me suspects "illegal" price fixing is going on

911

A cartell in motorsort? Never!

It all comes down to cost and practicality.

The 30 Kg is in a good place in the chassis, I have 407 x 340 at the moment and if I go to a 2.5 then all is well for 450x400.

The bullit-proof 5 speeder is a big cheque job and I doubt that I can justify the cost (and that 30Kg is not that important)

Interesting chat.

Graham

Tim-H

I presume on that price it is a non dccd ? Mine was around £2500, as a "full kit" with suretrack/dccd, although like Tim no Gear-**** !!!!
1 small thing to watch for when fittting, With mine (96 sti ra) the front driveshaft seals were a slightly different size, only by about a mm, didn`t notice till fitted of course, refitted old one`s (well new one`s old spec, ) all ok, (6spd one`s were bigger dia)
Have a good one
Tim

Tim-H

just had this mail, from www.rallyusedparts.co.uk thats what you want in the front :-) but you may have to learn to drive without putting your thumbs in the steering wheel lol ,

Keyword Location Description Price Contact
details
Subaru plated front dif N Ireland Plated front diff from a 96/97 impreza. Still in gearbox - 2nd gear broken cwp unknown but can strip and check if interested. poa. call stephen. - 07980 885410
stephen@crosslandtankers.com

have a good one
Tim-H

911

Thanks Tim!
For the £1400 it is a non dccd, but I'm ok with that as I've hill climbed now for 3 years in the Sti v3 no probs really, except the lsd side is rearing it's head with 407 bhp.
Graham.

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

Graham, when did you get that price?

The weight difference is only 20kg, not 30kg.

Try a modena front diff?

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

oh, and unless you get would need to go above 105mph (7500rpm) or 111mph (8000rpm) on the hill climb, then you will NOT need 5th gear in either the JDM or UK box.

Gears 1 to 4 are identical on both boxes.

JDM gearboxes are to my knowledge, quicker on the quarter mile, due to the lower step up from 4th to 5th, so more in the peak power zone.

Unless your rev limit is above 7250, you will most likely have to go into 5th on the quarter mile (power dependant), as 7250 is 100mph in 4th.

Pavlo

Yeah the PPG is expensive, sorry guys. If you want a gearset for the 6 speed it's even more!

john banks

Gearboxes are never cheap IMHO, if they are they may well be crap...

I don't like spending money, but I paid £3000 on a new 6 speed, then £1100 to fix it 23000 miles and 18 months later for a repair and refresh. They are not bulletproof on modified cars with high torque, mileage and hard use. Pay bottom money and you might get a rotter is all I can say, and I detest gearbox fitting/removal, I've been aching all week from the ******* bruises.

All that is before I even mention the previous 5 speed stuff that was rebuilt twice in a very short time before lasting 2000 miles after running in a new engine for 1000 miles.

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

John, after paying out all the money that I have on Osteopathy for a mangled back you soon learn to take things mor slowly and also make things to help fitting a gearbox more easily

Made a cracking cradle out of 2x6 that with the car on axle stands was low enough to allow me to roll the 6 speed under the car and then jack it into place with three trolley jacks...went on a treat, and in the end it was quicker to make the cradle and fit the box than it would have been to have two of us rolling around under the car breathing hard trying to lift the bloody thing into place

john banks

Have a gearbox cradle jack already, still a complete nightmare to get the box forward a bit, up a bit, engine back to get on the bell housing.

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

John, I like blocks of wood, have loads of them kicking around in my garage, the make useful spacers, wedges etc...I used a 9 inch (roughly) long block to wedge between the engine and the slam panel to tilt the engine back on an angle, and using 3 jacks it allowed us to angle the gearbox too, pretty much slid straight on

David_Wallis

John,

Theres an art to fitting boxes.. shouldnt take you more than 10-15 mins to get it in and bolted up

john banks

You heroes

Why aren't you there when the work is being done

David_Wallis

John, it comes with practice and brute force.. Putting the engine at the correct angle and turning the crank pulley helps

APIDavid

iTrader: (4)

On the cost of gearboxes subject, here's a transcript of a conversation I had a week or two ago.

Me; ' Morning, APi ', ' Hallo is that David?, Oh good, I've broken 4; 5 speed gearboxes in as many months and I'm fed up, what can you do for me?

[ Car is a WRX @97 /98 MY ] ' Well a recon box with a warranty is £650 plus VAT.' ' Oh!, I didn't want to spend that much'. ' Well, I might be able to do a used guaranteed one for £400 or so', ' Didn't want to spend that much either - haven't you got anything around £200 ??'................... Click, Brrrrrrrrrr.

David APi Impreza / APi Engines
www.apiengines.com

john banks

And I thought I was tight! The "Southerners" trying to sell me stuff tell me I am