Mini Cooper 109 BHP/ton

WRX 118 BHP/ton limited to 4000 RPM with higher drivetrain losses and a tight engine would be probably 10% less power at wheels than the Mini.

Then factor in the Mini on 16" wheels (like a lot have) and consider its lower weight, good brakes, roll resistance and high lateral g and it is not surprising.

Give me a dry twisty road and an equally skilled/unskilled driver and I would take on a WRX in a Mini Cooper S and I would expect win. Simple - lower weight and more power at the wheels.

[Edited by john banks - 6/3/2002 5:34:43 PM]

 

I quoted for the Cooper. Then I said I would take on a WRX with all its revs available with a Cooper S. Evo magazine says 109 bhp/ton, but the Mini website says 102 and 143 for the Cooper and Cooper S. Still I'd take the Cooper S over a WRX. The 8% loss in PWR will be made up for by the other factors including drivetrain losses.

[Edited by john banks - 6/3/2002 6:25:22 PM]

 

Following a car is easier than leading, the only advantage of leading is the lack of stones peppering the paintwork and windscreen .

Nigel

PS Isn't the WRX 158bhp/ton?
PPS I am a bad driver

[Edited by nigelward - 6/3/2002 7:24:15 PM]

 

It depends on where you own personal safety limit is set as you drive - I can't say I judged the speed around this bend with great skill but it felt appropriate at the time. Once the ABS comes on it does lengthen your stopping distances (I don't mean cause and effect, but they feel a lot longer if the ABS does come in - if you were to be able to brake up to the limit of lock up and keep it there it seems to stop much better), but I still underestimate the acceleration and braking of this car. That is a good thing as it leaves that margin for the unexpected, however, 1.5 car lengths suggests I don't underestimate it quite as much as I used to and I was about to take the gap between the polo and the transit to give me another 2 car lengths to stop in but thankfully didn't require it. A lot of the time things do not happen "suddenly" it is merely poor observation, but on this occasion with it being uphill as well there was no vis until you were right on it. Mental note to self - I drive quite fast enough around bends thank you very much even if I am a wuss. Those who have slipped on diesel would agree I think. Leave it for the track.

[Edited by john banks - 6/4/2002 6:14:28 PM]

 

Hmm just re-read that and it sounds as if I'm saying it is as quick. It's not, there is no way it's faster in a straight line, but if you throw in some continuous bends I'm sure it would suprise a few people just how good the cooper can be. Obviously coming out the other side of the bend is a different matter. The scooby would leave it standing.



[Edited by Fullonloon - 6/5/2002 1:07:52 PM]

 

I had a new Mini (BMW) giving me some grief today. You know, right up my ****, twisty road which I know well. I`m still running my motor in so I have limited the revs to 4000. So after a while I was a little peeved by his actions and thought I would loose him on the twisty bits, (very sharp bends, up to 60 deg), and a narrow road. I couldn`d lose him! I didn`t think my motor a 2002 wrx rolled much but it did at the speeds we were doing. Do I consider a high speed driving course or Eibacs?. For information I have been driving sports cars of all types for over 40 years. I think perchance I must be losing my grip in me owd age.
Bob

 

I'd just get used to it mate, I keep up with scoobs in my Fiesta

Bob

 

LOL @ BobT

You wish!

Rich

 

Richi, those Fiesta S's (or whatever they're called do handle well!!!).

Active Bob ( ), no offence m8 but I've driven both and there is no way I could keep up with me driving a WRX in the Cooper. I think a driving course would be a good 1st step....

Matt

 

Activ,

I think probably.

a. You are not used to four wheel drive handling.
b. 4000rpm limit.

If you enter a corner too fast the scoob will just roll and understeer, seems like it doesn't handle at all.
Try entering the corner slower and as soon as the front ends turned in give it some 7000rpm. (Once its run in )

Lee

 

If I were restrained to 4000rpm, I'd lose to most hot hatches driven to their limits. The STI7 is at least 3 times faster acceleratively above 4000rpm than it is below.

 

Don't worry about it too much it's all about how much risk your willing to take. I had a race against a vehicle once on the twisties in the VTS and really stuggled to work into a position where I could overtake. I wasn't prepared to take big risks and the guy in front was having the fight of his life not to loose it but he still held me at bay for long enough..........the vehicle was a Citroen Berlingo van With tools clattering around in the back

 

I wouldn't beat yourself up about it.

1. The mini driver may well be a better driver, but necessarily.
2. The new Mini Cooper is very composed through the corners (I had a go of one - much less body roll than my MY00 Impreza.)
3. The road itself - unless you were prepared to give it an all out attack (rally style) - a very narrow, very twisty road may well limit the differences between the cars.
4. (As Saxo said) How brave/stupid each driver was prepared to be.
5. Your running in 4000rpm limitation (presumably you were in at least one gear higher than you'd have liked to be.)

A driving course is a great idea - so might be the suspension mods.
Do you need them? - that's up to you to decide

Whatever - enjoy the car


Rich

 

According to driven a bit back they said the new mini was better handling than the evo 7..... im not to sure about this buy they said it was really good.... i know hat i would rather have.... and its not made by BMW..

Dan

 

standard, I reckon the new mini would easily keep up (handling wise) with a standard scoob, I personally havent driven a mini, but a couple of my friends have driven both & were well impressed.

 

DodgeT, You are joking?

 

Thanks for the comments, all noted, making me think a bit more! Keep them comming as it makes interesting reading other peoples experiences and comments on mine, critisyms or otherwise.
Bob

 

4 wheel drive can only do so much, in the tight twisties a hot hatch would not be much slower. I owned both a clio 16v and the Pug 1.9 gti, both would have been quite happy sat behind a scoob. It would be a different story on a road where the corners are not so tight however. Just to make my point, look how close the Citroen 2wd rally cars are to the WRC monsters on the tarmac rallys!

 

He never says it's a Mini Cooper S, you've assumed that! Statistically it's more likely to be a less powerful model.

 

unless i'm getting my figures wrong the Cooper has 102bhp/ton and the Cooper S has 142 bhp/ton.

 

As John says, you don't want to take a scoob on a very tight twisty road, on really tight corners (<45mph) my old VTR was actually quicker than my scoob, fairly tight corners (<80mph) they were much the same, sweeping bends and the scoob was marginally faster. On back roads an Impreza's advantage is putting the power down out of the corner where a powerful 2WD car will spin its wheels.

BTW, it is always easier to be following behind a car than the other way around.

 

As mentioned a couple of times already, Should be able to lose most things coming out of the corner. Late braking(dependent on brake size), then get the Scoob coming out the bend & floor it. Not much could stay with you until the next bend. Also depends on how much of a nutter (or local) you've got behind you.
My m8 could quite easily keep up with me in my Scoob on twisty roads in his v40 volvo. Mind you he does rally as a hobby!!!
alasdair

 

Sounds like you are driving a bit "gay" around the corners.

 

It does bother me when I read stuff like "the AWD drive saved the day" etc, it seems some people thnk they can stuff a Scoob into any bend at any speed and the AWD will see them through to the other side! ( not having a go at anyone btw)

I've been on a few runs with Scoobs now and know for a fact, on the twisties I can quite happily sit behind all day The straights though, well they're a different story altogether

If you want witnesses, stick a post up in Northen

Bob

 

155 bhp/ton, but he was limited to 4000 RPM.

 

Who cares! Does anyone's head turn for a mini or even another driver glance at you enviously in a little monstrosity?

 

Isn't the whole point that attention is unwelcome?

 

Woah, now you've got me really worried. We've got someone on here saying a VTR (note, the 8v not the VTS) can beat his scooby round corners under 45mph and be about the same until 85mph!! Exactly how many corners do you take at over 85mph on british roads???? I thought the whole point of a scooby was that they waste warm and even hot hatches (with comparible drivers) round the twisties. Since joining scoobynet I've been told that scoobies aren't straight line machines, now your saying there mince round corners too. So................er............what do they do???

 

I've found that Mini's get arsey with me and want a race. Took one on a couple of days ago. It wasn't much of a contest. I knew the roads. He didn't. Wish they wouldn't get so jumpy. Mini's handle well, but have no punt.

M.

 

Saxo Boy, I was talking about actual speed around the corner, (so whether the hatch is 8V, 16V or even a 200cc 2V car makes no odds to actual cornering speed) a scoob absolutely destroys destroys a car wih less acceleration out the other side of the corner.

I'd rather not reply to your question regarding how many corners I take at over 85mph but as a hint it takes me about an hour longer to get between Glasgow and Inverness in the westie than it did in the scoob (westie is uncomfortably windy above 85)

At no point has anyone said an Impreza is mince around corners, there are very few cars I have been in that can corner quicker than my VTR could, I had countless remarks from passengers about it appearing to be on rails.

As for the strong point of an Impreza: its ability to go point to point very quickly with very little driver effort in almost any conditions. IMHO (in UK Turbo spec) it is the ultimate safe family car.