Engine blow ups
03 October 2013, 09:50 AM
#31
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Why not leave the mapping threads to those that actually know what they are talking about and have something interesting to say?
Give it some thought (should be a long wait
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03 October 2013, 10:47 AM
#32
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Surely people are allowed their own description of what happens to their cars? And their choice of adjective to describe what has happened is bound to be coloured by many things, available budget to fix it and the severity (in their experience) of what has happened. To some people with a lack of mechanical knowledge or perhaps running a high performance car on a tight budget, a HG failure is as good as a 'blow-up' because they might struggle to get it fixed for any number of reasons. Whereas someone who tracks their high power mega-buck build car would accept a HG failure as 'just one of those things'.
Just because their choice of language doesn't fit in with what you accept as a 'blow-up' doesn't mean they haven't suffered what to them is a catastrophic failure.
Is it really necessary for an engine to be completely destroyed for it to warrant the term 'blown-up'? Isn't a melted ring land or knocking bearing the first symptom of what will inevitably become a full on 'blow-up' if left unattended?
We're not talking about nuclear devices here, just the kind of language people use to describe a mechanical failure.
And if they think their failure was caused in some way by a faulty map, a Spanish Inquisition style thread like this one will serve no purpose in establishing the truth.
Because they plainly don't know the truth.
03 October 2013, 12:24 PM
#33
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Lol , tidge you keep telling this story
I really didnt want this turning into another bloody boring mapping thread , but it seems most seem to think that most cars blow up because of bad mapping
Even though we've got stories above of plenty of blow ups on vehicles that can't even be mapped
So it's not , age / fatigue , poor oil/ maintenance , driving without mechanical sympathy, mods done by clueless folk , poor fuel quality ,poor quality parts from Subaru ?
It's all caused by bad mapping ,,, now come on !!
I have spoke to Kev and he also pointed summat else out about the trials and tribulations of mapping , there's two sides to every story and one of the reasons I wouldn't go into mapping as a profession , even if my name was tony pat simon Duncan bob h the third , and I was the most talented experienced mapper the world has seen
Ok mappings responsible you say ,,,, how ?
Let's take classics
O/S is not available for classics , so you've ruled out what you would call true amateurs for starters
So that leaves , after market ecu , ecutek , esl and the like
Anyone who's fitting anything like this is not gonna be clueless
If they are it makes a total mockery of what's been said on previous threads
If your fitting these parts /mapping and keep blowing cars up your gonna be asking some serious questions , to yourself and suppliers
Ecutek , superior support , maps and back up , your gonna refer back to them
After market , " hey Steve I've fitted these ecus and cars are blowing "
Esl , the same , ect , ect
So if your fitting /using these parts your gonna be asking questions Long before you've blown 7 cars or more , even for your own piece of mind if not the customer
Now newage
Same above applies but with the addition of o/s and true DIY mapping
But the added advantage of a very smart ecu
The chances of mapping a new age so wrong that instant damage will occur is slim
It will soon tell you something's wrong and will do all it can to save things
It'll pull back and try and save the motor whenever poss
That's not to say you couldn't get it drastically wrong , but if it was that wrong it would become apparent during mapping and even a total cabbage would know summats wrong
I got sent a map recently to cast my eyes over and it was ****e , didn't even have to look past the timing and fueling to see it was so wrong
The car was running on it and as far as I know hadn't blown up , some might say they were suprised it didn't , it was probably just pulling back and trying to save itself
So there's my points as to why I don't believe that mapping is the biggest contributing factor in blow ups
Now I'm gonna finish my coffee and take the dog out
I really didnt want this turning into another bloody boring mapping thread , but it seems most seem to think that most cars blow up because of bad mapping
Even though we've got stories above of plenty of blow ups on vehicles that can't even be mapped
So it's not , age / fatigue , poor oil/ maintenance , driving without mechanical sympathy, mods done by clueless folk , poor fuel quality ,poor quality parts from Subaru ?
It's all caused by bad mapping ,,, now come on !!
I have spoke to Kev and he also pointed summat else out about the trials and tribulations of mapping , there's two sides to every story and one of the reasons I wouldn't go into mapping as a profession , even if my name was tony pat simon Duncan bob h the third , and I was the most talented experienced mapper the world has seen
Ok mappings responsible you say ,,,, how ?
Let's take classics
O/S is not available for classics , so you've ruled out what you would call true amateurs for starters
So that leaves , after market ecu , ecutek , esl and the like
Anyone who's fitting anything like this is not gonna be clueless
If they are it makes a total mockery of what's been said on previous threads
If your fitting these parts /mapping and keep blowing cars up your gonna be asking some serious questions , to yourself and suppliers
Ecutek , superior support , maps and back up , your gonna refer back to them
After market , " hey Steve I've fitted these ecus and cars are blowing "
Esl , the same , ect , ect
So if your fitting /using these parts your gonna be asking questions Long before you've blown 7 cars or more , even for your own piece of mind if not the customer
Now newage
Same above applies but with the addition of o/s and true DIY mapping
But the added advantage of a very smart ecu
The chances of mapping a new age so wrong that instant damage will occur is slim
It will soon tell you something's wrong and will do all it can to save things
It'll pull back and try and save the motor whenever poss
That's not to say you couldn't get it drastically wrong , but if it was that wrong it would become apparent during mapping and even a total cabbage would know summats wrong
I got sent a map recently to cast my eyes over and it was ****e , didn't even have to look past the timing and fueling to see it was so wrong
The car was running on it and as far as I know hadn't blown up , some might say they were suprised it didn't , it was probably just pulling back and trying to save itself
So there's my points as to why I don't believe that mapping is the biggest contributing factor in blow ups
Now I'm gonna finish my coffee and take the dog out
03 October 2013, 12:40 PM
#34
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Between myself, my dad and my best mate we've seen 4 ej20's off. 3 sti's and a UK spec
1 blown hole in piston (pic) stock ecu, breather mods, red lined in 5th n let go, we think due to lack of fuel in cylinder 4
1 cracked piston. maped by jgm, believe 4th injector starved of fuel same as above
Combo of hg failure and bottom end. Type r with breather mods stock ecu, think was maped for 100ron in japland with aggressive timing, we think 98ron wasn't up to the job
1 bottom end (UK spec) Rb5 wr. driven hard all its life, 70k in and shells had enough, good innings for such an abused engine in all fairness.
Now I wouldn't say any of them 'blew up'!
But one did blow a hole in a piston.... And another did blow a hole in the headgasket...... Damn I gota stop thinking about blowing, I'm getting horny! Lol
I've always wanted to shoot a rod through a bonnet so I still mess around with scoobies!
Last edited by tom-r33; 03 October 2013 at 12:53 PM.
03 October 2013, 12:51 PM
#35
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03 October 2013, 01:02 PM
#37
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03 October 2013, 01:17 PM
#38
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Here ya go let go from 20min @ 120mph piston in two pieces squashed the rod and snapped the bottom of the rod off where it meets the crank putting a fairly large hole in the block
Oh and the car still drove and ticked over lol
Oh and the car still drove and ticked over lol
Last edited by mark type ra; 03 October 2013 at 01:19 PM.
03 October 2013, 01:48 PM
#39
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Not entirely understanding the point of the thread...but yes I have suffered catastrophic failure.
Snapped a rod, put broken end through the top of the block, piston hit the head and bent two valves. MY00 with an AFP 18g and full supporting mods (Apexi ECU).
Following a car dawdling along at 60 on a dual carriageway, WOT in fifth and BANG! All my fault, fitted a 3" exhaust and didn't get the map tweaked. Boost spike killed it.
Snapped a rod, put broken end through the top of the block, piston hit the head and bent two valves. MY00 with an AFP 18g and full supporting mods (Apexi ECU).
Following a car dawdling along at 60 on a dual carriageway, WOT in fifth and BANG! All my fault, fitted a 3" exhaust and didn't get the map tweaked. Boost spike killed it.
03 October 2013, 02:06 PM
#40
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As in all things, the less chaps know about a piece of machinery, the fewer words they'll use to describe its demise.
What actually happened;
Chasing Astra VXR on the by pass. Loss of power, slight at first. Foot still firmly planted as you don't want the Astra to get away with it. The power loss increases, along with engine noise. Still keeps foot down as you're nearly alongside him and the GF won't be impressed if he beats you to the Maccy D roundabout. The noise suddenly gets louder, followed by severe power loss and steam coming out of the bonnet vents. You come to a shuddering stop with a horrific banging noise as the engine breathes its last. You sit in silence, listening to hissing and gurgling as the Astra speeds away. GF not impressed. You open the bonnet. There is oil and steaming water all over the shop. Of course you realise that the bearings have suffered a failure of oil retention due to too much clearance. The subsequent lack of pressurised oil film has allowed the bearing surface to come into contact with the crank journal. The resulting hammering has loosened the shell clips, and the shells have spun in the rod. Naturally the resulting unlubricated friction has caused total siezure and the rod has snapped, poking through the top of the block, taking the alloy water cross feed with it. You close the bonnet, fully aware that not only has your engine failed, but the GF won't be as obliging as she might have been previous to the breakdown miles from home. People sat in Maccy D's munching undercooked fries are staring and pointing as your car appears to be on fire.
What he said happened;
"Me motor blew up"
What actually happened;
Chasing Astra VXR on the by pass. Loss of power, slight at first. Foot still firmly planted as you don't want the Astra to get away with it. The power loss increases, along with engine noise. Still keeps foot down as you're nearly alongside him and the GF won't be impressed if he beats you to the Maccy D roundabout. The noise suddenly gets louder, followed by severe power loss and steam coming out of the bonnet vents. You come to a shuddering stop with a horrific banging noise as the engine breathes its last. You sit in silence, listening to hissing and gurgling as the Astra speeds away. GF not impressed. You open the bonnet. There is oil and steaming water all over the shop. Of course you realise that the bearings have suffered a failure of oil retention due to too much clearance. The subsequent lack of pressurised oil film has allowed the bearing surface to come into contact with the crank journal. The resulting hammering has loosened the shell clips, and the shells have spun in the rod. Naturally the resulting unlubricated friction has caused total siezure and the rod has snapped, poking through the top of the block, taking the alloy water cross feed with it. You close the bonnet, fully aware that not only has your engine failed, but the GF won't be as obliging as she might have been previous to the breakdown miles from home. People sat in Maccy D's munching undercooked fries are staring and pointing as your car appears to be on fire.
What he said happened;
"Me motor blew up"
03 October 2013, 02:13 PM
#41
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As in all things, the less chaps know about a piece of machinery, the fewer words they'll use to describe its demise.
What actually happened;
Chasing Astra VXR on the by pass. Loss of power, slight at first. Foot still firmly planted as you don't want the Astra to get away with it. The power loss increases, along with engine noise. Still keeps foot down as you're nearly alongside him and the GF won't be impressed if he beats you to the Maccy D roundabout. The noise suddenly gets louder, followed by severe power loss and steam coming out of the bonnet vents. You come to a shuddering stop with a horrific banging noise as the engine breathes its last. You sit in silence, listening to hissing and gurgling as the Astra speeds away. GF not impressed. You open the bonnet. There is oil and steaming water all over the shop. Of course you realise that the bearings have suffered a failure of oil retention due to too much clearance. The subsequent lack of pressurised oil film has allowed the bearing surface to come into contact with the crank journal. The resulting hammering has loosened the shell clips, and the shells have spun in the rod. Naturally the resulting unlubricated friction has caused total siezure and the rod has snapped, poking through the top of the block, taking the alloy water cross feed with it. You close the bonnet, fully aware that not only has your engine failed, but the GF won't be as obliging as she might have been previous to the breakdown miles from home. People sat in Maccy D's munching undercooked fries are staring and pointing as your car appears to be on fire.
What he said happened;
"Me motor blew up"
What actually happened;
Chasing Astra VXR on the by pass. Loss of power, slight at first. Foot still firmly planted as you don't want the Astra to get away with it. The power loss increases, along with engine noise. Still keeps foot down as you're nearly alongside him and the GF won't be impressed if he beats you to the Maccy D roundabout. The noise suddenly gets louder, followed by severe power loss and steam coming out of the bonnet vents. You come to a shuddering stop with a horrific banging noise as the engine breathes its last. You sit in silence, listening to hissing and gurgling as the Astra speeds away. GF not impressed. You open the bonnet. There is oil and steaming water all over the shop. Of course you realise that the bearings have suffered a failure of oil retention due to too much clearance. The subsequent lack of pressurised oil film has allowed the bearing surface to come into contact with the crank journal. The resulting hammering has loosened the shell clips, and the shells have spun in the rod. Naturally the resulting unlubricated friction has caused total siezure and the rod has snapped, poking through the top of the block, taking the alloy water cross feed with it. You close the bonnet, fully aware that not only has your engine failed, but the GF won't be as obliging as she might have been previous to the breakdown miles from home. People sat in Maccy D's munching undercooked fries are staring and pointing as your car appears to be on fire.
What he said happened;
"Me motor blew up"
03 October 2013, 02:24 PM
#42
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03 October 2013, 06:09 PM
#46
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**** your Scooby net , I'm not the one that started the mapping bollocks on this thread I was just interested in blow ups , I've helped more folk on here in my short time in both time and financially and have gained very little in return other than comments from useless ****wits like f1 fan , let clever ****ers like him carry on helping folk out , not that I've seen him actually do much , ****in *****
I'm out
I'm out
03 October 2013, 06:22 PM
#47
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**** your Scooby net , I'm not the one that started the mapping bollocks on this thread I was just interested in blow ups , I've helped more folk on here in my short time in both time and financially and have gained very little in return other than comments from useless ****wits like f1 fan , let clever ****ers like him carry on helping folk out , not that I've seen him actually do much , ****in *****
I'm out
I'm out
sounds like jimmyinrugby. Everyone has their own description of motor failure. The most common being, it's blown up. Now put the dummy back in kidda !!
03 October 2013, 06:24 PM
#48
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**** your Scooby net , I'm not the one that started the mapping bollocks on this thread I was just interested in blow ups , I've helped more folk on here in my short time in both time and financially and have gained very little in return other than comments from useless ****wits like f1 fan , let clever ****ers like him carry on helping folk out , not that I've seen him actually do much , ****in *****
I'm out
I'm out
03 October 2013, 07:03 PM
#49
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It's an open forum geeza, anyone can post or say pretty much anything, unfortunatley a lot of ***** appear to be spending time doing just that on here at the moment
03 October 2013, 09:17 PM
#50
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**** your Scooby net , I'm not the one that started the mapping bollocks on this thread I was just interested in blow ups , I've helped more folk on here in my short time in both time and financially and have gained very little in return other than comments from useless ****wits like f1 fan , let clever ****ers like him carry on helping folk out , not that I've seen him actually do much , ****in *****
I'm out
I'm out
Priceless, now that's a blow up
03 October 2013, 09:29 PM
#54
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Major components such as pistons were pretty much unrecognisable! If you're gonna do it, might as well do it in style I guess!
03 October 2013, 09:35 PM
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03 October 2013, 09:36 PM
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As in all things, the less chaps know about a piece of machinery, the fewer words they'll use to describe its demise.
What actually happened;
Chasing Astra VXR on the by pass. Loss of power, slight at first. Foot still firmly planted as you don't want the Astra to get away with it. The power loss increases, along with engine noise. Still keeps foot down as you're nearly alongside him and the GF won't be impressed if he beats you to the Maccy D roundabout. The noise suddenly gets louder, followed by severe power loss and steam coming out of the bonnet vents. You come to a shuddering stop with a horrific banging noise as the engine breathes its last. You sit in silence, listening to hissing and gurgling as the Astra speeds away. GF not impressed. You open the bonnet. There is oil and steaming water all over the shop. Of course you realise that the bearings have suffered a failure of oil retention due to too much clearance. The subsequent lack of pressurised oil film has allowed the bearing surface to come into contact with the crank journal. The resulting hammering has loosened the shell clips, and the shells have spun in the rod. Naturally the resulting unlubricated friction has caused total siezure and the rod has snapped, poking through the top of the block, taking the alloy water cross feed with it. You close the bonnet, fully aware that not only has your engine failed, but the GF won't be as obliging as she might have been previous to the breakdown miles from home. People sat in Maccy D's munching undercooked fries are staring and pointing as your car appears to be on fire.
What he said happened;
"Me motor blew up"
What actually happened;
Chasing Astra VXR on the by pass. Loss of power, slight at first. Foot still firmly planted as you don't want the Astra to get away with it. The power loss increases, along with engine noise. Still keeps foot down as you're nearly alongside him and the GF won't be impressed if he beats you to the Maccy D roundabout. The noise suddenly gets louder, followed by severe power loss and steam coming out of the bonnet vents. You come to a shuddering stop with a horrific banging noise as the engine breathes its last. You sit in silence, listening to hissing and gurgling as the Astra speeds away. GF not impressed. You open the bonnet. There is oil and steaming water all over the shop. Of course you realise that the bearings have suffered a failure of oil retention due to too much clearance. The subsequent lack of pressurised oil film has allowed the bearing surface to come into contact with the crank journal. The resulting hammering has loosened the shell clips, and the shells have spun in the rod. Naturally the resulting unlubricated friction has caused total siezure and the rod has snapped, poking through the top of the block, taking the alloy water cross feed with it. You close the bonnet, fully aware that not only has your engine failed, but the GF won't be as obliging as she might have been previous to the breakdown miles from home. People sat in Maccy D's munching undercooked fries are staring and pointing as your car appears to be on fire.
What he said happened;
"Me motor blew up"
1) It was Burger King
2) What he actually said was "Me motor blew up" .... and then went on SN to post a thread in the general section entitled: "Subarus are ****e, chocolate pistons, blah, blah"
And then another in SN technical section entitled: "Need a 600bhp engine on a 99p budget "
03 October 2013, 09:51 PM
#59
Thing is you really need to know these cars, how to treat them and what to look out for, and even then with the best maintenance and mechanical sympathy it's possible to have a catastrophic failure.
These cars are budget high performance cars, if the likes of porsche struggle to make reliable cars what chance does subaru have doing it at a fraction of the cost.
Subaru's box way above their weight class and do a pretty fine job of bringing high performance to the masses for very little moola, the odd failure is to be expected really, only problem being the folks that buy them often don't have the disposable wonga to throw at them in the same manner as the porsche driver, so we all come on here b!tching and looking for someone to blame.
Welcome to the wonderful world of performance motor cars.
These cars are budget high performance cars, if the likes of porsche struggle to make reliable cars what chance does subaru have doing it at a fraction of the cost.
Subaru's box way above their weight class and do a pretty fine job of bringing high performance to the masses for very little moola, the odd failure is to be expected really, only problem being the folks that buy them often don't have the disposable wonga to throw at them in the same manner as the porsche driver, so we all come on here b!tching and looking for someone to blame.
Welcome to the wonderful world of performance motor cars.
