This is all quite laughable to me.

It's a case of the blind leading the blind and the only real reason the Scotts seem to want independence is because historically they've never had it.

Knock, knock, HELLO. Do you seriously think that it's been any different for the rest of us outside London?

I share common ground as I think most of us non Londoners do with the Scotts, I don't like London or politicians but we're stuck with them.

Just as in the past where your gentry/ land owners sold you down the river they will do it again, non of these people in positions of power give a **** about the man on the street, they just want a free reign to do as they please even more so than they have now, to make even more money.

Mark my words; they'll sell everything they can, land, oil, gas, fishing rights.
There will be a feeding frenzy if you get independence, only those at the top of the food chain will benefit, the rest of you and future generations will be left to pick up the tab.

Nostradamus.

 

There is not a lot of land to sell, I would think that a hand full of people/organisations own 95% of the land

 

have a nice day

 

Your already too late with most of this list.

Oil & Gas, already been sold by Thatcher.

Fishing Rights, the fishing fleet was scrapped by Westminster 15 years ago (this is how I ended up working offshore)) and replaced by French and Spanish vessels.

Land, well who knows.

But thats two thirds of your list already been sold off by Westminster.

 

Well it's obvious I know **** all about Scotland, but I still recon you'll be getting shafted some how.

Oh and I'm not attacking you boys more the powers that be so no need to get all defensive, I hope you get Independence if that's what the majority wants, I don't see it affecting me as i've already voted with my feet and left the **** hole that is the UK.

 

Its will be the same in any government unfortunately somehow the working man always gets shafted

not being defensive ditch I did say have a nice day and gave you a

If my wife was not so close to her family and could not stand being too far away from them I would move out of the uk and live abroad as well

 

So you don't know whether there is enough money to sustain iScotland? Well that is pretty fundamental in my mind. These kinds of questions need to be asked and answered don't you think. As it stands the for 2012/2013, the total public expenditure for Scotland £65bn, total tax revenue raised by Scotland £53bn (http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2014/03/7888). Now add the cost of setting up an iScotland on top of the £65bn that will no longer be paid by Westminster. I'm not trying to dispute the costs, it's basic maths and it just doesn't add up as it stands.

iScotland will have no foreign currency reserves, or any credit history to allow for cheap borrowing from other countries or institutions. Yes you have oil but that is as yet to be decided how much of it iScotland will own, though it is likely to be 90% if it's decided geographically and of course it takes time to realise that into tax revenues. I would imagine taxes would have to rise substantially to in the private sector in order to finance the public expenditure required for independence and public spending for things like education, health service, welfare, local authorities will be cut drastically, at least for the first few years or so.

Westminster doesn't want independence because of the difficulties surrounding it, especially when the UK economy is just starting it's recovery and growth. Also UK is stronger as a whole with Scotland both economically and influential standing on the global stage. Obviously there will also be a substantial cost to rUK too if Scotland separates.

You might disagree and I'm not trying to change your point of view. Independence will have a massive impact to rUK of which I am a part of and this is my point of view. Good luck to you and iScotland if that is what you want.

 

Nizmo.

Ok so now I know slightly more about Scotland, where's the apparent £12bn that's missing going to come from.

Jonc makes some very valid points about the cost of setting up iScotland, it's all well and good shouting "Freedom" a la Mel Gibson style, but it's got to be financed somehow.

The only way I see that happening is through the EU like they are doing out here in Croatia, but that comes at a price. Over here that's in the form of selling off national assets, roads to the French, telecoms to the Germans and now they are currently selling the government owned aspect of the petrochemical industry and quite a few islands.

The biggest industry out here is tourism and the dumb ***** already sold most of the hotels and resorts to foreign companies so the vast majority of the profit goes outside.

Perfect example of how stupid or corrupt they are here is the local Tunnel that is the main route to the rest of Croatia, it was built in Tito's time using public funds and when it ran into financial difficulty they docked everyone here 2 months wages with the promise of never having to pay to use it, 20yrs on they sell it to the French in some dodgy deal for next to nothing and in the time i've been here (8yrs) it's gone from being 30p to €4.00 along with the roads leading to it being turned into toll roads,(which doesn't sound a lot but the average wage out here is around €400) add to that the government in their wisdom gives them €20m a year in tax breaks just for the tunnel

It's just one dodgy deal after another out here and the only ones that are benefiting is the government ministers and outside investors.

I fear it will be the same for you guys in iScotland.

 

Regarding the EU I would rather stay and be Governed by Westminster than by Brussels TBH, the EU is a case of out of the frying pan into the fire as far as I can see.

 

Sorry guys but from watching that vid of the ex con junki I't seems to me like none of this is based on the financial reality of the situation, it's built on the history of oppression, which ultimately was facilitated by a large number of you fellow country men.

Can you tell the vast majority of my knowledge on Scotland is based on Breveheart.

And Rab c Nesbit.

 

If they abolished the NHS in Scotland there would be nearly no deficit.

That won't be high up the priority list though

 

Jon,

If you want to retain credibility in all of this, linking to the Scottish Conservatives website is hardly the way to do it. And no, I'm no socialist.

Incidentally, when I clicked the link, I got a message saying that the scottish conservatives website was "not responding". Which pretty much sums up their gravitas in all this.

 

Yeah but he elephant in the room is still there and trying to detract attention away from it without substance isn't going to wash.

 

There would also be approx 50% unemployment.

 

And your rather extensive quote of a blogger from the pro-independence Yes2014 site is more credible?

Prepare for the possibility that things might get a little tougher come a No vote. There is an old saying, you reap what you sow....
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...lish-attitudes
http://www.theguardian.com/news/data...e-shared-pound

 

All those Guardian links serve to illustrate is how petty and pathetic the English are.... much like this thread does really!

As ever I am embarrassed to be English!

 

As are we

 

My quote illustrates a thought process. Which is more than we've seen from "better together"

Anyway, here's more on the lines of your links above Jon

http://wingsoverscotland.com/here-comes-the-love/

"Better together" my ****

 

Petty and pathetic for expecting an newly declared independent country to ACTUALLY BE independent and stand on its own two feet? They want independence, fine. But the apron strings get cut. You're the one who is embarrassing!

 

Ahem

Why can no one on this forum read anything first without feeling the need to tap the keyboard before they have?

 

Ah fair enough, I thought you were referring to the using the pound bit

 

No worries

 

Precisely, England and Scotland will now be more divided regardless of the outcome! Perhaps those surveyed in England have grown tired of hearing of how much better off an independent Scotland would be than England and therefore would rather make sure Scotland goes. This campaign for independence has hardly brought the two countries closer together has it!

 

Mind you Westminster hasn't done a very good job of it either.

 

Westminster have only denied what Alex Salmond assumed he would be able to get as part of Scotland's independence. Scotland was never on the radar for many south of the border until the campaign for independence, nothing like to what it is now and Alex Salmond has driven a great wedge between Scotland and rUK relations.

 

Am I missing something regarding the pound?
As I see it, the pound belongs to the UK, not just England. Scotland being still part of the UK has as much right to it as England.

Look at it the other way. Suppose it were England looking for independence from the rest of the UK, could they then stop Wales, Scotland, and N.I from using it?

 

Nope, you're not missing a thing. Nail on head.

 

I suspect Dunk means since way before the referendum was even on the radar.

But not living in Scotland you wouldn't understand that, instead you hypothisise based on what you *think* is the case.

The fact that, in your own words, "Scotland was never on the radar for many south of the border" pretty much sums up all that is wrong with the English.

I see it professionally al the time. As an example, educated, highly qualified individuals working in banking, accountancy and law, who are not even aware that Scotland has its own completely separate legal system.

At least now Scotland very much is on the Radar for the English and that should only be a good thing in the long term, whatever the outcome.

I was thinking about the opinions of those in England in the event of a no vote. If there is a big push from Boris and the rest to try and take away devolved powers, or make changes in some petty retaliation for a referendum on indepndence (seriously, are English people so insecure??) then all that will happen is that Scottish people's resolve to be indepent will be stronger.

 

And clearly your issue with the "English" is what sums up all that is wrong with the pro-yes Scottish. I never said English, I said rUK.

 

That's right, the Pound belongs to the UK and Scotland is currently still part of the UK and can continue to use it. iScotland however will no longer be part of the UK and therefore will use a Sterlingnised currency that is no longer underwritten by the Bank of England. What this means is that the iScottish Pound will be open to market forces and will have no governing monetary framwork that is controlled by the iScottish state and no central bank to provide liquidity in iScotland's financial sector.