Airport capacity expansion in SE - another political mess
06 September 2012, 11:50 AM
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06 September 2012, 12:58 PM
#32
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Re: Doncaster Maid Marion Robin Hood Sheffield nr Nottinghamshire airport – I’d take a bet that it will become a major freight hub in the next 5-10 years, just look at what is going on around it and nearby.
1) Direct Link road from the M18
2) Rail Freight Depot
3) The all-important bonded warehouses
4) Land Purchases by Peel (so I hear)
I’m pretty sure that a freight company recently took up tenancy in one of the hangers as well. Once all the ducks are lined up, they’ll apply to DMBC for 24hr ops, with the offer to create hundreds, if not thousands of new jobs. You tell me a council that will turn that down in an area crying out for employment opportunities?
1) Direct Link road from the M18
2) Rail Freight Depot
3) The all-important bonded warehouses
4) Land Purchases by Peel (so I hear)
I’m pretty sure that a freight company recently took up tenancy in one of the hangers as well. Once all the ducks are lined up, they’ll apply to DMBC for 24hr ops, with the offer to create hundreds, if not thousands of new jobs. You tell me a council that will turn that down in an area crying out for employment opportunities?
06 September 2012, 01:28 PM
#33
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Shock news Govt say one thing then do another 
imho this is standard fare for any Govt, all they do is make a Big Promise then gradually water it down over time ... there will always be a Good Reason to change their mind. Regardless of that Heathrow will eventually get a third runway, any objection will merely delay the inevitable.
TX.
imho this is standard fare for any Govt, all they do is make a Big Promise then gradually water it down over time ... there will always be a Good Reason to change their mind. Regardless of that Heathrow will eventually get a third runway, any objection will merely delay the inevitable.TX.
NL decided to build a third runway at Heathrow, not the most sensible of decisions in my opinon, but there you go.
Then of course the Tories made it a pledge in their election manifesto (yes that fine work of fiction) not to build that third runway at Heathrow (if nothing else it guaraneteed them votes from the surrounding constituencies).
Now we see that they are moving opponents of the third runway out of cabinet and moving in those more open to the idea. They then state this morning that it will not happen in this parliament as stated in their manifesto (not quite what their manifesto said, but no surprise there).
...
This is a typical example of career politicians making a rut for themselves and then doing what is best for them rather than fessing up to making another ***** up and deciding on the best solution now and getting on with it. If that turns out to be a thrird runway at Heathrow then so be it, get on with it and stop playing party politics! The country is in a mess and we cannot afford to wait around while these morons **** about!
Then of course the Tories made it a pledge in their election manifesto (yes that fine work of fiction) not to build that third runway at Heathrow (if nothing else it guaraneteed them votes from the surrounding constituencies).
Now we see that they are moving opponents of the third runway out of cabinet and moving in those more open to the idea. They then state this morning that it will not happen in this parliament as stated in their manifesto (not quite what their manifesto said, but no surprise there).
...
This is a typical example of career politicians making a rut for themselves and then doing what is best for them rather than fessing up to making another ***** up and deciding on the best solution now and getting on with it. If that turns out to be a thrird runway at Heathrow then so be it, get on with it and stop playing party politics! The country is in a mess and we cannot afford to wait around while these morons **** about!
06 September 2012, 06:02 PM
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OK and that is your opinion, but mine is different and just because it is does not mean it is crap.
You view LHR from someone who works in the industry whereas I view it as a customer.
I have done a **** load of air travel in my time mainly on business and have been regularly to many of the world's airports including Changi, KL, Seoul, Chicago, JFK, Atalanta, Phoenix, San Fran, LAX, CDG, Schipol, Frankfurt, Stockholm, Copenhagen, Barcelona, Melbourne, Sydney, Dubai etc. etc. and I can honestly say wth the possible exception of Schipol which is nearly on a par that LHR is the worst airtport I have ever been to.
It is a disorganised mess, planes land late, take off late, taxi for ages, wait for a stand for ages, inter terminal transport is a joke as there was never any real planning as to the termnal locations and layouts and as for baggage handling... how long can it possibly take to get a bag from a plane to a terminal??? At the first sign of bad weather it descends into chaos and above al it is just not a nice place to be... the terminals seem almost designed to be nosiy, dingy and in many cases dirty! These days I deliberately plan any journey so as to avoid LHR and luckily have not had to go there for over 3 years.... long may it continue!
When I worked for a company regularly flying over 500 people around Europe we did a trasnport survey run by the company that organised all our travel. 72% of those surveyed voted LHR as the worst airport thay had to use!
That is why IMO if we need extra capacity let's stick it somewhere other than LHR, but if there isn't anywhere else where it can be done as quickly then LHR it should be.
To come back to my original point above all else we should not be dithering around so politicians can make a name for themselves.
You view LHR from someone who works in the industry whereas I view it as a customer.
I have done a **** load of air travel in my time mainly on business and have been regularly to many of the world's airports including Changi, KL, Seoul, Chicago, JFK, Atalanta, Phoenix, San Fran, LAX, CDG, Schipol, Frankfurt, Stockholm, Copenhagen, Barcelona, Melbourne, Sydney, Dubai etc. etc. and I can honestly say wth the possible exception of Schipol which is nearly on a par that LHR is the worst airtport I have ever been to.
It is a disorganised mess, planes land late, take off late, taxi for ages, wait for a stand for ages, inter terminal transport is a joke as there was never any real planning as to the termnal locations and layouts and as for baggage handling... how long can it possibly take to get a bag from a plane to a terminal??? At the first sign of bad weather it descends into chaos and above al it is just not a nice place to be... the terminals seem almost designed to be nosiy, dingy and in many cases dirty! These days I deliberately plan any journey so as to avoid LHR and luckily have not had to go there for over 3 years.... long may it continue!
When I worked for a company regularly flying over 500 people around Europe we did a trasnport survey run by the company that organised all our travel. 72% of those surveyed voted LHR as the worst airport thay had to use!
That is why IMO if we need extra capacity let's stick it somewhere other than LHR, but if there isn't anywhere else where it can be done as quickly then LHR it should be.
To come back to my original point above all else we should not be dithering around so politicians can make a name for themselves.
06 September 2012, 06:37 PM
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So how about a Heathrow expansion for the short term and a bit of concrete at Gatwick for a third runway + terminal building for the medium term. Might need to upgrade the rail link (but better than Heathrow's rattly tube connection).
Then spend some time planning a proper airport near London, perhaps in the SE Kent area near existing fast links to London/Europe. Cancel a white elephant like Trident (or Europe) and there is some money to kick off.
Sorry Boris - a non-starter.
dl
Then spend some time planning a proper airport near London, perhaps in the SE Kent area near existing fast links to London/Europe. Cancel a white elephant like Trident (or Europe) and there is some money to kick off.
Sorry Boris - a non-starter.
dl
06 September 2012, 06:45 PM
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If I remember rightly you reckon you've got some reasonably important job. In the extremely unlikely event that of that being the truth I just hope it doesn't involve you coming into contact with anyone of a foreign persuasion as your bigoted views would mean there is no way they would get fair treatment by you!
06 September 2012, 06:54 PM
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As I said that is how iI see it as a long time (ex) customer so if I said how about taklng your head out of your condescending **** and realising that your sort of attitude is most of the problem and maybe you should listen to the people that have to actually use the ******* joke of an airport that s LHR (that's not me btw as I will NEVER set foot in it again even to pick someone up) would that be clear enough for you?
Hope they build the third runway and God help the poor *******s that have to use it after that!
06 September 2012, 07:54 PM
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Oh I understand them all right. I understand that every time I fly in and out of Changi (or any other number of airports across the world aside from LHR of course) I rarely have a problem and if I do it is sorted efficiently and quickly whereas nearly every time I fly through the sh1thole that is LHR I end up delayed or worse and then come the excuses from the staff, that's if you can find one who knows what the **** is going on!
As I said that is how iI see it as a long time (ex) customer so if I said how about taklng your head out of your condescending **** and realising that your sort of attitude is most of the problem and maybe you should listen to the people that have to actually use the ******* joke of an airport that s LHR (that's not me btw as I will NEVER set foot in it again even to pick someone up) would that be clear enough for you?
Hope they build the third runway and God help the poor *******s that have to use it after that!
As I said that is how iI see it as a long time (ex) customer so if I said how about taklng your head out of your condescending **** and realising that your sort of attitude is most of the problem and maybe you should listen to the people that have to actually use the ******* joke of an airport that s LHR (that's not me btw as I will NEVER set foot in it again even to pick someone up) would that be clear enough for you?
Hope they build the third runway and God help the poor *******s that have to use it after that!
Heathrow - 2 runways, 480,000 movements per annum.
Now I wonder why you have a better experience at Changi. Although by your own admission you haven't been to LHR for 3 years and our QSM scores are getting better and better each year.
You seem like a reasonably intelligent chap, anger issues not withstanding, and as you have no idea as to how aviation actually works, let me explain with a simple analogy, that will hopefully illustrate one of the issues that people often read about, holding.
I'm sure you drive, so let say you drive (fly) to your local town (airport) at 11am on the final Saturday before Xmas. It's packed,(as is LHR 365 days a year) and when you get to the car park (airport) its full. You have nowhere to park. You have to wait (hold) for a space (stand) to become available. When a space (stand) becomes free, you park (land).
What is the solution to this? Do you build a bigger car park (3rd runway) further way from the town and encourage people to go there? But who will go there, when the old car park is so close to where you want to be? Do you extend the existing car park, using the bit of land close to it that has been earmarked for redevelopment for years? Or do you bury your head in the sand and ignore the problem, which gets worse every year.
What would you do? Cupcake.
07 September 2012, 12:37 PM
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What is clear is that you are a **** who enjoys being very vocal about things you know nothing about, I have done no ***** waving just pointed out the absolute ridiculousness of your comments about LHR. There are MUCH worse airports out there but as usual you are trying to talk crap and make yourself appear important at the same time. I cannot believe any character could be as much of a dick as you in real life so I assume this is your internet trolling persona and in all honesty you should get out more.
07 September 2012, 01:23 PM
#42
What is clear is that you are a **** who enjoys being very vocal about things you know nothing about, I have done no ***** waving just pointed out the absolute ridiculousness of your comments about LHR. There are MUCH worse airports out there but as usual you are trying to talk crap and make yourself appear important at the same time. I cannot believe any character could be as much of a dick as you in real life so I assume this is your internet trolling persona and in all honesty you should get out more.
07 September 2012, 03:05 PM
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Changi - 3 runways, 301,000 movements per annum.
Heathrow - 2 runways, 480,000 movements per annum.
Now I wonder why you have a better experience at Changi. Although by your own admission you haven't been to LHR for 3 years and our QSM scores are getting better and better each year.
You seem like a reasonably intelligent chap, anger issues not withstanding, and as you have no idea as to how aviation actually works, let me explain with a simple analogy, that will hopefully illustrate one of the issues that people often read about, holding.
I'm sure you drive, so let say you drive (fly) to your local town (airport) at 11am on the final Saturday before Xmas. It's packed,(as is LHR 365 days a year) and when you get to the car park (airport) its full. You have nowhere to park. You have to wait (hold) for a space (stand) to become available. When a space (stand) becomes free, you park (land).
What is the solution to this? Do you build a bigger car park (3rd runway) further way from the town and encourage people to go there? But who will go there, when the old car park is so close to where you want to be? Do you extend the existing car park, using the bit of land close to it that has been earmarked for redevelopment for years? Or do you bury your head in the sand and ignore the problem, which gets worse every year.
What would you do? Cupcake.
Heathrow - 2 runways, 480,000 movements per annum.
Now I wonder why you have a better experience at Changi. Although by your own admission you haven't been to LHR for 3 years and our QSM scores are getting better and better each year.
You seem like a reasonably intelligent chap, anger issues not withstanding, and as you have no idea as to how aviation actually works, let me explain with a simple analogy, that will hopefully illustrate one of the issues that people often read about, holding.
I'm sure you drive, so let say you drive (fly) to your local town (airport) at 11am on the final Saturday before Xmas. It's packed,(as is LHR 365 days a year) and when you get to the car park (airport) its full. You have nowhere to park. You have to wait (hold) for a space (stand) to become available. When a space (stand) becomes free, you park (land).
What is the solution to this? Do you build a bigger car park (3rd runway) further way from the town and encourage people to go there? But who will go there, when the old car park is so close to where you want to be? Do you extend the existing car park, using the bit of land close to it that has been earmarked for redevelopment for years? Or do you bury your head in the sand and ignore the problem, which gets worse every year.
What would you do? Cupcake.
To extend your analogy..... I know the old town is 15 minutes away and I might get a parking space within 5 minutes of arrival or it might be an hour. Or I can go to the town further away knowing it takes twice as long to get there, but once there I can always park straight away. No brainer really isn't it?
You need to look at this issue as a customer, that is where you are falling down!
07 September 2012, 03:09 PM
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What is clear is that you are a **** who enjoys being very vocal about things you know nothing about, I have done no ***** waving just pointed out the absolute ridiculousness of your comments about LHR. There are MUCH worse airports out there but as usual you are trying to talk crap and make yourself appear important at the same time. I cannot believe any character could be as much of a dick as you in real life so I assume this is your internet trolling persona and in all honesty you should get out more.
07 September 2012, 04:44 PM
#47
Changi - 3 runways, 301,000 movements per annum.
Heathrow - 2 runways, 480,000 movements per annum.
Now I wonder why you have a better experience at Changi. Although by your own admission you haven't been to LHR for 3 years and our QSM scores are getting better and better each year.
You seem like a reasonably intelligent chap, anger issues not withstanding, and as you have no idea as to how aviation actually works, let me explain with a simple analogy, that will hopefully illustrate one of the issues that people often read about, holding.
I'm sure you drive, so let say you drive (fly) to your local town (airport) at 11am on the final Saturday before Xmas. It's packed,(as is LHR 365 days a year) and when you get to the car park (airport) its full. You have nowhere to park. You have to wait (hold) for a space (stand) to become available. When a space (stand) becomes free, you park (land).
What is the solution to this? Do you build a bigger car park (3rd runway) further way from the town and encourage people to go there? But who will go there, when the old car park is so close to where you want to be? Do you extend the existing car park (________), using the bit of land (_________) close to it that has been earmarked for redevelopment for years? Or do you bury your head in the sand and ignore the problem, which gets worse every year.
What would you do? Cupcake.
Heathrow - 2 runways, 480,000 movements per annum.
Now I wonder why you have a better experience at Changi. Although by your own admission you haven't been to LHR for 3 years and our QSM scores are getting better and better each year.
You seem like a reasonably intelligent chap, anger issues not withstanding, and as you have no idea as to how aviation actually works, let me explain with a simple analogy, that will hopefully illustrate one of the issues that people often read about, holding.
I'm sure you drive, so let say you drive (fly) to your local town (airport) at 11am on the final Saturday before Xmas. It's packed,(as is LHR 365 days a year) and when you get to the car park (airport) its full. You have nowhere to park. You have to wait (hold) for a space (stand) to become available. When a space (stand) becomes free, you park (land).
What is the solution to this? Do you build a bigger car park (3rd runway) further way from the town and encourage people to go there? But who will go there, when the old car park is so close to where you want to be? Do you extend the existing car park (________), using the bit of land (_________) close to it that has been earmarked for redevelopment for years? Or do you bury your head in the sand and ignore the problem, which gets worse every year.
What would you do? Cupcake.
07 September 2012, 05:35 PM
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07 September 2012, 06:59 PM
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I would go there if it meant less hold ups.
To extend your analogy..... I know the old town is 15 minutes away and I might get a parking space within 5 minutes of arrival or it might be an hour. Or I can go to the town further away knowing it takes twice as long to get there, but once there I can always park straight away. No brainer really isn't it?
You need to look at this issue as a customer, that is where you are falling down!
To extend your analogy..... I know the old town is 15 minutes away and I might get a parking space within 5 minutes of arrival or it might be an hour. Or I can go to the town further away knowing it takes twice as long to get there, but once there I can always park straight away. No brainer really isn't it?
You need to look at this issue as a customer, that is where you are falling down!
But not having flown from LHR for 3 years, you'll know better yeah?
07 September 2012, 07:01 PM
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09 September 2012, 12:48 AM
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ferrovial a spanish comapny bought BAA a few years ago for a hugley inflated price, now they are selling off uk airporrts to try repay the debt.
but hopefully a spnaish company wont be int debt
heathrow needs a 3 rd runway, no matter what people think , its wheter the government will subsidise it enough thats the question
but hopefully a spnaish company wont be int debt
heathrow needs a 3 rd runway, no matter what people think , its wheter the government will subsidise it enough thats the question
09 September 2012, 11:58 AM
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ferrovial a spanish comapny bought BAA a few years ago for a hugley inflated price, now they are selling off uk airporrts to try repay the debt.
but hopefully a spnaish company wont be int debt
heathrow needs a 3 rd runway, no matter what people think , its wheter the government will subsidise it enough thats the question
but hopefully a spnaish company wont be int debt
heathrow needs a 3 rd runway, no matter what people think , its wheter the government will subsidise it enough thats the question
The Competition Commission ruled that BAA should sell some of its airports. It has little to do with Ferrovial debt.
Govt will not subsidise a 3rd runway. Aviation is privately funded.
09 September 2012, 01:20 PM
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Sorry Les. Too many environmental, airspace and cost issues.
Boris is playing a political game, based on his mayoralty and London. This issuers national and should be treated as such.
Boris is playing a political game, based on his mayoralty and London. This issuers national and should be treated as such.
09 September 2012, 02:52 PM
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-19535359
Vince says an expansion is not going to happen LOL
Shaun
Vince says an expansion is not going to happen LOL
Shaun
09 September 2012, 08:18 PM
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heathrow is the goldmine, all others have little impact on the huge debt , and the likes of gatwick, and scottish airports sales just go to into trying t pay the humoungus debt the spanish company took on in buying BAA
bad time to by for them = shame - but as long as they have heathrow , should still be a longterm investment. cant get away from needing a 3 rd runway imo though
