Break up of the euro planning???
02 December 2011, 03:19 PM
#31
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The UK will suffer significant pain if the Euro collapses.
In an earlier post Steve Whitehorn used the analogy earlier of the Euro as a block of flats (with a single bank account, incorrectly). To stretch the metaphor; a few of the flats are on fire. The fire brigade is in attendance (arguing over which pump to use and whether water or foam).
The Little Englanders, euro-deniers, flat-earthers, Mail & Telegraph readers can see the smoke and they’re jumping up and down and cheering. They never did like the pushy foreign bunch in the flats next door!
What they’ve failed to grasp is that, if the fire's not put out, when the tower block collapses it’s going to land slap bang on their corner shop next door.
In an earlier post Steve Whitehorn used the analogy earlier of the Euro as a block of flats (with a single bank account, incorrectly). To stretch the metaphor; a few of the flats are on fire. The fire brigade is in attendance (arguing over which pump to use and whether water or foam).
The Little Englanders, euro-deniers, flat-earthers, Mail & Telegraph readers can see the smoke and they’re jumping up and down and cheering. They never did like the pushy foreign bunch in the flats next door!
What they’ve failed to grasp is that, if the fire's not put out, when the tower block collapses it’s going to land slap bang on their corner shop next door.
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
02 December 2011, 03:35 PM
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You're obviously having trouble reading these days, Martin!
It's a political point you're making. Whatever you deem to be 'society' would no doubt be destroyed by the market; I'm not disputing that.
These businesses that would be taken down: why would they be taken down? Because, in terms of demand, they are not sustainable when the house of cards (created by politicians) falls. There are a lot of businesses operating right now that shouldn't exist - because, unfortunately, the demand currently providing them with profit is not sustainable. We're out on a ledge we've been extending for years. Every time governments and institutions try to put off the inevitable effects of the nasty 'pure' market, its burden becomes greater. You can only kid reality for so long.
A significant part of the service/consumer part of the economy isn't sustainable without borrowed money. That's a fact. What we do about it, I don't know, I'm not a politician.
What you'd no doubt advocate would be just milking every ounce of capital from private hands to keep this house of cards up (thereby holding back the effects of the market and making things as comfortable as possible)? I've got no better ideas, by the way, but if you could clarify that would be great.
It's a political point you're making. Whatever you deem to be 'society' would no doubt be destroyed by the market; I'm not disputing that.
These businesses that would be taken down: why would they be taken down? Because, in terms of demand, they are not sustainable when the house of cards (created by politicians) falls. There are a lot of businesses operating right now that shouldn't exist - because, unfortunately, the demand currently providing them with profit is not sustainable. We're out on a ledge we've been extending for years. Every time governments and institutions try to put off the inevitable effects of the nasty 'pure' market, its burden becomes greater. You can only kid reality for so long.
A significant part of the service/consumer part of the economy isn't sustainable without borrowed money. That's a fact. What we do about it, I don't know, I'm not a politician.
What you'd no doubt advocate would be just milking every ounce of capital from private hands to keep this house of cards up (thereby holding back the effects of the market and making things as comfortable as possible)? I've got no better ideas, by the way, but if you could clarify that would be great.
For the record, I have never advocated ‘milking’ anything, I’m far more a fan of free markets than you seem to think. I’ve never been one of those want to go after the banking system (punitively anyway), I also firmly believe that the best place for the publics money is in the publics pocket, not the governments.
I believe we need the government(s) to do all it/they can to buy time and space so that we can rebalance and adapt our economy system for the challenges of the future. What we’ve had is unsustainable for sure, but the market isn't pure logic, it is partly driven by fear, anxiety, belief and above all confidence (or lack of). It is partly the role of government to help instil this.
Last edited by Martin2005; 02 December 2011 at 05:12 PM.
02 December 2011, 08:18 PM
#33
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You just have no idea have you? You have swallowed all the BS hook line and sinker and you don't realise the significance of federalisation into this apology for an administration!
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
its all a mock.
the vast majority dont vote because there is no party that they want in power - there all ultimatley the same, just slate each other when the opposer is in power.
policies vary so little on the grand scheme of things/time
imo the ordinary man has currently zero influence on who governs them, we have a choice between sh*te and a bit sh*ter.
03 December 2011, 12:49 PM
#34
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imo people just do not have the power currently to influence whos in charge,
its all a mock.
the vast majority dont vote because there is no party that they want in power - there all ultimatley the same, just slate each other when the opposer is in power.
policies vary so little on the grand scheme of things/time
imo the ordinary man has currently zero influence on who governs them, we have a choice between sh*te and a bit sh*ter.
its all a mock.
the vast majority dont vote because there is no party that they want in power - there all ultimatley the same, just slate each other when the opposer is in power.
policies vary so little on the grand scheme of things/time
imo the ordinary man has currently zero influence on who governs them, we have a choice between sh*te and a bit sh*ter.
I think the situation you describe above has been deliberately engineered by our varied political leaders. I believe that the reason is that by promoting such apathy as you describe, it will eventually become comparatively easy to get this country federalised into the Eu. That would be the bitter end since it would signify the total loss of any real democracy as far as the people are concerned. As you say- it is already seeming to be grossly undermined.
The big question is, why do most of our politicians in the three main parties want us to stay in the Eu?
Part of the answer may come from the proposals and the methods advocated by Jean Monnet after WW2.
Les
03 December 2011, 02:01 PM
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You just have no idea have you? You have swallowed all the BS hook line and sinker and you don't realise the significance of federalisation into this apology for an administration!
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
Last night i was at work, at a large American manufacturing plant. I work with three Poles and a Portugese lad. 50% of what we loaded last night was destined for Europe, 90% of what we tipped came from Eastern Europe. These are foreign lorry drivers on our roads, foreigners on our site with all the health and safety implications of working with people who dont speak English. We are integrated, and the more integrated you become, the more you need laws that cover all European states.
Its the same as the early part of the last century. When railways started, there were different guages in different parts of the country. As people travelled more, and train journeys increased, they realised you needed one standard railway guage. Did you hear the people of Bristol saying "why should our railway be dictated to by the people of Manchester "(probably). However, now everyone recognises the common sense of one guage to cover all the counties of the UK.
Same as Europe. The more integrated we become, the stronger the pressure to standardise. Another example. Do you know how much money is wasted by having the UK have one standard pallet size, and Europe another. Massive,massive amounts of money. Years ago it never mattered. Now, its a huge cost burden, for no gain.
Last edited by paulr; 03 December 2011 at 03:05 PM.
03 December 2011, 04:28 PM
#36
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Les, its you that have no idea mate. You should look around.
Last night i was at work, at a large American manufacturing plant. I work with three Poles and a Portugese lad. 50% of what we loaded last night was destined for Europe, 90% of what we tipped came from Eastern Europe. These are foreign lorry drivers on our roads, foreigners on our site with all the health and safety implications of working with people who dont speak English. We are integrated, and the more integrated you become, the more you need laws that cover all European states.
Its the same as the early part of the last century. When railways started, there were different guages in different parts of the country. As people travelled more, and train journeys increased, they realised you needed one standard railway guage. Did you hear the people of Bristol saying "why should our railway be dictated to by the people of Manchester "(probably). However, now everyone recognises the common sense of one guage to cover all the counties of the UK.
Same as Europe. The more integrated we become, the stronger the pressure to standardise. Another example. Do you know how much money is wasted by having the UK have one standard pallet size, and Europe another. Massive,massive amounts of money. Years ago it never mattered. Now, its a huge cost burden, for no gain.
Last night i was at work, at a large American manufacturing plant. I work with three Poles and a Portugese lad. 50% of what we loaded last night was destined for Europe, 90% of what we tipped came from Eastern Europe. These are foreign lorry drivers on our roads, foreigners on our site with all the health and safety implications of working with people who dont speak English. We are integrated, and the more integrated you become, the more you need laws that cover all European states.
Its the same as the early part of the last century. When railways started, there were different guages in different parts of the country. As people travelled more, and train journeys increased, they realised you needed one standard railway guage. Did you hear the people of Bristol saying "why should our railway be dictated to by the people of Manchester "(probably). However, now everyone recognises the common sense of one guage to cover all the counties of the UK.
Same as Europe. The more integrated we become, the stronger the pressure to standardise. Another example. Do you know how much money is wasted by having the UK have one standard pallet size, and Europe another. Massive,massive amounts of money. Years ago it never mattered. Now, its a huge cost burden, for no gain.
So Europe uses our pallet size and obeys our laws whilst in the UK. Quite simple. There is NO need to harmonise laws or regulations. Pallet sizes I agree (from your example above) but the rest will have absolutely no consequences to trading with the rest of Europe.
Dave
03 December 2011, 05:51 PM
#37
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paulr - I'm sure when it's convenient to do so these business will change something as simple as a pallet size. They hardly need regulations, do they?
Same goes for everything else. There's no need for bureaucracy... it's about choice. And I'm sure businesses don't need or want people like you telling them how to run things unless they specifically ask.
Same goes for everything else. There's no need for bureaucracy... it's about choice. And I'm sure businesses don't need or want people like you telling them how to run things unless they specifically ask.
03 December 2011, 05:52 PM
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So Europe uses our pallet size and obeys our laws whilst in the UK. Quite simple. There is NO need to harmonise laws or regulations. Pallet sizes I agree (from your example above) but the rest will have absolutely no consequences to trading with the rest of Europe.
Dave
Dave
As for the rest, there are consequences. What are the insurance regulations regarding foreign lorry drivers loading their own wagons on the UK. We are not sure, so just in case we have to do it for them, when in reality they should do it themselves. Europe wide, easy to understand H&S regulations would make it easier. What happens when they are pulled over by the police. A friend of mine's wife works as a freelance translator for the police, charges quite a lot of money. All paid for by the taxpayer.
All these issues arise from closer ties and cross border trade.
03 December 2011, 06:05 PM
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paulr - I'm sure when it's convenient to do so these business will change something as simple as a pallet size. They hardly need regulations, do they?
Same goes for everything else. There's no need for bureaucracy... it's about choice. And I'm sure businesses don't need or want people like you telling them how to run things unless they specifically ask.
Same goes for everything else. There's no need for bureaucracy... it's about choice. And I'm sure businesses don't need or want people like you telling them how to run things unless they specifically ask.
03 December 2011, 06:32 PM
#40
You just have no idea have you? You have swallowed all the BS hook line and sinker and you don't realise the significance of federalisation into this apology for an administration!
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
Are you REALLY saying, and BELIEVING that successive governments, some of whome YOU worked for are a) devious enough to do this? And b) clever enough to hide it from the people for so long?
04 December 2011, 01:45 PM
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Yes I do believe that right from the time of Heath conning us to vote to enter the Common Market without telling us the eventual ambitions of the Eu, that we have been eased gently into a tighter union as was proposed by Monnet so that we did not realise what was happening until we are told that we might as well go for the final step because we are almost there already. They rely on apathy which they have been deliberately fomenting.
How do you personally feel about final federalisation anyway?
Les
04 December 2011, 01:47 PM
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Les, its you that have no idea mate. You should look around.
Last night i was at work, at a large American manufacturing plant. I work with three Poles and a Portugese lad. 50% of what we loaded last night was destined for Europe, 90% of what we tipped came from Eastern Europe. These are foreign lorry drivers on our roads, foreigners on our site with all the health and safety implications of working with people who dont speak English. We are integrated, and the more integrated you become, the more you need laws that cover all European states.
Its the same as the early part of the last century. When railways started, there were different guages in different parts of the country. As people travelled more, and train journeys increased, they realised you needed one standard railway guage. Did you hear the people of Bristol saying "why should our railway be dictated to by the people of Manchester "(probably). However, now everyone recognises the common sense of one guage to cover all the counties of the UK.
Same as Europe. The more integrated we become, the stronger the pressure to standardise. Another example. Do you know how much money is wasted by having the UK have one standard pallet size, and Europe another. Massive,massive amounts of money. Years ago it never mattered. Now, its a huge cost burden, for no gain.
Last night i was at work, at a large American manufacturing plant. I work with three Poles and a Portugese lad. 50% of what we loaded last night was destined for Europe, 90% of what we tipped came from Eastern Europe. These are foreign lorry drivers on our roads, foreigners on our site with all the health and safety implications of working with people who dont speak English. We are integrated, and the more integrated you become, the more you need laws that cover all European states.
Its the same as the early part of the last century. When railways started, there were different guages in different parts of the country. As people travelled more, and train journeys increased, they realised you needed one standard railway guage. Did you hear the people of Bristol saying "why should our railway be dictated to by the people of Manchester "(probably). However, now everyone recognises the common sense of one guage to cover all the counties of the UK.
Same as Europe. The more integrated we become, the stronger the pressure to standardise. Another example. Do you know how much money is wasted by having the UK have one standard pallet size, and Europe another. Massive,massive amounts of money. Years ago it never mattered. Now, its a huge cost burden, for no gain.
Les
04 December 2011, 02:34 PM
#44
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Euro pallets are ****, are unstable and fall over alot. The Europeans need to up their game, plenty of companies in Europe can deal with British pallets same as plenty of companies in England deal with Euro pallets. If you are worried about EU workers, thats fine withdraw from Europe and send them back home. Of course if we sent the Polish home the lazy English would be incapable of doing the job but at least companies would be forced to pay a fair wage.
04 December 2011, 05:08 PM
#45
IF, and only IF we had some PROPER checks on a) the accounts and b) the people who govern us, then I'm all for it. Can't happen too soon.
At present we have a party who love themselves, big business and the bankers, in that order, verus a party who love themselves, themselves, the Unions, themselves and the bankers, in that order.
Where IS the party for the guy in the middle? Does ANYONE care?
And whyis it that the whole of the US can be represented by 438 congressmen and 100 senators, while OUR greedy b@stards need over SIX HUNDRED MP's and God-alone-knows how many UNELECTED Lords!!!!
WE NEED to get some sort of change, Les, we need it BADLY!
At present we have a party who love themselves, big business and the bankers, in that order, verus a party who love themselves, themselves, the Unions, themselves and the bankers, in that order.
Where IS the party for the guy in the middle? Does ANYONE care?
And whyis it that the whole of the US can be represented by 438 congressmen and 100 senators, while OUR greedy b@stards need over SIX HUNDRED MP's and God-alone-knows how many UNELECTED Lords!!!!
WE NEED to get some sort of change, Les, we need it BADLY!
04 December 2011, 05:16 PM
#46
And yes, I DO know that official lies, (figures), puts the unemployed at 2.5M, thanks.
The problem we now have is TWO times Lying Labour's making:
The brought in laws allowing folk to work as long as they wanted, and at the same time, opened the floodgates to the Eastern European "people" that now populate these shores.
The first took the jobs of young skilled incomers, the second took all the young people's starter jobs.
THEN Lying Labour turned round and said, "Oh look, we have over a million people between 16 and 25, unemployed, plus LOADS of NEETS. Where did THEY come from?" Disengenuous Lying Labour!
They have betrayed a generation, just as the Tories did in the early eighties
04 December 2011, 05:42 PM
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IF, and only IF we had some PROPER checks on a) the accounts and b) the people who govern us, then I'm all for it. Can't happen too soon.
At present we have a party who love themselves, big business and the bankers, in that order, verus a party who love themselves, themselves, the Unions, themselves and the bankers, in that order.
Where IS the party for the guy in the middle? Does ANYONE care?
And whyis it that the whole of the US can be represented by 438 congressmen and 100 senators, while OUR greedy b@stards need over SIX HUNDRED MP's and God-alone-knows how many UNELECTED Lords!!!!
WE NEED to get some sort of change, Les, we need it BADLY!
At present we have a party who love themselves, big business and the bankers, in that order, verus a party who love themselves, themselves, the Unions, themselves and the bankers, in that order.
Where IS the party for the guy in the middle? Does ANYONE care?
And whyis it that the whole of the US can be represented by 438 congressmen and 100 senators, while OUR greedy b@stards need over SIX HUNDRED MP's and God-alone-knows how many UNELECTED Lords!!!!
WE NEED to get some sort of change, Les, we need it BADLY!
Agree 100% with everything you've written here.
04 December 2011, 05:50 PM
#48
As I said next week is watershed time.....
1. Will the politicians, namely Germany and France be able to push through Fincal union, as they call it, and really pull everybody togther into a European superstate. Governed by the unelected in Brussels and overseen financialy by the Germans in Frankfurt, In order to save the Euro, save themselves politicaly and restore confidence in the markets.
2. Will the politicians not be able to move fast enough to enact the above and the markets move too quickly for them and sink the Euro and European banks, having now reached the point of no return in terms of confidence.
We will all find out in the next 10days or so.
My money is on senario 2.
In a way I dont want senaro 1. as it is just putting off the ineviatable.
Although I also dont want senario 2. as that means very tough times.
Also senaro 1. is a big knee in the ***** for democracy.
Also which way does Cameron go. Chuck his lot in with the superstate, or pull out and be held partly responsible for the collapse.
1. Will the politicians, namely Germany and France be able to push through Fincal union, as they call it, and really pull everybody togther into a European superstate. Governed by the unelected in Brussels and overseen financialy by the Germans in Frankfurt, In order to save the Euro, save themselves politicaly and restore confidence in the markets.
2. Will the politicians not be able to move fast enough to enact the above and the markets move too quickly for them and sink the Euro and European banks, having now reached the point of no return in terms of confidence.
We will all find out in the next 10days or so.
My money is on senario 2.
In a way I dont want senaro 1. as it is just putting off the ineviatable.
Although I also dont want senario 2. as that means very tough times.
Also senaro 1. is a big knee in the ***** for democracy.
Also which way does Cameron go. Chuck his lot in with the superstate, or pull out and be held partly responsible for the collapse.
04 December 2011, 08:17 PM
#51
The big political make or break date is next Friday. When the French and Germans get together to try to sort out ´´fiscal union´´
The big economic date - is a huge amount of Italian bonds due to be bought or not on the 30th of Jan
04 December 2011, 09:21 PM
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No body knows the timing or the consequences.
The big political make or break date is next Friday. When the French and Germans get together to try to sort out ´´fiscal union´´
The big economic date - is a huge amount of Italian bonds due to be bought or not on the 30th of Jan
The big political make or break date is next Friday. When the French and Germans get together to try to sort out ´´fiscal union´´
The big economic date - is a huge amount of Italian bonds due to be bought or not on the 30th of Jan
Germany want to move slowly and carefully whereas France are in danger of losing their AAA credit rating so want to move quicker. Then of course there are French elections next April not that anyone's political career should factor in these negotiations but as we have seen with Greece they will.
04 December 2011, 09:37 PM
#55
You just have no idea have you? You have swallowed all the BS hook line and sinker and you don't realise the significance of federalisation into this apology for an administration!
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
You should take a break and think very hard through all the real meaning of becoming part of the Eu attempt at government, especially looking back at all its "success" so far.Perhap's you don't understand the meaning of the word democracy and what it would be like when the people no longer have any power to influence those who govern them.
This has all been a big con ever since Heath effectively lied to us by witholding the true Eu ambition from us and conning us into the initial membership of an EFTA which has subtly changed over the years in the manner suggested by Jean Monnet in order to fool us.
You should wake up and smell the coffee as they say!
Les
Last week the Governor stated that for the UK a Eurozone meltdown (his “worst case” scenario) it’s “possible to find [that] things are even worse than you could imagine”.
Impact of being part of the EU? I paused and had a think… I can’t think of one single thing that I really want to do that the EU’s preventing me from doing. But then sending "1 million" Poles packing isn’t particularly high on my agenda.
Federalisation holds no fear for me. I’m in Europe, invested in it, travelling in it, looking for opportunities in it. And I don’t really care whether my representative sits 200 miles away in London or 250 miles away in Brussels. And at least I’d be a citizen instead of a subject.
04 December 2011, 10:08 PM
#56
Fiscal union is going to take a lot longer to sort out than one meeting next Friday. Core EU treaties will need to be amended and they haven't even decided whether to include all 27 member states or just the 17 Euro states in the discussions yet.
Germany want to move slowly and carefully whereas France are in danger of losing their AAA credit rating so want to move quicker. Then of course there are French elections next April not that anyone's political career should factor in these negotiations but as we have seen with Greece they will.
Germany want to move slowly and carefully whereas France are in danger of losing their AAA credit rating so want to move quicker. Then of course there are French elections next April not that anyone's political career should factor in these negotiations but as we have seen with Greece they will.
Merkel also has elections coming up in the spring. So as you say indivduals political careers are a major factor.
Watch this space I guess. We are all passengers not in the driving seat
Last edited by Steve Whitehorn; 04 December 2011 at 10:09 PM.
04 December 2011, 10:58 PM
#57
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Fiscal union is going to take a lot longer to sort out than one meeting next Friday. Core EU treaties will need to be amended and they haven't even decided whether to include all 27 member states or just the 17 Euro states in the discussions yet.
Germany want to move slowly and carefully whereas France are in danger of losing their AAA credit rating so want to move quicker. Then of course there are French elections next April not that anyone's political career should factor in these negotiations but as we have seen with Greece they will.
Germany want to move slowly and carefully whereas France are in danger of losing their AAA credit rating so want to move quicker. Then of course there are French elections next April not that anyone's political career should factor in these negotiations but as we have seen with Greece they will.
Oh, and any plan that comes along next week that involves the IMF? The US have said they'll veto the IMF bailing out the EU, even by stealth. Can't blame them.
Dave
05 December 2011, 08:00 AM
#60
Scooby Regular
Looks like Mervyn King’s swallowed it too.
Last week the Governor stated that for the UK a Eurozone meltdown (his “worst case” scenario) it’s “possible to find [that] things are even worse than you could imagine”.
Impact of being part of the EU? I paused and had a think… I can’t think of one single thing that I really want to do that the EU’s preventing me from doing. But then sending "1 million" Poles packing isn’t particularly high on my agenda.
Federalisation holds no fear for me. I’m in Europe, invested in it, travelling in it, looking for opportunities in it. And I don’t really care whether my representative sits 200 miles away in London or 250 miles away in Brussels. And at least I’d be a citizen instead of a subject.
Last week the Governor stated that for the UK a Eurozone meltdown (his “worst case” scenario) it’s “possible to find [that] things are even worse than you could imagine”.
Impact of being part of the EU? I paused and had a think… I can’t think of one single thing that I really want to do that the EU’s preventing me from doing. But then sending "1 million" Poles packing isn’t particularly high on my agenda.
Federalisation holds no fear for me. I’m in Europe, invested in it, travelling in it, looking for opportunities in it. And I don’t really care whether my representative sits 200 miles away in London or 250 miles away in Brussels. And at least I’d be a citizen instead of a subject.
Working in banking means they'll probably not be preventing you from doing much. Even with smothering bureaucracy the banking sector does well.
Personally I'd rather be a subject under a monarchy where civil liberties are prioritised than a pseudo-citizen (serf) in a federal Europe.
I can't think of anything worse personally. The creep of the state into other people's business is frightening.
But I'm sure you'll do all right. In the same way I'm sure those in Politburo don't mind communism one bit.
Last edited by GlesgaKiss; 05 December 2011 at 08:03 AM.