I don't get this at all.

You are seriously suggesting that society should be jailing abused and damaged children in the knowledge that they will then be killed when they are 18? That would be just about the point that this country hit rock-bottom and in every way more twisted and calculated. I seriously wonder about people that could lust for such a thing.


Why wait until they are 18? why not kill them as 10 years olds then?...you really want that? or would that be too kind, far better to make them suffer for 8 years first?

Societies shouldn't be shaped by what they did, it's how we react to what they did that makes us civilised

 

What point are you making here?

It's terrible to kill children...no ****?

I despise the argument that says that you cannot have a proper view on an issue like this unless you have kids..pointless and vacuous way to debate.



Are those without children somehow less able to tell right from wrong?

 

I've got kids. My kids would not be child killers.

However, I have been involved with families where neglect and abuse has taken place from an early age and the damage can be horrific.

We will never understand what these killers went through as most of us have led fairly normal lives. Although on some of these sink estates, abuse and neglect is rife. Not just out of choice, but these young parents don't know how to care for kids, as they had no role models to show them.

Thankfully, the list of child killers is very short, so getting much meaningful data is very difficult.

I would still not want a person who killed a child at 10 years old, who served his time, to be killed by adults trying to seek vengence. This makes them just as guilty. They were 10 when they did it. Can you remember what you were doing at 10? I am certain it was nothing like these boys. What they did was horrific, and thankfully pretty much a one off.

 

....

 

Exactly. What sort of message would parents advocating vigilante murder/vengence send out their own kids?

 

Much more elloquently put than my rambling.

Yes I too have children, a boy of 10 included btw.

 

You have got to be sh!tting me.

You think the death penalty for two child murderers is worse than the crime they committed? You really have lost the plot

 

Somehow I don't think it's me that lost the plot

btw I said more twisted and calulating , which it demonstrably would be

 

lol the board's extreme leftie strikes again. Ah the poor little mites, must not go against their human rights eh?

They were and will be for the rest of their lives brutal and sadistic child killers. The USA has the right stance on this, it's called the death penalty.

 

Right, first off, just stop being an argumentative arsehole.

Let me explain.

When this appalling crime happened, I didn't have kids.
I was abhorred by what happened but to be really honest it didn't hit a chord with me.
It was 'just' another nasty crime involving kids - I had more important (to me) things happening in my life.

Now I have kids, and re-visiting a crime such as this feels somewhat worse, thinking what it would be like to happen to your own little ones.



So don't give me all that $hit that it's a 'pointless and vacuous way to debate' - you are just way to quick to jump on people from your Ivory Tower.

 

They were child, child killers. I don't think the US kills children. They might be adults now, they were children at the time.

Do you think your kids will kill another child?

 

How is anything I've said 'lefty'. Is that you just admitting you don't have any sort of coherent argument here?

So your argument goes something like this...it's wrong to torture and murder children...unless the state does it, then it's OK?

 

Err I believe you were busting for the argument by your earlier comment. Implying that I didn't have kids and therefore my views were invalid.
Maybe I should of let it slide, but then again I am 'an argumentative *******'.

 

Fantastically put

 

As for the argument on paedos and child killers having terrible upbringings do you think that can be said of Ronnie Barkers Son who I believe was due to be charged with child pornography offences before his disappearance? So how does your argument stand up with that fact or are you suggesting Ronnie Barker and his wife must have been terrible abusive parents for one of their 3 kids to indulge in child ****?

 

Read what I posted. There was no suggestion, merely the fact I thought your comment was bollocks, which it was, and which others obviously agree with. I have made zilch suggestion... I argued your logic of thinking a premeditated punishment was more sick and twisted than that of two pre-pubescent children torturing and murdering a toddler!

 

Maybe it was all those 'four candles' 'Fork Handles' type gags he did it, or all that cross-dressing?

The fact are though that the abused to very often become abusers, that's not some left wing conspiracy btw and I know it doesn't fit comfortably with our sense of outrage when something terrible happens.

 

I've been around long enough on here to see many of your leftie arguments, not just this one. The fact remains that the two Bulger killers are sadistic child murderers. That is the lowest crime of all and deserves the most severe punishment. What they did was evil, it wasn't a bit of rough play that went wrong or just bullying, it was planned and sustained torture and then murder of a toddler. There is no help for anyone who can do that no matter what their age because to be that sadistic they are always going to be that way inclined.

If you can't tell the difference between what they did and capital punishment for the most serious crime possible then you really are a sad individual.

 

At the moment, no.
They're only 9 and 6.

Who knows what the future brings.

I wasn't a manic depressive when I was a kid. Now....

I wasn't looking for an argument.

But through experience I can see (and have explained) it through the eyes of those with and those without, kids.

It may come as a surprise to you, but I think most people see the world differently when they are parents.

 

Well my view is that a premeditated punishment, effectively held over 2 children for 8 years, by supposedly rational adults is clearly more twisted and calcualted. Let's just respectively agree that we think each others view on this are 'bollocks'

 

Just goes to show how fuking pointless it is trying to have a grown conversation with juveniles

I'm going to ignore you from now on, please do the same to me

 

Oh pick your toys up you pathetic child. You are the one showing yourself up for not being able to put together a sensible reply.

 

Ronnie Barker's son was an adult.

Something can and does go wrong with adults that we are unable to explain. However, we don't know he wasn't exposed to something as a child. Maybe with counselling he will be able to find out why he chose this path and found not stop himself.

A normal child does not kill another child at 10 years old. Something went wrong in their lives for this to happen.

I'm not looking for an argument, but I have been exposed to some of this and as a consequence understand childhood behaviour a (very) little bit.

 

When committed by an adult I agree.

 

Who gives a **** what happened to Venables as a child.

He's taking the ****ing **** out of us all just now.

Release him to the mob - ASAP.

He'll finally know that he's not a ****ing b list celebrity.

 

OK look I have let myself get bad-tempered on this thread (something I said to myself I wouldn't do). Anyway I misunderstood your comment and apologise for jumping off the deep-end, something I would get grumpy with my kids for ironically

 

I'll just throw an idea out there....it might stop it happening again.

No, wait. Rather thank stop it, and try and understand it. We can have another case, and lynch them later in life.

Yay, way more fun!

 

Well, if anything is going to get the SN massif frothing at the mouth it'd be a thread like this.

(And Muslims/Islam, lorry drivers, wimmins, Post Office.... ad infinitum.... )

 

We'll also agree that my views are clearly in the majority whilst yours....

 

Not sure how you can say that. But in the desire to cool the debate off a bit then fine. Sometimes the minority are all that stands between sanity and anarchy.
I do find it difficult to try hold a reasoned debate on such an emotive issue. Maybe it's my style of posting, I don't know, I do seem to draw the fire a bit. It's funny though how being (wrongly) branded as a 'lefty' puts me almost on a par with child killers and paedos though.
I do understand the emotion believe me, I just don't think we should allow ourselves into the pit just because some seriously disturbed kids did.