intercooler test
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From: The Terry Crews of moderation. P P P P P P POWER!!
Well put. We all have different priorities from a car and different subjective driving experiences. If we were all the same, a) there would only be one car on the market and b) what a boring world it would be 
Having tried both routes, I found that an uprated TMIC currently suits my driving priorities and preferences but equally, if I owned a Classic, or ran significantly more power or used the car on the track, that would undoubtedly change.
Having tried both routes, I found that an uprated TMIC currently suits my driving priorities and preferences but equally, if I owned a Classic, or ran significantly more power or used the car on the track, that would undoubtedly change.I'm afraid you're misremembering my location: I'm down sarf! However, if I venture into your area, you can show me what the MD321 can do!
The lag thing is interesting: it's definitely a personal thing; if you're used to NA cars then you're probably very sensitive to any kind of delay.
I think there may be an element of perception of lag over actual lag though. One thing I noticed when going from to TMIC to FMIC was the increased induction noise. So you'd hear really hear the turbo start to spool with the latter whereas it would be masked with the former.
This could hoodwink you into thinking: "I can hear something happening, but I can't feel it, therefore that must be lag"
Of course that's not to say that there is any more lag, just that you are more aware of the turbo noise before it's actually girded its loins!
Ns04
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From: The Terry Crews of moderation. P P P P P P POWER!!
Lag between gear change and boost = about 1 month!
Ian : You have email.
Chris : Your question has been substantially overlooked.
Reversing the inlet manifold results in the throttle body at the front of the engine and therefore the route from the front mount core to the inlet manifold is 18" to 2' shorter. The turbo to intercooler core tract remains the same. The theory is that this improves throttle response or reduces lag.
In my experience it is a lot of work for no discernable gain and it is another mod that seems to have been a fad without there being actual proof as to a measurable benefit. I guess there must be some benefit but in my experience it is so small that it cannot be measured sensibly or easily.
If you do a search you will find projects on reversing the inlet manifold and see the amount of work involved.
Chris : Your question has been substantially overlooked.
Reversing the inlet manifold results in the throttle body at the front of the engine and therefore the route from the front mount core to the inlet manifold is 18" to 2' shorter. The turbo to intercooler core tract remains the same. The theory is that this improves throttle response or reduces lag.
In my experience it is a lot of work for no discernable gain and it is another mod that seems to have been a fad without there being actual proof as to a measurable benefit. I guess there must be some benefit but in my experience it is so small that it cannot be measured sensibly or easily.
If you do a search you will find projects on reversing the inlet manifold and see the amount of work involved.
I think there may be an element of perception of lag over actual lag though. One thing I noticed when going from to TMIC to FMIC was the increased induction noise. So you'd hear really hear the turbo start to spool with the latter whereas it would be masked with the former.
This could hoodwink you into thinking: "I can hear something happening, but I can't feel it, therefore that must be lag"
Of course that's not to say that there is any more lag, just that you are more aware of the turbo noise before it's actually girded its loins!
Ns04
This could hoodwink you into thinking: "I can hear something happening, but I can't feel it, therefore that must be lag"
Of course that's not to say that there is any more lag, just that you are more aware of the turbo noise before it's actually girded its loins!
Ns04
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From: @Junc 12, M40 Warwicksh; 01926 614522 CV33 9PL -Use 9GX for Satnav. South Mids Alcatek ECu dealer
For £3250.00 I can shorten the ' lag ' to 14 days .
Merry Xmas people all the best in 2010 David
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From: @Junc 12, M40 Warwicksh; 01926 614522 CV33 9PL -Use 9GX for Satnav. South Mids Alcatek ECu dealer
Typical answer from Bob " don't know, don't care "
As Harvey says, he's right on the button. On thing to remember is that when reversing an inlet manifold, using heatproof spacers , that there is very limited clearance between the top of the throttle body housing, the idle control valve and the bonnet.
Quite easy over a bump, to ding your bonnet.
We don't do many of them, in fact we're doing one now - more for looks than performance gain. It is a right ball ache making all the pipes and repositioning everything. No chance of running air con with a reversed manifold. Because of all the model variants, no one makes a set of pipes off the shelf they are all bespoke. RCM do the alternator repositioning kit which helps a lot.
And, after all said and paid for; the gain is very little and probably not value for money.
Good luck - David
If I promote flat shifting for you will I get a commission
Merry Christmas to you
See you in Jan
Steve
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From: 392/361 MY04 STi
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have to say im rather disapointed with this responce. i expected more david, after all, prodrive can do the box in a rally car in 20 mins,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
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From: @Junc 12, M40 Warwicksh; 01926 614522 CV33 9PL -Use 9GX for Satnav. South Mids Alcatek ECu dealer
The Prodrive lot are better paid than my elves.
Anyway, I wanna tell you a story.....
One of my senior engine builders was headhunted by Prodrive. When he was at APi his workload was 2 engines per week, no matter which model.
When he started in the Gp n engine shop at Prodrive the guys already building engines advised him to slow down, as he managed to take 4 days to do an engine [ their way ] They were regularly taking 10 days [ per engine - to take a new one to bits and blueprint it ] and didn't need the boat rocking .......
A bit later a lady from personnel was finishing off all the B/s paperwork that company's like Prodrive create. In the personnel file was a question: Why did you leave you previous employment? So she rang me and asked why Pete had left and was rather taken aback at my comment " Cos you lot F***ing nicked him, click brrrrrrrrr.
David
Anyway, I wanna tell you a story.....
One of my senior engine builders was headhunted by Prodrive. When he was at APi his workload was 2 engines per week, no matter which model.
When he started in the Gp n engine shop at Prodrive the guys already building engines advised him to slow down, as he managed to take 4 days to do an engine [ their way ] They were regularly taking 10 days [ per engine - to take a new one to bits and blueprint it ] and didn't need the boat rocking .......
A bit later a lady from personnel was finishing off all the B/s paperwork that company's like Prodrive create. In the personnel file was a question: Why did you leave you previous employment? So she rang me and asked why Pete had left and was rather taken aback at my comment " Cos you lot F***ing nicked him, click brrrrrrrrr.
David
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From: The Terry Crews of moderation. P P P P P P POWER!!
Have I got it wrong?
SteveblueWRX:
I have every confidence in the product and you need a GDB kit, not GT2.
The GDB core is the lesser performer of all the Hybrid cores but even so I have absolutely no reservation.
What I am prepared to do is sell you an ACT guage £80 inclusive of postage and when you have had that fitted I am happy to sell you an FMIC at a good price and you can report on charge temperatures. The ACT guage need to be fitted on the underside of the STi 8 TMIC close to the exit to the throttle body and on that centre line. The sensor on the GDB hard pipe should similarly be close to the throttle body mounted in the hard pipe.
If you want to go further than that and turn it in to a proper fact finding exercise we can look at that.
Who maps your car? We might even be able to devise a test to determine if there is any noticable lag and it is dead easy to clock where you achieve 1 bar in 5th ie. at what RPM with the TMIC and ditto with the FMIC.
There needs to be control over tyre pressure, car weight and fuel and we need to take note of the ambient on each of the days on which the tests are conducted so that meaningful information is gathered.
I have every confidence in the product and you need a GDB kit, not GT2.
The GDB core is the lesser performer of all the Hybrid cores but even so I have absolutely no reservation.
What I am prepared to do is sell you an ACT guage £80 inclusive of postage and when you have had that fitted I am happy to sell you an FMIC at a good price and you can report on charge temperatures. The ACT guage need to be fitted on the underside of the STi 8 TMIC close to the exit to the throttle body and on that centre line. The sensor on the GDB hard pipe should similarly be close to the throttle body mounted in the hard pipe.
If you want to go further than that and turn it in to a proper fact finding exercise we can look at that.
Who maps your car? We might even be able to devise a test to determine if there is any noticable lag and it is dead easy to clock where you achieve 1 bar in 5th ie. at what RPM with the TMIC and ditto with the FMIC.
There needs to be control over tyre pressure, car weight and fuel and we need to take note of the ambient on each of the days on which the tests are conducted so that meaningful information is gathered.
Sounds like a plan to me. Can you send me details of the ACT gauge (with pictures etc) and take it from there.
Need to think on the FMIC idea as I have some out goings start of the year so next time I can test is around April/May.
My mapper will be JGM as he is the best mapper for my needs.
Cheers
Steve
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Ian : You have email.
Chris : Your question has been substantially overlooked.
Reversing the inlet manifold results in the throttle body at the front of the engine and therefore the route from the front mount core to the inlet manifold is 18" to 2' shorter. The turbo to intercooler core tract remains the same. The theory is that this improves throttle response or reduces lag.
In my experience it is a lot of work for no discernable gain and it is another mod that seems to have been a fad without there being actual proof as to a measurable benefit. I guess there must be some benefit but in my experience it is so small that it cannot be measured sensibly or easily.
If you do a search you will find projects on reversing the inlet manifold and see the amount of work involved.
Chris : Your question has been substantially overlooked.
Reversing the inlet manifold results in the throttle body at the front of the engine and therefore the route from the front mount core to the inlet manifold is 18" to 2' shorter. The turbo to intercooler core tract remains the same. The theory is that this improves throttle response or reduces lag.
In my experience it is a lot of work for no discernable gain and it is another mod that seems to have been a fad without there being actual proof as to a measurable benefit. I guess there must be some benefit but in my experience it is so small that it cannot be measured sensibly or easily.
If you do a search you will find projects on reversing the inlet manifold and see the amount of work involved.
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Typical answer from Bob " don't know, don't care "
As Harvey says, he's right on the button. On thing to remember is that when reversing an inlet manifold, using heatproof spacers , that there is very limited clearance between the top of the throttle body housing, the idle control valve and the bonnet.
Quite easy over a bump, to ding your bonnet.
We don't do many of them, in fact we're doing one now - more for looks than performance gain. It is a right ball ache making all the pipes and repositioning everything. No chance of running air con with a reversed manifold. Because of all the model variants, no one makes a set of pipes off the shelf they are all bespoke. RCM do the alternator repositioning kit which helps a lot.
And, after all said and paid for; the gain is very little and probably not value for money.
Good luck - David
As Harvey says, he's right on the button. On thing to remember is that when reversing an inlet manifold, using heatproof spacers , that there is very limited clearance between the top of the throttle body housing, the idle control valve and the bonnet.
Quite easy over a bump, to ding your bonnet.
We don't do many of them, in fact we're doing one now - more for looks than performance gain. It is a right ball ache making all the pipes and repositioning everything. No chance of running air con with a reversed manifold. Because of all the model variants, no one makes a set of pipes off the shelf they are all bespoke. RCM do the alternator repositioning kit which helps a lot.
And, after all said and paid for; the gain is very little and probably not value for money.
Good luck - David
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 23,118
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From: Notts
The Prodrive lot are better paid than my elves.
Anyway, I wanna tell you a story.....
One of my senior engine builders was headhunted by Prodrive. When he was at APi his workload was 2 engines per week, no matter which model.
When he started in the Gp n engine shop at Prodrive the guys already building engines advised him to slow down, as he managed to take 4 days to do an engine [ their way ] They were regularly taking 10 days [ per engine - to take a new one to bits and blueprint it ] and didn't need the boat rocking .......
A bit later a lady from personnel was finishing off all the B/s paperwork that company's like Prodrive create. In the personnel file was a question: Why did you leave you previous employment? So she rang me and asked why Pete had left and was rather taken aback at my comment " Cos you lot F***ing nicked him, click brrrrrrrrr.
David
Anyway, I wanna tell you a story.....
One of my senior engine builders was headhunted by Prodrive. When he was at APi his workload was 2 engines per week, no matter which model.
When he started in the Gp n engine shop at Prodrive the guys already building engines advised him to slow down, as he managed to take 4 days to do an engine [ their way ] They were regularly taking 10 days [ per engine - to take a new one to bits and blueprint it ] and didn't need the boat rocking .......
A bit later a lady from personnel was finishing off all the B/s paperwork that company's like Prodrive create. In the personnel file was a question: Why did you leave you previous employment? So she rang me and asked why Pete had left and was rather taken aback at my comment " Cos you lot F***ing nicked him, click brrrrrrrrr.
David
all big companies don't know what there **** or elbow is doing
Steve: I will email photos of the ACT guage and installation per your profile in the next day or two.
Cheers guys. Have a Happy Christmas and may 2010 be kind to you and yours.
Lang may yer lum reek.
Cheers guys. Have a Happy Christmas and may 2010 be kind to you and yours.
Lang may yer lum reek.
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I got lost half way through the thread but may I thank Harvey for helping me install my Hybrid GT2. The front mount was not bought from him and had absolutely nothing do with him but still offered a lot of help! I couldn't be more grateful and the guy has a lot of knowledge about these cars. He also helped me over the phone to install injectors. Top man. I would seriously consider his opinions on all things Impreza related!
