Please help ! my insurance has just been cancelled !
19 January 2001, 08:12 PM
#31
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Karlos
I don't drink coffee - it does strange things to me....
What makes you think I was wound up? - you should see me when I am wound up!!! (but I am defensive of the industry I work in, same as you probably are of yours). Lloyd's has never refused to pay a valid claim in over 300 years. Not bad for a bunch of robbing ba5tards
Individual circumstances are all different, but an insurance company does have the right not to pay out if the risk is not as proposed. The fact that many of them do regardless, oh! robbing ba5tards again
I don't drink coffee - it does strange things to me....
What makes you think I was wound up? - you should see me when I am wound up!!! (but I am defensive of the industry I work in, same as you probably are of yours). Lloyd's has never refused to pay a valid claim in over 300 years. Not bad for a bunch of robbing ba5tards
Individual circumstances are all different, but an insurance company does have the right not to pay out if the risk is not as proposed. The fact that many of them do regardless, oh! robbing ba5tards again
19 January 2001, 08:16 PM
#32
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I am calm now
Forgot to thank Logic Lee for his kind offer of the exhaust cheersey mate.
Just reading the thread again (Squiz ?) mentioned something, I did tell this insurer I was planning to do some mods to the car when I took the insurance out (to include a chip wheels exhaust etc) and was told all I needed to do was inform them and they would recalculate the premium ..... I wish I had recorded that conversation
Lol @ Carolyn thankyou for injecting some humour into this most depressing (for me !) thread, you diamond !
Mike - you star, I am a pratt as usual - your not going to start charging for all this advice are you ?
Have a large bottle of a very fine single malt sitting next to me .... (hic)
Really cheers to everyone for replying. Your replies (OK not all ) were very helpful cheers lads.
Forgot to thank Logic Lee for his kind offer of the exhaust cheersey mate.
Just reading the thread again (Squiz ?) mentioned something, I did tell this insurer I was planning to do some mods to the car when I took the insurance out (to include a chip wheels exhaust etc) and was told all I needed to do was inform them and they would recalculate the premium ..... I wish I had recorded that conversation
Lol @ Carolyn
thankyou for injecting some humour into this most depressing (for me !) thread, you diamond !Mike - you star, I am a pratt as usual - your not going to start charging for all this advice are you ?
Have a large bottle of a very fine single malt sitting next to me .... (hic)
Really cheers to everyone for replying. Your replies (OK not all
) were very helpful cheers lads.
19 January 2001, 09:30 PM
#34
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hey good news, glad you are gonna be back on the road. 
Next step is to specifically ask re each mod whether they are willing to accept it, and what the implications are. This may be increased premium and/or increased excess.
Ive found myself previously that the best time to do mods is just before renewal, so that you can look for the best deal.
2 things to remember, the broker will often have an admin charge, so a slight premium increase may have £20/£30 maybe more added to cover the brokers time.
Secondly, most ins cos work off 1 of 2 methods, a straight % loading based on value of mods, e.g. 15% of cost of mods as extra premium, or a proper review by someone at the ins co who knows what effect something has. If your doing expensive mods that do little to performance you want the later, and vice versa.
and before you ask, yes I do work in the industry. So feel free to have a pop if it makes you feel better!
And if you want to know who to really blame for increases in premium, look in 3 directions.
1. Labour government as they said health service had to recover road accident costs from ins cos. (a stealth tax)
2. The claims companies you see everywhere, saying "sue anyone, no win no fee"
3. The motor companies. They now have much more expensive and usually colour coded bumpers, so a minor knock is often easily £400-£500 per car.
If only the motor insurance business did generate some profit I may actually get my bonus
As for adding bits to a car, yes it impacts how people view it. Its tricky without actually seeing a car to tell what impact a cosmetic change makes. I sprayed the front underskirt of my old celica white, and suddenly everyone started asking where I got the body kit from!
1 thing you can take a risk on is if its a second hand car, is that you can add a few minor bits, and claim they were previously done to the car (e.g lights!!). Bear in mind if the bits look brand new, and youve had the car 3 years it aint gonna wash. You are unlikely to have a problem with this, but I wouldnt risk it myself.
People do sell cars modified without declaring them. I flogged my old celica with
HKS exhaust
fully balanced, lightened and shot peened crank, and rods, balanced pistons
skimmed block, reprofiled to secret spec development long duration cams
koni suspension (although not cavalier spec obviously), upgraded brakes, K&N filter
for all I know, that car is insured as standard!
robski
Next step is to specifically ask re each mod whether they are willing to accept it, and what the implications are. This may be increased premium and/or increased excess.
Ive found myself previously that the best time to do mods is just before renewal, so that you can look for the best deal.
2 things to remember, the broker will often have an admin charge, so a slight premium increase may have £20/£30 maybe more added to cover the brokers time.
Secondly, most ins cos work off 1 of 2 methods, a straight % loading based on value of mods, e.g. 15% of cost of mods as extra premium, or a proper review by someone at the ins co who knows what effect something has. If your doing expensive mods that do little to performance you want the later, and vice versa.
and before you ask, yes I do work in the industry. So feel free to have a pop if it makes you feel better!
And if you want to know who to really blame for increases in premium, look in 3 directions.
1. Labour government as they said health service had to recover road accident costs from ins cos. (a stealth tax)
2. The claims companies you see everywhere, saying "sue anyone, no win no fee"
3. The motor companies. They now have much more expensive and usually colour coded bumpers, so a minor knock is often easily £400-£500 per car.
If only the motor insurance business did generate some profit I may actually get my bonus
As for adding bits to a car, yes it impacts how people view it. Its tricky without actually seeing a car to tell what impact a cosmetic change makes. I sprayed the front underskirt of my old celica white, and suddenly everyone started asking where I got the body kit from!
1 thing you can take a risk on is if its a second hand car, is that you can add a few minor bits, and claim they were previously done to the car (e.g lights!!). Bear in mind if the bits look brand new, and youve had the car 3 years it aint gonna wash. You are unlikely to have a problem with this, but I wouldnt risk it myself.
People do sell cars modified without declaring them. I flogged my old celica with
HKS exhaust
fully balanced, lightened and shot peened crank, and rods, balanced pistons
skimmed block, reprofiled to secret spec development long duration cams
koni suspension (although not cavalier spec obviously), upgraded brakes, K&N filter
for all I know, that car is insured as standard!
robski
19 January 2001, 09:38 PM
#35
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Gary Foster:
<B>Ps Dave - your all a bunch of robbing barstewards lol[/quote]
Gary
PS - the moral is tell them first next time and save yourself a load of grief!!
<B>Ps Dave - your all a bunch of robbing barstewards
lol[/quote] Gary
PS - the moral is tell them first next time and save yourself a load of grief!!
19 January 2001, 09:53 PM
#36
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Thanks for the info Robski, I won't be making that mistake again in a hurry
It never occured to me that I might not be covered, I assumed there would be a cost increase (in fact there will be no extra charge now ) but due to the nature of the mods, and the fact that I've done far more extreme things to other cars in the past I wasn't expecting a problem. Silly me.
My previous car was loaded for engine mods based on the %increase over standard BHP - seemed fair and I assumed (again) this was a standard thing.
We'll it's lucky the previous owner didn't fit a 2.2 conversion without telling me thats all I can say ... (I wish !)
Still can't see how a set of springs, exhaust and air filter causes my car to become suddenly uninsurable - I would expect this from a chip upgrade, ho hum.
I'd be careful what you all tick on the options list - I also haven't told them about my car mats or collection of CD's I keep in the car ... I'm terrified to tell them now.
Gary
Ps Had a friend who went through a 'no claim etc' co for a little prang, cost twice as much as it should have to get fixed. Grrr
Seeing as your griping these are my three big annoyances
1) The whole NCB scheme - What a rip off ! only a complete year with the same insurer counting ! This smells fishy
2) You must get your windscreen replaced / car repaired at our authorised dealer dodgy bobs garage
3) Brokers getting ****ty with you for breaking the above rule / bypassing them and dealing with your ins co direct (I didn't know ! you could have supplied some info such as 'what to do in the event of a claim'
Gary
It never occured to me that I might not be covered, I assumed there would be a cost increase (in fact there will be no extra charge now
) but due to the nature of the mods, and the fact that I've done far more extreme things to other cars in the past I wasn't expecting a problem. Silly me.My previous car was loaded for engine mods based on the %increase over standard BHP - seemed fair and I assumed (again) this was a standard thing.
We'll it's lucky the previous owner didn't fit a 2.2 conversion without telling me thats all I can say ... (I wish !)
Still can't see how a set of springs, exhaust and air filter causes my car to become suddenly uninsurable - I would expect this from a chip upgrade, ho hum.
I'd be careful what you all tick on the options list - I also haven't told them about my car mats or collection of CD's I keep in the car ... I'm terrified to tell them now.
Gary
Ps Had a friend who went through a 'no claim etc' co for a little prang, cost twice as much as it should have to get fixed. Grrr
Seeing as your griping
these are my three big annoyances1) The whole NCB scheme - What a rip off ! only a complete year with the same insurer counting ! This smells fishy
2) You must get your windscreen replaced / car repaired at our authorised dealer dodgy bobs garage
3) Brokers getting ****ty with you for breaking the above rule / bypassing them and dealing with your ins co direct (I didn't know ! you could have supplied some info such as 'what to do in the event of a claim'
Gary
19 January 2001, 10:02 PM
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Dave
rest assured, I shall not be making this mistake again !! I don't think my ulcer would stand up to the stress again
Aren't I lucky to have all these friends who actually understand insurance
rest assured, I shall not be making this mistake again !! I don't think my ulcer would stand up to the stress again
Aren't I lucky to have all these friends who actually understand insurance
19 January 2001, 10:09 PM
#38
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Gary
The fundamental part of insurance is that it works on a basis of utmost good faith - and the onus is on the individual to tell insurers of any material facts that may change the risk. It states this on the proposal form - before the signed declaration - but sadly nobody ever reads it.....not lecturing, just the facts.
It's frequently not the mods themselves that cause the trouble but the fact that people don't check in advance.
NCB - has to work on an annual basis - otherwise you could cover yourself for three months, cancel, claim your NCB, go to another insurer, do this four times in total and claim four years NCB in one year.....
[This message has been edited by Dave T-S (edited 19 January 2001).]
The fundamental part of insurance is that it works on a basis of utmost good faith - and the onus is on the individual to tell insurers of any material facts that may change the risk. It states this on the proposal form - before the signed declaration - but sadly nobody ever reads it.....not lecturing, just the facts.
It's frequently not the mods themselves that cause the trouble but the fact that people don't check in advance.
NCB - has to work on an annual basis - otherwise you could cover yourself for three months, cancel, claim your NCB, go to another insurer, do this four times in total and claim four years NCB in one year.....
[This message has been edited by Dave T-S (edited 19 January 2001).]
19 January 2001, 10:23 PM
#39
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Dave
No I get that about the NCB thingy. What I meant was, if I was insured through (say) Hill House Hammond for 6 months, then had to cancel the policy and insure through (for example) AXA, 6 Months later, I would not be able to claim 1 years NCB, even though I had been claim free for 12 months.
See ? It's happened to me 3 times now (so I'm over 1.5 years behind despite no claims)
Gary
Please tell me this is wrong as I could do with getting the extra 1.5 year NCB !!
No I get that about the NCB thingy. What I meant was, if I was insured through (say) Hill House Hammond for 6 months, then had to cancel the policy and insure through (for example) AXA, 6 Months later, I would not be able to claim 1 years NCB, even though I had been claim free for 12 months.
See ? It's happened to me 3 times now (so I'm over 1.5 years behind despite no claims)
Gary
Please tell me this is wrong as I could do with getting the extra 1.5 year NCB !!
19 January 2001, 10:39 PM
#40
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Gary
Unfortunately NCB only works on an annual basis with each individual insurer as they keep their own statistics. Insurance policies are also geared up to work on an annual basis. Their pricing is based on this and anything less increases costs (or increases their loss as motor insurers aren't making profits). You can't stack up 6 months each with two insurers as one year total NCB.
The reasons are complicated, and historic, but if you cancel before a year is up then effectively you haven't fulfilled your contract to purchase a policy for a year as originally agreed. If you don't fulfil your part of the contract you won't get the NCB. It is difficult for insurers to calculate the experience of a policy (premium -v- claims) on a comparison basis for less than a year. You can't pro-rate it over a year cos you either do or don't have a claim in a full year but you might or might not have a claim in two six month periods with either of two insurers that make up one year in total. It is actually quite a complicated scenario.
The thing is not to run policies for less than a year (and just as a matter of interest why have you cancelled policies three times??) - you will be penalised twice if you do this because not only do you lose NCB but you will not get pro-rata return premium so end up paying more.
[This message has been edited by Dave T-S (edited 19 January 2001).]
Unfortunately NCB only works on an annual basis with each individual insurer as they keep their own statistics. Insurance policies are also geared up to work on an annual basis. Their pricing is based on this and anything less increases costs (or increases their loss as motor insurers aren't making profits). You can't stack up 6 months each with two insurers as one year total NCB.
The reasons are complicated, and historic, but if you cancel before a year is up then effectively you haven't fulfilled your contract to purchase a policy for a year as originally agreed. If you don't fulfil your part of the contract you won't get the NCB. It is difficult for insurers to calculate the experience of a policy (premium -v- claims) on a comparison basis for less than a year. You can't pro-rate it over a year cos you either do or don't have a claim in a full year but you might or might not have a claim in two six month periods with either of two insurers that make up one year in total. It is actually quite a complicated scenario.
The thing is not to run policies for less than a year (and just as a matter of interest why have you cancelled policies three times??) - you will be penalised twice if you do this because not only do you lose NCB but you will not get pro-rata return premium so end up paying more.
[This message has been edited by Dave T-S (edited 19 January 2001).]
20 January 2001, 12:46 AM
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All three times I have had to change insurers part way through a policy have been because I was changing my car and they were unwilling to insure me on the new one.
I was going through the same broker but as the insurance co changed ..
Yes every time I cancel I do not get a full refund of the money I've paid out.
In the last 4 years I have paid out in excess of 7K on insurance (includes 1 bump which I paid for), but (except for windscreens) never cost the insurance guys anything.
Call me mr synical, but I see the NCB thing as a con. You manage 4 years no accidents then can protect your no claims and have a few accidents at little cost to yourself. Had you had those same accidents before the 4 years were up it would cost you *big* most likely many thousands of pounds.
But to a simpleton like myself, both drivers would appear to be of equal (bad) risk ? so why the massive difference in cost ?
Gary
I was going through the same broker but as the insurance co changed ..
Yes every time I cancel I do not get a full refund of the money I've paid out.
In the last 4 years I have paid out in excess of 7K on insurance (includes 1 bump which I paid for), but (except for windscreens) never cost the insurance guys anything.
Call me mr synical, but I see the NCB thing as a con. You manage 4 years no accidents then can protect your no claims and have a few accidents at little cost to yourself. Had you had those same accidents before the 4 years were up it would cost you *big* most likely many thousands of pounds.
But to a simpleton like myself, both drivers would appear to be of equal (bad) risk ? so why the massive difference in cost ?
Gary
20 January 2001, 09:47 AM
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I see some embers here and have some octane booster handy, so...
...sadly Gary, it is not all over yet. As Dave T-S says, insurance is based on contracts set in good faith. The key thing with mods is that you MUST advise your insurer before you have them fitted.
As you have now had an insurance policy cancelled, you are likely to have increased premiums in the future, or proposals declined. You will see on all proposal forms that you are required to advise your insurer if you have ever had a policy cancelled or insurance refused.
The insurer will then apply a premium loading as in their view, you are less trusted than someone who hasn't.
Also, Dave T-S underestimates the possible problem, you may not just be sued for fixing a car, but possibly a seven figure third party personal injury claim - and when it gets serious, insurers will look to ensure that they are liable to pay.
Us insurance boys have said this lots of times on this board - irrespective of whether you think insurers are barstewards, TELL THEM ABOUT YOUR MODS - ANYTHING THAT CHANGES YOUR CAR FROM THE MANUFACTURERS SPEC!
Cheers,
R
...sadly Gary, it is not all over yet. As Dave T-S says, insurance is based on contracts set in good faith. The key thing with mods is that you MUST advise your insurer before you have them fitted.
As you have now had an insurance policy cancelled, you are likely to have increased premiums in the future, or proposals declined. You will see on all proposal forms that you are required to advise your insurer if you have ever had a policy cancelled or insurance refused.
The insurer will then apply a premium loading as in their view, you are less trusted than someone who hasn't.
Also, Dave T-S underestimates the possible problem, you may not just be sued for fixing a car, but possibly a seven figure third party personal injury claim - and when it gets serious, insurers will look to ensure that they are liable to pay.
Us insurance boys have said this lots of times on this board - irrespective of whether you think insurers are barstewards, TELL THEM ABOUT YOUR MODS - ANYTHING THAT CHANGES YOUR CAR FROM THE MANUFACTURERS SPEC!
Cheers,
R
20 January 2001, 12:34 PM
#45
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...Skiing.... Hope you've got accident insurance!
Do you have to say how competant a skiier you are? Do you get NCB for not falling A.O.T for a year.... :-)
HEY! Hope you've declared those special skiboots!
LOL!
Karlos
Do you have to say how competant a skiier you are? Do you get NCB for not falling A.O.T for a year.... :-)
HEY! Hope you've declared those special skiboots!
LOL!
Karlos
20 January 2001, 02:06 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>value of mods, e.g. 15% of cost of mods as extra premium, or a proper review by someone at the ins co who knows what effect something has. If your doing expensive mods that do little to performance you want the later, and vice versa.[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Robski, Jus a qwik 1 4 u seen as u r the man in the know Can it be argued then that mods such as traction control, morrette twin lamps & uprated brakes on a WRX are then for safety an therefore shouldn`t incurr an increase in premium?
Whats the chances of givin us an idea of what does / doesn`t incurr increases?
Cheerz m8.
Robski, Jus a qwik 1 4 u seen as u r the man in the know
Can it be argued then that mods such as traction control, morrette twin lamps & uprated brakes on a WRX are then for safety an therefore shouldn`t incurr an increase in premium? Whats the chances of givin us an idea of what does / doesn`t incurr increases?
Cheerz m8.
20 January 2001, 05:29 PM
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I think telling insurers about things like bump-steer and little things like that is just opening up an uneccessarily wiggly can of worms.
Of course, my insurers know about everything I've done.
Stef.
Of course, my insurers know about everything I've done.
Stef.
20 January 2001, 07:35 PM
#49
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Just wondering if they know about this type of mod (bumpsteer + ALK) and would be bothered to check a crashed scoob for it....
Lets just say I'm trying to find a way to ask my insurers how these mods would effect my policy (if I did it
) without giving them the can opener
Lets just say I'm trying to find a way to ask my insurers how these mods would effect my policy (if I did it
) without giving them the can opener
20 January 2001, 09:44 PM
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Perhaps our insurance bods can tell us to what extent crashed/stolen cars are examined re fitted mods ?? How about non standard or chipped ECUs for example - surely they don't go as far as checking things like this for crashed/stolen cars, maybe if the engine had let go bigtime....
An induction filter would be a lot more obvious but how about uprated brakes ?? As long as the callipers are not some outlandish shade of purple they won't have a clue. Bump steer mod - no way will our man spot this. Backbox is going to be obvious only if our man is well clued up on scoobies. Larger rear wings than standard may be obvious to most of us, but only because we know the score. I'd love to know how good these guys are at spotting the small differences between what's standard and what's not.
Anyone out there had any major undisclosed mods that have been missed after a claim ??
Having been shafted twice by insurance companies (I was insured under one large company where my policy started about 6 minutes before the f*****s went under costing me about £1500 which I have yet to see a penny of compensation) I'm a tad biased. And still angry !
Neil - standard, or non-standard UK scoob depending on who I'm talking to.
An induction filter would be a lot more obvious but how about uprated brakes ?? As long as the callipers are not some outlandish shade of purple they won't have a clue. Bump steer mod - no way will our man spot this. Backbox is going to be obvious only if our man is well clued up on scoobies. Larger rear wings than standard may be obvious to most of us, but only because we know the score. I'd love to know how good these guys are at spotting the small differences between what's standard and what's not.
Anyone out there had any major undisclosed mods that have been missed after a claim ??
Having been shafted twice by insurance companies (I was insured under one large company where my policy started about 6 minutes before the f*****s went under costing me about £1500 which I have yet to see a penny of compensation) I'm a tad biased. And still angry !
Neil - standard, or non-standard UK scoob depending on who I'm talking to.
20 January 2001, 10:21 PM
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Rannoch
You say above:
"You will see on all proposal forms that you are required to advise your insurer if you have ever had a policy cancelled or insurance refused."
Yep, my latest proposal form says exactly that.
So...if I've already phoned up and asked anoth ins. co. for a quote for a Scoob with mods, and the insurance company says "No, we can't cover you because of the mods", does that count as "insurance refused" and you then have to tell every insurer in the future about it????
..can't believe this is true, so what does "insurance refused" really mean??
PS I know this should be in another forum, but we seem to be doing fine right here
You say above:
"You will see on all proposal forms that you are required to advise your insurer if you have ever had a policy cancelled or insurance refused."
Yep, my latest proposal form says exactly that.
So...if I've already phoned up and asked anoth ins. co. for a quote for a Scoob with mods, and the insurance company says "No, we can't cover you because of the mods", does that count as "insurance refused" and you then have to tell every insurer in the future about it????
..can't believe this is true, so what does "insurance refused" really mean??
PS I know this should be in another forum, but we seem to be doing fine right here
21 January 2001, 12:14 AM
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PeterPerect
I said exactly what they were when I wrote to them, ie bump steer removal and addition of 1 degree of castor (ALK) or something along those lines. They were pissy at first (as I've described) but now are OK with both of those.
I'd side with what Stef has said, there's no way an inspector would notice a shim in the steering rack, or that the wishbone mounting points have been moved a couple of cm.
I also wish I had not disclosed the brakes, you'd have to be a bit of a petrol head to know that MY98's came with 2 pots and MY99's came with 4 pots and they've got Subaru stamped all over them.
I would also be interested in seeing the court case where your insurer is refusing to pay out because you did not inform them of fitting (eg) uprated and safer lighting (PIAA's) to your car. No matter what your policy says I can't honestly see a Jury / Judge coming down on the Insurers side for that.
Anyway, my insurers know everything now
I said exactly what they were when I wrote to them, ie bump steer removal and addition of 1 degree of castor (ALK) or something along those lines. They were pissy at first (as I've described) but now are OK with both of those.
I'd side with what Stef has said, there's no way an inspector would notice a shim in the steering rack, or that the wishbone mounting points have been moved a couple of cm.
I also wish I had not disclosed the brakes, you'd have to be a bit of a petrol head to know that MY98's came with 2 pots and MY99's came with 4 pots and they've got Subaru stamped all over them.
I would also be interested in seeing the court case where your insurer is refusing to pay out because you did not inform them of fitting (eg) uprated and safer lighting (PIAA's) to your car. No matter what your policy says I can't honestly see a Jury / Judge coming down on the Insurers side for that.
Anyway, my insurers know everything now
21 January 2001, 12:34 AM
#53
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Just flicking through the Insurance Ombudsmans site to see if I could find any similar cases they may have dealt with.
There's one where a lady had bought a car with a bodykit and the insurer was refusing to pay out as she had not informed them of this.
Click below and search the page for 'modification'
There's one where a lady had bought a car with a bodykit and the insurer was refusing to pay out as she had not informed them of this.
Click below and search the page for 'modification'
21 January 2001, 10:47 AM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by subverbal:
<B>Perhaps our insurance bods can tell us to what extent crashed/stolen cars are examined re fitted mods ??[/quote]
Don't be forgetting the friendly Police vehicle examiner.........
<B>Perhaps our insurance bods can tell us to what extent crashed/stolen cars are examined re fitted mods ??[/quote]
Don't be forgetting the friendly Police vehicle examiner.........
21 January 2001, 11:07 AM
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AFAIK not being able to get a quotation is not the same as having insurance refused. I am sure that no insurers will take issues because another insurer does not cover that sort of risk.
Having insurance cancelled is clear cut - I think that the refusal clause is merely there to cover all bases.
In terms of an engineer looking over the car after an accident.
If the accident is big and there is likely to be a significant claim, Insurance engineers, and more importantly specialist engineers will be brought in to pull the car apart. And if it is a Subaru, you can be guaranteed that a Subaru engineer will be called upon.
In general the insurance engineers are pretty experienced as that is all they do - there is a network of motor engineers that work for most insurers and this is all they do.
Finally, many mods do not take a genius to spot - I don't think that you need to be a Subaru expert to spot that a standard exhaust with a Scooby badge on it and part nummber has been swapped for something non-OEM.
So think about it, for the majority of incidents your car will not be checked, but for anything major, especially personal injury, everyone will be all over the cars involved. Even if the incident is clearly the other persons fault, and there is a personal injury claim, the third party will do everything to prove that your insurance is not valid or car not roadworthy, and if they can do this they will come after you. No one likes paying out 6 or 7 figure sums if they don't have to.
R
Having insurance cancelled is clear cut - I think that the refusal clause is merely there to cover all bases.
In terms of an engineer looking over the car after an accident.
If the accident is big and there is likely to be a significant claim, Insurance engineers, and more importantly specialist engineers will be brought in to pull the car apart. And if it is a Subaru, you can be guaranteed that a Subaru engineer will be called upon.
In general the insurance engineers are pretty experienced as that is all they do - there is a network of motor engineers that work for most insurers and this is all they do.
Finally, many mods do not take a genius to spot - I don't think that you need to be a Subaru expert to spot that a standard exhaust with a Scooby badge on it and part nummber has been swapped for something non-OEM.
So think about it, for the majority of incidents your car will not be checked, but for anything major, especially personal injury, everyone will be all over the cars involved. Even if the incident is clearly the other persons fault, and there is a personal injury claim, the third party will do everything to prove that your insurance is not valid or car not roadworthy, and if they can do this they will come after you. No one likes paying out 6 or 7 figure sums if they don't have to.
R
21 January 2001, 11:35 AM
#56
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So in the worst case scenario that Rannoch described they would spot the ALK and bump steer shims....changed from manufacturers specification....
So who has managed to declare these mods without raising the insurers alarm bells ???
So who has managed to declare these mods without raising the insurers alarm bells ???
21 January 2001, 01:43 PM
#57
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Dave T-S,
Q.
Is part of our insurance premium to pay for any monatary'retrieval' which may be necessary should a complete prat bump into our pride and joy...
if so and an insurance company failed to do this.....(usually in the scheme booklet it states recovery for damage caused by others)
could put themselves in a precaroius situation.
If not then the sidc and scoobynet might as well form their own insurance firm (dave for Md??)
m.
Q.
Is part of our insurance premium to pay for any monatary'retrieval' which may be necessary should a complete prat bump into our pride and joy...
if so and an insurance company failed to do this.....(usually in the scheme booklet it states recovery for damage caused by others)
could put themselves in a precaroius situation.
If not then the sidc and scoobynet might as well form their own insurance firm (dave for Md??)
m.
22 January 2001, 12:59 AM
#58
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Gary,
one make insurance can be difficult. Insurance is a form of bookmaking and it would be difficult to get a single bookie to deal with all the bets in a specific horse. It is the same with single makes.
Insurers, like bookies, like to balance and/or lay off their risks as much as possible.
Typically, one make insurance is for lower mileage 'weekenders' based around clubs (e.g. Lotus Elise, MG Owners). Although I accept this would not apply to the RSOC. Is Dominion a knowledgeable broker or an underwriter?
Also, for Stis, up until very recently the majority of Stis in the UK were underwritten by Norwich Union - this however led them to carrying the majority of risk and they were 'selected against' i.e. the price of the premium was lower than the cost of the risk. (Basically the National Favourite came in by ten lengths!). Those with NU policies will have noticed a big hike 99 to 00 in premiums. This was driven, in part, by a couple of huge Personal Injury claims on the Scooby portfolio.
Having said all of that, there is a P1 scheme with a very large proportion of the P1s in it, and I have heard rumours of a new Scooby only facility - but only time will tell as I do not have any details at all.
Cheers,
R (off to adjust my cardigan and refill my pipe)
one make insurance can be difficult. Insurance is a form of bookmaking and it would be difficult to get a single bookie to deal with all the bets in a specific horse. It is the same with single makes.
Insurers, like bookies, like to balance and/or lay off their risks as much as possible.
Typically, one make insurance is for lower mileage 'weekenders' based around clubs (e.g. Lotus Elise, MG Owners). Although I accept this would not apply to the RSOC. Is Dominion a knowledgeable broker or an underwriter?
Also, for Stis, up until very recently the majority of Stis in the UK were underwritten by Norwich Union - this however led them to carrying the majority of risk and they were 'selected against' i.e. the price of the premium was lower than the cost of the risk. (Basically the National Favourite came in by ten lengths!). Those with NU policies will have noticed a big hike 99 to 00 in premiums. This was driven, in part, by a couple of huge Personal Injury claims on the Scooby portfolio.
Having said all of that, there is a P1 scheme with a very large proportion of the P1s in it, and I have heard rumours of a new Scooby only facility - but only time will tell as I do not have any details at all.
Cheers,
R (off to adjust my cardigan and refill my pipe)
22 January 2001, 08:37 AM
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subverbal,
sorry I dont know the ins and outs at that level, but they vary from ins co to ins co.
Its likely that things like brakes will be borne in mind if you start modding elsewhere.
1 example I can quote of the lengths gone to to prove who was driving a car: Do you remember that Mclaren F1 that crashed into a tree killing the 3 occupants, the owner being they guy who sold that software company? DNA samples were taken from the remains of the steering wheel, to see if a match could be made to establish who was driving.
As R says, its all to do with the numbers involved. If its a small prang then the chances are you will be ok, but if its a biggie, then experts will be involved, and thats exactly when you want your insurance.
If then can prove that you have not declared a material fact then the likelyhood is that the ins co will still have to pay the claim/damages (due to the road traffic act), but then they will chase you through the courts for the cash, which may be for the rest of your life. Is it worth saving a hundred quid now to avoid a life of virtual poverty?
robski
sorry I dont know the ins and outs at that level, but they vary from ins co to ins co.
Its likely that things like brakes will be borne in mind if you start modding elsewhere.
1 example I can quote of the lengths gone to to prove who was driving a car: Do you remember that Mclaren F1 that crashed into a tree killing the 3 occupants, the owner being they guy who sold that software company? DNA samples were taken from the remains of the steering wheel, to see if a match could be made to establish who was driving.
As R says, its all to do with the numbers involved. If its a small prang then the chances are you will be ok, but if its a biggie, then experts will be involved, and thats exactly when you want your insurance.
If then can prove that you have not declared a material fact then the likelyhood is that the ins co will still have to pay the claim/damages (due to the road traffic act), but then they will chase you through the courts for the cash, which may be for the rest of your life. Is it worth saving a hundred quid now to avoid a life of virtual poverty?
robski
