Hill Climb and Sprint RA Project thread eventually
Not had time to update the thread recently due to working away so much. Not much in the way of changes to the car between the last rounds of SLS and this round but did manage to get the new RCM headers on, thanks to Alyn at ASP for sorting them so quickly. I also fitted the rear carbon boot lid and wing. The carbon on the boot lid had a huge white area on it so went for the quick option and had it wrapped, turned out not too bad, not perfect, but passable. I also wired in the Syvecs 10 I/O expander and wired up the four wheel speed sensors, for some reason when its connected to the Syvecs via canbus I lose the race display so gave up on that for now, its not critical until I get the GPS unit working that way I can get proper traction control up and running.
I didn't have time to get the centre section of the rear diffuser made and fitted due to problems with tyre and wheel fitments. I ordered a set of R888's in 235x45x17 only to find they were way outside the wheel arches with no space between the strut and tyre, so had to then order another set in 225x45x17 oops, huge thanks to Graeme Jeram for tweaking the geometry at the last minute to suit this set up.
Went into this round of SLS with no seat time since the last event due to work commitments and more niggles with the car. I Had went to a track night with the intention of trying out the changes to the brakes but had an alternator failure after 2 laps which was game over for that night.
In terms of SLS the lack of anticlockwise track time was still an issue as were the brakes. They were much better than before but Simon from Chevron had identified an issue which was causing the bias to change by as much as 10 to 15% every time the brakes were pressed which made driving the straights interesting lol, couldn't do anything about it on the day so had to just try to drive round it. I was happier with the car and the times were picking up on the Saturday but I had another alternator failure towards the end of the first practice session combined with an imbesile pulling the tow hook right out the chassis leg while towing me through the paddock, managed To replace the alternator but missed 2nd practice as a result of trying to sort another towing point.
The two qualifying rounds were better but was still on low boost, was happy enough with the times tho. Went out for the final and couldn't believe it the car wouldn't rev over 4k revs which I later found out was a map sensor failure. I came back into the pits after the out lap but should have just drove round the timed lap and picked up some points, school boy error there!
Managed to fix the map sensor issue, or so I thought so was going into the Sunday event hoping I wouldnt have any more issues. First practice was ok low boost and feeling my way round, a slow 59 sec was ok for the first session. Went out for the 2nd practice and car went into limp mode again and reoccurrence of the map sensor issue. Spent ages doing wiring checks etc but couldn't find an issue and the fault cleared - bizarre. Qualifying was ok, steady again with nothing spectacular on the time front but car was working well so decided to go for it in the final. Went out and car felt good, first sector was a bit untidy but felt much quicker than before but managed to make a huge mess of the hairpin and went into it far too quick and over steered massively losing loads of time resulting in a rubbish time of 58 secs and a disappointing end to the weekend.
But car is getting better and I am improving slowly after 4 years away so just a case of plugging away lol.
Some pics below courtesy of John Stewart at Flat Out photography.






I didn't have time to get the centre section of the rear diffuser made and fitted due to problems with tyre and wheel fitments. I ordered a set of R888's in 235x45x17 only to find they were way outside the wheel arches with no space between the strut and tyre, so had to then order another set in 225x45x17 oops, huge thanks to Graeme Jeram for tweaking the geometry at the last minute to suit this set up.
Went into this round of SLS with no seat time since the last event due to work commitments and more niggles with the car. I Had went to a track night with the intention of trying out the changes to the brakes but had an alternator failure after 2 laps which was game over for that night.
In terms of SLS the lack of anticlockwise track time was still an issue as were the brakes. They were much better than before but Simon from Chevron had identified an issue which was causing the bias to change by as much as 10 to 15% every time the brakes were pressed which made driving the straights interesting lol, couldn't do anything about it on the day so had to just try to drive round it. I was happier with the car and the times were picking up on the Saturday but I had another alternator failure towards the end of the first practice session combined with an imbesile pulling the tow hook right out the chassis leg while towing me through the paddock, managed To replace the alternator but missed 2nd practice as a result of trying to sort another towing point.
The two qualifying rounds were better but was still on low boost, was happy enough with the times tho. Went out for the final and couldn't believe it the car wouldn't rev over 4k revs which I later found out was a map sensor failure. I came back into the pits after the out lap but should have just drove round the timed lap and picked up some points, school boy error there!
Managed to fix the map sensor issue, or so I thought so was going into the Sunday event hoping I wouldnt have any more issues. First practice was ok low boost and feeling my way round, a slow 59 sec was ok for the first session. Went out for the 2nd practice and car went into limp mode again and reoccurrence of the map sensor issue. Spent ages doing wiring checks etc but couldn't find an issue and the fault cleared - bizarre. Qualifying was ok, steady again with nothing spectacular on the time front but car was working well so decided to go for it in the final. Went out and car felt good, first sector was a bit untidy but felt much quicker than before but managed to make a huge mess of the hairpin and went into it far too quick and over steered massively losing loads of time resulting in a rubbish time of 58 secs and a disappointing end to the weekend.
But car is getting better and I am improving slowly after 4 years away so just a case of plugging away lol.
Some pics below courtesy of John Stewart at Flat Out photography.
Well not really updated this thread for a while partly due to work commitments since the last round of SLS and also a feeling that project threads like this are not really of interest on forums anymore which is a shame as many of the build things we do often come up as questions when others start modding their own cars.
Anyway wee update on what happened at the final round of SLS back in September. I managed to finish the rear diffuser and boxing in the rear of the bumper so all the air flow has to exit through the diffuser. After the event I sat down and had a proper look and it will need to be redone with much larger vanes with perhaps the option of fitting the smaller ones for MSA events where silhouette is critical for scrutineering and the top speeds of the sprint tracks are considerably lower.

The picture below highlights the need for the vanes to be deeper although the picture gives a false impression of just how high the back of the car is due to the track having a fairly steep downhill attitude.

The event itself seemed to follow a familiar pattern as previous rounds with issue after issue. The car went into limp mode on the second lap of the first practice session. The syvecs yet again showed a map sensor out of limits signal. I con checked all the wiring, checked the sensor line, sensor 5V and sensor earth and all were fine so I replaced the 4 bar map sensor. After a chat with Andy F he also suggested changing the crank sensor which is not something I had looked at before as there had been no faults shown but due to the nature of the rev cut he said it could possibly be that, so I changed that as well. Just as well I had spares with me lol.
Changing both of these seemed to do the trick but by that time I had missed that practice session as well as the second one so I only had qualifying and the final left - brilliant!
The qualifying session went not too bad considering, the car felt good again but the times were not brilliant, it’s hard to get up to pace without the practice laps to get into it.
The final went well; I managed a 3rd in class despite a few errors and also taking 5th twice instead of third. That's something I am going to have to look at over the winter as it’s not the first time it’s happened. It’s not really possible to judge the 3rd position at this round as two of the quickest cars in the class were not in the final. Colin Dorwood in his Evo wasn't at this round and David Brown in his Exige withdrew with engine problems so all in all it was an improvement and has shown that if I can get rid of the gremlins the car will be competitive but I have not got back to where I was in terms of my own performance so that is something that I need to look at.




In terms of next year there is a fair bit too do. The pedal box needs to come out and Simon at Chevron has kindly offered to look at the sizes of the master cylinders and spec them exactly to the piston sizes of the calipers as well as setting up the bias bar correctly. It is definitely better than it was at the beginning of the season but definitely not right yet. I also need to move the front brake bias pressure sensor as it is not in the correct part of the front brake circuit so that means making new lines for the front system.
In terms of upgrades I am going to fit a wide arch kit to once and for all resolve the rear wheel to strut clearance issue that I have had for years. As things stand I have a maximum of 5mm of clearance between the inner tyre wall and the strut so I have no ability to run beyond 1.5 deg of negative camber and have a severe limit on tyre width.
A quick call to Darren at ABW and within 5 days I have a set of the wide arch flares (55mm) and a set of the smaller (25mm) ones. The aim is to get a 9J rim with probably a 30 ish offset and the ability to run a 245 or 255 wide tyre. I will take advice from Graeme on that tho as over tyre-ing the car is something we want to avoid.
As well as that I need to decide on what to do ref the traction control. I need to add a GPS sensor to get that working but would also like to add a G sensor and a 3 axis accelerometer so will need to look at what's available.
I would like to give a massive thanks to Graeme Jeram at Whiteline, Simon at Chevron, Andy F for help with mapping and general queries and Alyn at AS Performance for all the help and support during the year as well as Bob for taking the ****.
Anyway wee update on what happened at the final round of SLS back in September. I managed to finish the rear diffuser and boxing in the rear of the bumper so all the air flow has to exit through the diffuser. After the event I sat down and had a proper look and it will need to be redone with much larger vanes with perhaps the option of fitting the smaller ones for MSA events where silhouette is critical for scrutineering and the top speeds of the sprint tracks are considerably lower.
The picture below highlights the need for the vanes to be deeper although the picture gives a false impression of just how high the back of the car is due to the track having a fairly steep downhill attitude.
The event itself seemed to follow a familiar pattern as previous rounds with issue after issue. The car went into limp mode on the second lap of the first practice session. The syvecs yet again showed a map sensor out of limits signal. I con checked all the wiring, checked the sensor line, sensor 5V and sensor earth and all were fine so I replaced the 4 bar map sensor. After a chat with Andy F he also suggested changing the crank sensor which is not something I had looked at before as there had been no faults shown but due to the nature of the rev cut he said it could possibly be that, so I changed that as well. Just as well I had spares with me lol.
Changing both of these seemed to do the trick but by that time I had missed that practice session as well as the second one so I only had qualifying and the final left - brilliant!
The qualifying session went not too bad considering, the car felt good again but the times were not brilliant, it’s hard to get up to pace without the practice laps to get into it.
The final went well; I managed a 3rd in class despite a few errors and also taking 5th twice instead of third. That's something I am going to have to look at over the winter as it’s not the first time it’s happened. It’s not really possible to judge the 3rd position at this round as two of the quickest cars in the class were not in the final. Colin Dorwood in his Evo wasn't at this round and David Brown in his Exige withdrew with engine problems so all in all it was an improvement and has shown that if I can get rid of the gremlins the car will be competitive but I have not got back to where I was in terms of my own performance so that is something that I need to look at.
In terms of next year there is a fair bit too do. The pedal box needs to come out and Simon at Chevron has kindly offered to look at the sizes of the master cylinders and spec them exactly to the piston sizes of the calipers as well as setting up the bias bar correctly. It is definitely better than it was at the beginning of the season but definitely not right yet. I also need to move the front brake bias pressure sensor as it is not in the correct part of the front brake circuit so that means making new lines for the front system.
In terms of upgrades I am going to fit a wide arch kit to once and for all resolve the rear wheel to strut clearance issue that I have had for years. As things stand I have a maximum of 5mm of clearance between the inner tyre wall and the strut so I have no ability to run beyond 1.5 deg of negative camber and have a severe limit on tyre width.
A quick call to Darren at ABW and within 5 days I have a set of the wide arch flares (55mm) and a set of the smaller (25mm) ones. The aim is to get a 9J rim with probably a 30 ish offset and the ability to run a 245 or 255 wide tyre. I will take advice from Graeme on that tho as over tyre-ing the car is something we want to avoid.
As well as that I need to decide on what to do ref the traction control. I need to add a GPS sensor to get that working but would also like to add a G sensor and a 3 axis accelerometer so will need to look at what's available.
I would like to give a massive thanks to Graeme Jeram at Whiteline, Simon at Chevron, Andy F for help with mapping and general queries and Alyn at AS Performance for all the help and support during the year as well as Bob for taking the ****.
Last edited by Arch; Dec 21, 2015 at 02:47 PM.
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 11,778
Likes: 4
From: Newcastle. 330bhp-289lb/ft @ 1bar boost - 12.4s @ 105mph
You'll end up on the naughty step with no Christmas presents if you keep on with this lack of updates! 
Sounds like it's slowly coming together, mate. Really pleased for you.

Sounds like it's slowly coming together, mate. Really pleased for you.
Thanks Micky, the car is now seriously quick with the potential to go much further in terms of power but the year has been frustrating, hopefully most of the issues have been found and will be sorted over the next two months. Decision is whether to go for more power at the expense of some spool but that will ultimately come down to budget.
New wheels and tyres will be a big outlay but can recoup some cost by selling some of the wheels and tyres I have just now.
So probably for sale will be the following
Set of 4 Rota Force painted black 8x17 ET 48 PCD 100
Set of Rota Force Bronze 8x17 ET 48 PCD 100
Set of 4 brand new Dunlop CR311 X22 semi slicks 220x640x17 (awesome track tyre about as good as it gets without going to,a full slick)
Set of the above but half worn
Set of 4 very lightly used Toyo R888 225x45x17
Set of brand new Uniroyal Rainsport 3 225x45x17 (cracking wet tyre on road or track)
New wheels and tyres will be a big outlay but can recoup some cost by selling some of the wheels and tyres I have just now.
So probably for sale will be the following
Set of 4 Rota Force painted black 8x17 ET 48 PCD 100
Set of Rota Force Bronze 8x17 ET 48 PCD 100
Set of 4 brand new Dunlop CR311 X22 semi slicks 220x640x17 (awesome track tyre about as good as it gets without going to,a full slick)
Set of the above but half worn
Set of 4 very lightly used Toyo R888 225x45x17
Set of brand new Uniroyal Rainsport 3 225x45x17 (cracking wet tyre on road or track)
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 11,778
Likes: 4
From: Newcastle. 330bhp-289lb/ft @ 1bar boost - 12.4s @ 105mph
Question is, do you think you need more power? Most of the time people will say, aye they do, when in fact they don't.
Since you're fitting wider wheels, then I'd personally leave the power alone.
Get the gremlins ironed out, and get back out and enjoy it some more. Then start thinking about whether you need to up the power.
Since you're fitting wider wheels, then I'd personally leave the power alone.
Get the gremlins ironed out, and get back out and enjoy it some more. Then start thinking about whether you need to up the power.
It's more for the SLS classes and whether I want to move up into Class A can't get to the top of the power to weight band with just more boost but a turbo change will be the last item on the wish list lol
I won't be doing anything to the car that would make it more than 2 weeks away from being able to compete that way I won't have problems with time so it's a bit at a time and see where it leaves me.
I won't be doing anything to the car that would make it more than 2 weeks away from being able to compete that way I won't have problems with time so it's a bit at a time and see where it leaves me.
Last edited by Arch; Dec 21, 2015 at 08:55 PM.
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 11,778
Likes: 4
From: Newcastle. 330bhp-289lb/ft @ 1bar boost - 12.4s @ 105mph
I thought about doing a round of SLS next year. It would appear that having a flat boot floor takes you out of road going class though. So that's a NO then.
Micky, it doesn't matter what class you are in, just go out. And have fun, its not all about winning...
Thanks for that appreciate it, will get more of the technical stuff up over the winter as the changes happen.
Micky not sure if you have emailed Renny the eligibility scrutineer but that should be your first port of call. You may well be surprised what is and what isn't allowed and the series scrutineer always has the last input. I was told on forums years ago I couldn't use a 2.5 in a classic in road car classes but I had already been to the Scottish MSA scrutineer and had it OK's so I just laughed and didn't let on that I had been given the OK. What the individuals didn't realise was that there was a classic 2.5 RS in the states 
I also had numerous comments round the paddock because I had a 6 speed in a classic and the fuel tank removed and a small 10L one fitted. Again all agreed with the eligibility scrutineer.
In this case it will be how its interpreted, not sure if you have a cage, if you have I am positive you will be ok running in the modified class which runs to S12 blue book regs and that would allow the flat floor. If you don't have a cage then still ask the question in my interpretation removing the spare wheel well has not altered the chassis as that section is not structural and that's the point I would make. The other important aspect in this series is there is no performance advantage as the series runs to strict power to weight classes so removing weight has no advantage other than perhaps acceleration and braking due to the reduced weight but the power too weight still needs to be within the band of the class you choose.
You would need to get the car Dyno checked and weighed at the nominated Dyno for the power band so you need to think about that.
The scrutineer is Renny and the email is scrutineer@superlapscotland.co.uk

I also had numerous comments round the paddock because I had a 6 speed in a classic and the fuel tank removed and a small 10L one fitted. Again all agreed with the eligibility scrutineer.

In this case it will be how its interpreted, not sure if you have a cage, if you have I am positive you will be ok running in the modified class which runs to S12 blue book regs and that would allow the flat floor. If you don't have a cage then still ask the question in my interpretation removing the spare wheel well has not altered the chassis as that section is not structural and that's the point I would make. The other important aspect in this series is there is no performance advantage as the series runs to strict power to weight classes so removing weight has no advantage other than perhaps acceleration and braking due to the reduced weight but the power too weight still needs to be within the band of the class you choose.
You would need to get the car Dyno checked and weighed at the nominated Dyno for the power band so you need to think about that.
The scrutineer is Renny and the email is scrutineer@superlapscotland.co.uk
Last edited by Arch; Dec 22, 2015 at 10:36 AM.
I'm looking to do the local hill climbs and sprint next year. However in my class I will need a hans device, starts making it very expensive!
Think most series are going down that route, you can get them fairly cheap now at around £150, the issue is the helmet as that needs to be Hans ready and comply with the new standards out this year. I have to chuck away a £500 helmet which is Hans ready because they have done away with the Snell 2010 standard even though the MSA agree the helmet is fine but its not apparently tested to the new standards utter bollocks.
Think most series are going down that route, you can get them fairly cheap now at around £150, the issue is the helmet as that needs to be Hans ready and comply with the new standards out this year. I have to chuck away a £500 helmet which is Hans ready because they have done away with the Snell 2010 standard even though the MSA agree the helmet is fine but its not apparently tested to the new standards utter bollocks.
There should be a regime where we can get things reinspected if they are out of date, as for the use most hobbyist/enthusiasts get out of their equipment there should be nothing wrong with the equipment.
My mate just had to buy a new helmet because it was out of date, he has used it 11 times...
Our series here is a bit of a pain, as I will be running with the rally cars and caterhams, never going to win when the leading car is a kit car with a supercharged hayabusa engine, on low boost putting out ~400hp and the guy is a fecking lunatic lol, they won't let him run in some events as he is too fast
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 11,778
Likes: 4
From: Newcastle. 330bhp-289lb/ft @ 1bar boost - 12.4s @ 105mph
In this case it will be how its interpreted, not sure if you have a cage, if you have I am positive you will be ok running in the modified class which runs to S12 blue book regs and that would allow the flat floor. If you don't have a cage then still ask the question in my interpretation removing the spare wheel well has not altered the chassis as that section is not structural and that's the point I would make. The other important aspect in this series is there is no performance advantage as the series runs to strict power to weight classes so removing weight has no advantage other than perhaps acceleration and braking due to the reduced weight but the power too weight still needs to be within the band of the class you choose.
You would need to get the car Dyno checked and weighed at the nominated Dyno for the power band so you need to think about that.
The scrutineer is Renny and the email is scrutineer@superlapscotland.co.uk
You would need to get the car Dyno checked and weighed at the nominated Dyno for the power band so you need to think about that.
The scrutineer is Renny and the email is scrutineer@superlapscotland.co.uk
It's a bit noisy in the cabin, I can turn the stereo up though. 
Yeah, the whole traipse up to Scotland, just to put it on a dyno is a bit off-putting. It's something that I will ponder on though.
I'll probably send Renny an email at somepoint, just to see where the land lies though.
It's definately worth asking as soon as you can at least that way you will know if it's a none starter.
Have you thought of having a go at Kames I am sure the Scottish Scrutineers would be open to that single modification for road car class.
Have you thought of having a go at Kames I am sure the Scottish Scrutineers would be open to that single modification for road car class.
Well got the car over to Whiteline HQ today to start getting the wide arch kit fitted. I have to be honest I totally underestimated what is involved in doing this right. Its not just about trimming a bit of material off and bolting them on and making the car look wider, to do it correctly its all about thinking about what the wheel will do on track and then cutting off what's required to give the best possible set up options. Massive thanks to Graeme for helping with this especially just now when he is so busy and also thanks to Bob for his help. I would not have thought about doing some of the things Graeme has suggested. The reasoning behind doing this is not for asthetics, its about solving so many problems that have compromised the geometry of the car since I bought it.
Anyway a few pics of the first rough cuts, there is still some more to come off from these pictures and then the inner skin dressed before welding a plate to rejoin the inner skin to the outer skin. It doesn't look neat at the minute but this stage is all about starting to get the right amount of material off and then welding the strength and asthetics back in under the Arch.




Anyway a few pics of the first rough cuts, there is still some more to come off from these pictures and then the inner skin dressed before welding a plate to rejoin the inner skin to the outer skin. It doesn't look neat at the minute but this stage is all about starting to get the right amount of material off and then welding the strength and asthetics back in under the Arch.
Fair play Arch. As you say will be nice to get some proper geo on the car. Once you get some proper rubber on these, the dimensions under the arch's between bodywork and the strut or coil over collars is a nightmare. Good on you for taking the plunge. Graham is a wise man to have on board with this, obviously with his experience I'm sure he's brought some valuable points to the table.
Look forward to seeing where you go from here
Look forward to seeing where you go from here
Thanks Joe aye I have had issue after issue with strut to tyre clearance while using an 8" rim and 225/235 tyres and also rubbing issues with the tyre to arch even tho the arches are cut and rolled so this will solve clearance issues, ride height issues and allow a wider tyre as well.
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From: oop north in a spec-c.Now sold and starting on a classic ra track/sprint/road car
Agree with you there Archie looking at the pics its well clean underneath where the metal has been cut out was also going to say the issues with the strut/arch tyre clearance is a pain Im having to use 215 profile road and 210 profile race tyre on a 7.5 rim hence my earlier post in the wanted for STi rims of that size.
I didn't have huge issues with 8J ET 48 and 225 tyres I always had 5mm clearance between the tyre and strut the issue was always ride height I couldn't get the car as low as I wanted without the outer arch rubbing on the tyre under compression.
The metal on the inner arch was just dusty lol quite impressive given its age and that the RA's had no underseal as standard.
The metal on the inner arch was just dusty lol quite impressive given its age and that the RA's had no underseal as standard.






