Frightened myself about an hour ago!!!
06 April 2008, 10:36 AM
#31
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Find yourself a nice wide, open roundabout in a quiet, non-residential area (such as an industrial estate).
Practice turning right at the roundabout(s) in a low gear (second or third, you want a bit of power available). Now try and go into the roundabout with a little bit of speed - just enough to feel the front start to slip. When that happens gently ease off the gas slightly, and you should feel the front start to tuck in again. Ease off a bit more, and you will feel the back end start to come round (oversteer).
All this requires a bit of finesse - you can't barrel into the roundabout with a ton of understeer and expect to correct things....it's all about moving the car around close to the limit of grip - any sudden movements and the grip you have will be gone!
This can all be practiced at under 30mph, and will start to give you a feel of the dynamics of the car when on the limit of grip, in a relatively safe environment.
Practice turning right at the roundabout(s) in a low gear (second or third, you want a bit of power available). Now try and go into the roundabout with a little bit of speed - just enough to feel the front start to slip. When that happens gently ease off the gas slightly, and you should feel the front start to tuck in again. Ease off a bit more, and you will feel the back end start to come round (oversteer).
All this requires a bit of finesse - you can't barrel into the roundabout with a ton of understeer and expect to correct things....it's all about moving the car around close to the limit of grip - any sudden movements and the grip you have will be gone!
This can all be practiced at under 30mph, and will start to give you a feel of the dynamics of the car when on the limit of grip, in a relatively safe environment.
08 April 2008, 06:37 PM
#32
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buy a copy of roadcraft - the police handbook.
There is a section on taking bends and the way tyres behave when turning and driving the wheels. You essentially overloaded the tyres.
It has other handy hints and tips in the book. Some obvious some not so obvious.
There is a section on taking bends and the way tyres behave when turning and driving the wheels. You essentially overloaded the tyres.
It has other handy hints and tips in the book. Some obvious some not so obvious.
08 April 2008, 10:38 PM
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09 April 2008, 12:40 PM
#34
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before the corner left foot breaking then off and round the corner is what i do on roads like that. although depends how fast you were going for the corner. having said that i have spun my car before, back end overtook me an i was suddenly facing the other way. that taught me some characteristics of my car lol
19 April 2008, 10:23 AM
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get yourself on a driver training day with andy walsh....
and be prepared to throw all your previous knowledge in the bin....
yes, as DDavis says above, learn to let go off the wheel at 80 mph right angle bend!!! learn to straighten up during understeer to reduce slip angle etc....
its back to school again and i would thouroughly recommend it!!!
Dazza
and be prepared to throw all your previous knowledge in the bin....
yes, as DDavis says above, learn to let go off the wheel at 80 mph right angle bend!!! learn to straighten up during understeer to reduce slip angle etc....
its back to school again and i would thouroughly recommend it!!!
Dazza
19 April 2008, 11:39 PM
#36
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just took my scoob out tonight in the wet come round a tightish left hander that gos in to 2 lanes its clear but roads are wet roads are clear i let her open up prob was came hard on boost mid corner all 4 spine up try put more power down to re gain grip then starts spining round i had to back then it whiped the other way and slowly slid to a stop, im running about 360bhp im gonna go on a track day and learn dos and donts in the wet, i can push it in the dry but in the wet its a whole new thing, sorry to hi jack but same kind of thing mate
22 April 2008, 09:35 PM
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Big time. I was coming around an s-bend, went around the left hander fine then got braver for the right hander, threw it in to the corner and was loosing grip sort of facing where i wanted to go but could feel the front wheels slipping. So this is where it went wrong brought my left foot across to brake a bit causint weight to go back on the frount wheels and then the bloody back is trying to over take me!!!! managed to hold on, pulled in up the road and had 2 **** and then drove home at about 0.5 mph.
Now why did this happen. the car is an 04 sti ppp with whiteline rear arb and droplinks set in the middle hole. It is running 347bhp and it has pirreli p-zeros on
Or what to do next time. IM guessing i should of just stepped on the loud pedal and whet for it instead of trying to be clever.
Now why did this happen. the car is an 04 sti ppp with whiteline rear arb and droplinks set in the middle hole. It is running 347bhp and it has pirreli p-zeros on
Or what to do next time. IM guessing i should of just stepped on the loud pedal and whet for it instead of trying to be clever.
Simple as.
Also by only fitting a rear ARB on a newage model car you've unbalanced it and made it tail happy.
Those with talent like it like that, however I suggest you fit the front one too.
26 April 2008, 05:12 PM
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LIGHTWAVE693 DONT HATE ME JUST BECAUSE IM BETTER THAN YOU IF YOU STUDIED HARD AT SCHOOL YOU COULD HAVE OWNED A AMG NOW YOU HAVE TO MAKE DO WITH WHATEVER CRAP YOU DRIVE BITCHING ABOUT PEOPLE LIKE ME WHO YOU ASPIRE TO BE LIKE BUT ITS JUST A ****TY PIPE DREAM FOR YOU SO YOU MIGHT AS WELL GO OFF TO THE HOLE YOU CRAWLED OUT OF AND DIE AS YOU LIFE IS USELESS
16 June 2008, 07:08 PM
#43
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A good trick which is hard to make your hands do because your mind won't let you is when your back end is out and after a little bit off opposite lock is to let go of the steering wheel 
. It centres itself in effect stopping you using too much opposite lock which if it bites will spit you back the other way and then you are in trouble!!
As I said its pretty difficult to do at the time because your head tells you its sooooo wrong, but it does work very effectively
. It centres itself in effect stopping you using too much opposite lock which if it bites will spit you back the other way and then you are in trouble!!As I said its pretty difficult to do at the time because your head tells you its sooooo wrong, but it does work very effectively
First things first. if u have understear then yes you are going to fast for the tires to grip. don't brake, just back of the gas gently keeping a firm grip of the wheel and unfeed it till u gain grip once u have grip applie the throttle but gentle. Idealy you should decide whats the best speed for that corner and hold it at that speed 40 50 60 20, and balance the throttle to hold that speed.
when you are on the road next... try this,
Find a corner that you can take at 30mph safely.. take this corner in 3rd gear. then do the same corner again but this time use 5th ( 6th if you have it) and you will see the difference. you should find that you don't feel as though u have much control as in 3rd for the corner.
remember possition, speed, gear to speed.
17 June 2008, 03:37 PM
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A good trick which is hard to make your hands do because your mind won't let you is when your back end is out and after a little bit off opposite lock is to let go of the steering wheel . It centres itself in effect stopping you using too much opposite lock which if it bites will spit you back the other way and then you are in trouble!!
As I said its pretty difficult to do at the time because your head tells you its sooooo wrong, but it does work very effectively
. It centres itself in effect stopping you using too much opposite lock which if it bites will spit you back the other way and then you are in trouble!!As I said its pretty difficult to do at the time because your head tells you its sooooo wrong, but it does work very effectively
I find it easy to let go, as if the tail steps out on my car, my hands immediately cover my eyes, accompanied by much screaming!!
17 June 2008, 09:11 PM
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17 June 2008, 09:57 PM
#47
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Must not be his car
17 June 2008, 10:31 PM
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The let go trick is very dependant on suspension geometry. Kingpin inclination and caster have a big influence over this - both of which aren't adjustable on an Impreza (well, not without replacing the whole front suspension ).
Old Jags are a car not to do this in; as the wheels can sometimes tend to "fall" onto full lock if you let go when going sideways...which is not going to help I belive big old Mercs (such as a 560SEL etc) can suffer the same, but I've not been sideways in a old merc, so can't say if its true or not .
).Old Jags are a car not to do this in; as the wheels can sometimes tend to "fall" onto full lock if you let go when going sideways...which is not going to help
I belive big old Mercs (such as a 560SEL etc) can suffer the same, but I've not been sideways in a old merc, so can't say if its true or not .
Last edited by Shark Man; 17 June 2008 at 10:36 PM.
19 June 2008, 07:17 PM
#53
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Ok a few things here that need to be pointed out.
1. Brake on the straights and not in the corners as a general rule, though braking in corners can be done at "moderate speeds".
2. Slow in, quick out, another basic rule if you just want to keep your car on the road.
3. Dont try to get lift off oversteer on a road, you normally dont have enough room to bring it back in line, especially if you have traffic coming towards you.
4. Book a day with Don Palmer if he still does his advanced driving techniques
Tony
1. Brake on the straights and not in the corners as a general rule, though braking in corners can be done at "moderate speeds".
2. Slow in, quick out, another basic rule if you just want to keep your car on the road.
3. Dont try to get lift off oversteer on a road, you normally dont have enough room to bring it back in line, especially if you have traffic coming towards you.
4. Book a day with Don Palmer if he still does his advanced driving techniques
Tony
20 June 2008, 10:36 AM
#54
Smooth is good. 'Chucking' isnt a word to use whilst entering a corner. Trail brake whilst turning in to keep the front tyres hooked up and prevent understeer and then gently ease off the brake pedal and swap to throttle to maintain corner speed and maximise exit speed. The transition needs to be SMOOTH, a quick lift off the brakes whilst mid corner will result in understeer so the transition from braking to throttle needs to be seamless. If the car starts to understeer mid corner on on exit then best plan is to just try to wind off the lock a little to allow the front to hook back up. Sadly this requires you to have screwed up the corner in the first instance as you should be using all the road therefore winding the lock off will result of you driving off the tarmac.
The above doesnt need to be a slow process, it can be done very quickly but start slow to practice and go from there. Smooth is fast, always. On track I always start smooth and build up from there until I get ragged to find the limit and then back off to smooth again.
Assuming you took the corner properly in the first place with a correct turn in point and using all available roon the only other option is to ease off the throttle slightly to allow the front tyres to hook up.
Id book into a number of track days, preferably airflields with loads of run off and nothing to hit. Then get an instructor in the car with you. Your level of skill will jump through the roof in those circumstances.
The above doesnt need to be a slow process, it can be done very quickly but start slow to practice and go from there. Smooth is fast, always. On track I always start smooth and build up from there until I get ragged to find the limit and then back off to smooth again.
Assuming you took the corner properly in the first place with a correct turn in point and using all available roon the only other option is to ease off the throttle slightly to allow the front tyres to hook up.
Id book into a number of track days, preferably airflields with loads of run off and nothing to hit. Then get an instructor in the car with you. Your level of skill will jump through the roof in those circumstances.
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