PETE - Are you a LABOUR supporter or a BLAIR supporter......????????

 

Pete is a champagne socialist

 

They'll only look weak IF the police have actually caught, held in custody and then released after 28 days the people that commit the next terror atatck. If they have not been arrested at all prior to the attack (which would be consistent with the previous 2 attacks) then this whole damn argument is moot.

 

Ah yes, but you didn't write it did you? No, you cut and pasted it from somewhere else. Sloganeering as usual.

It's a load of scaremongering bollox anyway. One more time:

 

The inocent only have to fear the next bomb killing There children / Wife / loved ones.

I know where my vote lays. the 90 day legislate is fair even to those held, if people took the time to read it,

Yes of course this open to abuse, but are not most things in life! if not managed.

I once bought an item of ebay 'pay now' but the seller never had the item for sale,

What i am trying to say is:- weather its buying an item or legislation if its managed to the standards set, then it will not be open to manipulation.

You know the legislation its as stated, the police have extreme difficulties with time constraints gatthering phone / isp and banking information, If the suspect has allready enough information to take it to this level of investigation why not.

The law does not state thay can randomly pick people of the streets and lock them up for 90 days, there are certain criteria of alleged guilt before they can take it to this limit.

And its not like the enviroment in wich they would be held is a SS war camp is it!

The new wave of terrorism to hit the country has no rules or guidlines other than to kill. The terrorist will have no compassion at all, they will quite gladly sit at the side of your son/daughter and press the button detonating the explosives with a smile on there face, Taking away your life your future your familly.

90 days as long as it takes thats what I say.....................

 

hear hear!

It pains me but I agree with Blair, and worse than that, I agree with PSLewis!

I think Blair is on his way out ow, but I also think Gordon Brown is worse!

 

Bzzzzt. Sorry wrong answer. Yup, if the "area" is considered at risk, they can arrest ANYBODY under the anti-terrorism laws with no evidence whatsoever - just ask the old guy at the NL conference in Brighton. Also see UB's post quoting the appropriate section.


Oh well that makes it OK to hold people, innocent people, against their will for 3 months. Reckon you'd have a job when you got out? Reckon the bansk would turn a blind eye to your upaid bills? Think your familly would be happy about not seeing you for 3 months??


Wave? The current "wave" has killed 52 people, horrific for those concerned admitedley, but compared to 850 murders last year, it's hardly a major issue in the scheme of things.

 

I'm still waiting lewis. Take your time though, I know it's difficult for you to engage in rational discussion.

 

FFS. I seriously pity the naiive on this thread who have very little understanding of what is going on in the world and are happy to bend over and let Osama and his mates bugger them stupid. It's the same people who denied there was a muslim terrorist threat in the UK until it all went 'boom'. The same people who thought it is great to go to the red sea for a cheap holiday until it went 'boom' there too. Too wet to see it coming. So what did they learn from their wrong-headedness?? Absolutely nothing obviously.

Keep your heads in the sand, boys and your butts in the air. The rest of us won't roll over quite as easily.

Suresh

 

Please tell me the dates that the London bombers were arrested prior to them detonating (sucessfully or not) their bombs. How long before they actually acted were the arrested? How long were they detained when they were arrested?

 

ha ha. Didn't realise we had John Rambo on here

 

Well? I really do want to know when the perpetrators of the 2 terrorist acts that sparked all this off were arrested prior to the acts? The arrests that they were later released from allowing them to go on and commit the terrorist acts. So when were these arrests Suresh??

 

That was a bit over the top, wasn't it.
Still better to be a bit less than naiive than wake up with a sore bum

 

So rather than answer the questions put directly to you, you decide to respond to the JOKE post put on here...

Are you going to respond to the question put to you? Or just ignore it because it doesn't fit with your world view?

Just to clarify something for you: This government has a responsibility to maintain our safety as well as maintain our liberty.

This 90 internment misses out very clearly on one of those responsibilities.

Are you now going respond that you are willing to forgoe some of those liberties if it means you are 'safe'?

 

Nice, post, i'd just like to adjust one bit though...

 

ahhh

OllyK you agree with the top half of what I said then.

What would your ideal be then, wait till the terrorist kill people then jail there smoking corpse's because then you know they did it ?

I don't know any answers to these either ? am guessing you know so you could quote and correct suresh if he got some wrong. would be nice to know though excuse my ignorance.

Come on guys these are simply our own opinions nothing more IMO

 

Try this and see what you think..


Mr X is arrested and held for 14 days by the bib whilst an investigation is carried out.. he is detained for 14 days and released withouth charge... he goes back to work and the matter is dealt with via his solicitor for the detainment


Mr Y is arrested and detained for 90 days whilst the investigation is carried out..

after 90 days he is released without charge..

he cant go back to work, as his firm couldnt leave his position unfilled for 90 days and he has been dismissed. he earnt 80k a year and was highly successfull at his job.

now who picks up the tab???


Cue super snouty compo is us lawyers... and hmg gets screwed..


whilst i can see the argument fo the case, given this governments ability to spin and twist, i dont believe anything they say...

so they give 90 day detainmnet to the police.... hmmm ****** squads the early morning phone call people dissapearing retraining camps paramilitary style uniforms.. what next just a quick shower to keep you clean??!!

its a classic case of crying wolf.. trouble is no one believes him

M

 

Yes I am, actually and in fact I already do, but you wouldn't know that sitting up there in your little PC tower.

I am a million times more likely to be picked up than you are too (especially if I've got a backpack on), so I claim the moral highground. I have never been picked up or questioned by the police. Not ever. Get stopped at every border crossing though and so long as I am treated civilly, I don't have a problem with it.

So what's your problem exactly? Worried a few potential terrorists are going to have their human rights abused and you don't want that to happen? Rebel-without-a-clue syndrome seems to be fairly prevelent here today...

Good luck to you and your sore bottom.

 

For the most part...no.

No let's make the Police more effective. If time is of the essence, let's move heaven and earth to allow the police to gather the evidence in 7 days never mind 90.

Oh I think Suresh knows the answers and realises that if he answers them his argument becomes somewhat impotent.

 

I wonder if all the MP's that opposed this law are actually homosexual and the thought of a good bumming was reason enough not to vote for the new bill?!!

 

The situation though wont affect Suresh as he waffles from his present location.

Any plans on moving back home soon m8?

 

They really are trying to push out the boundaries of this police state with this one.

In Australia they value the freedom of there citizens. They have only just increased the detention of terrorist suspects to 14 days from 48hrs

"In order to evade the Constitution, which bars the federal government from imposing “punishment” on Australian citizens without trial, preventative detention by the Australian Federal Police (AFP) will be limited to 48 hours, but the states and territories have agreed to extend this to 14 days for their respective police forces."

Our wonderful government see fit to go from 14 days to 90 days. Our police force can't be that incompetent.

 

The answer is that they were completely unknown to the police and none of them had ever come under suspicion in any way. So, these proposed internment period of 90 days would be completely useless in this, the only *real* case of terrorism the's been.

90 days internment though would severely curtail the liberties of every single person in this country guily or innocent, good or bad, black white or 'brown'.

 

Bzzzzzzt No No No Olly this top bit, you only quoted the bottom third of this message and put YOUR veiws on it,


Hence

My question you agree with the top half of what I said then.

 

Self pity is not a good state of mind to be in, but appropriate in this case.

I for one object to being led by the nose into a Police State. Judging by the way the voting in the Commons went yesterday I'm not the only one.

 

Yes he does go on a bit. Perhaps 28 (or 90 in his case) days in the slammer would do him some good

 

Now Australia there views on imigrants and associated terriroism

Its there country and there way RESPECT...

hear hear...

 

Just to add something. It's already the case that existing 'anti-terrorist' laws are being abused now: http://www.liberty-human-rights.org....y-of-war.shtml

An 11 year old girl... wow. Now people like Suresh want to give this authoritarian govt the ability to hold people without trial for 90 days.

It seems to me that people like OSL are winning their fight to replace a freedom loving democracy with an authoritarian regime that snuffs out protests through laws that ignore basic human rights. All because naive individuals like Suresh only see the short term view and are applauding misguided knee-jerk reactions to a serious problem, rather than questioning the long term implications of such actions.

People fought and died for the freedom we now enjoy, are we going to roll over and let these freedoms be taken away because this govt is scared?

 

Quote:

Anti Terrorism measures have done little to ensure Britain is safe and secure from terrorist attack, but much to infringe the civil liberties of those living in the UK.

There are fundamental concerns about aspects of the Terrorism Bill, which has profound implications for human rights and civil liberties.

We are particularly concerned about threats to free speech and the extension of pre charge detention. These measures have the potential to undermine centuries of democratic tradition and are likely to be disastrously counter-productive.

The miscarriages of justice which involved Irish suspects and anti terror laws in the 70s and 80s are a reminder of the dangers of rushing laws which create a twin-track system and delivering poor justice.

As we recover from the attacks on London we must be prepared to defend our ancient principles of freedom and liberty. To allow their erosion, and to give in to intolerance, would give victory to the terrorists.

 

It's a brave man who surfs to "Iamacluelesswetliberal.com" and then uses it as a credible source to support an argument. What the hell are people thinking taking their children on protest marches??? I guess you have to start the indoctrination early, before they are able to think for themselves. Religion and religious sects try to work their magic in the same way.