CarLube Synthethic Triple R Engine Oil?
19 May 2005, 01:45 PM
#91
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Hang on, is 'car KY' really a Fully Synth and not a hydrocranked semi? (thus legally allowed to be described as a Fully Synth). 
Not sure, only Silkolene Pro S goes anywhere near mine!
IIRC Subaru WR team use Motul? Which is a fully synth oil!
NS04
"Carlube- For those who are '****' about their car care!"
Not sure, only Silkolene Pro S goes anywhere near mine!IIRC Subaru WR team use Motul? Which is a fully synth oil!
NS04
"Carlube- For those who are '****' about their car care!"
Last edited by New_scooby_04; 19 May 2005 at 02:08 PM.
19 May 2005, 03:30 PM
#93
Carlube is in fact made by a company called Tetrosyl.
http://www.tetrosyl.com
I'm trying to source some chemical analysis on their products as there are no technical data sheets available. If I can find any, I'll post the findings for those interested.
Cheers
Simon
http://www.tetrosyl.com
I'm trying to source some chemical analysis on their products as there are no technical data sheets available. If I can find any, I'll post the findings for those interested.
Cheers
Simon
19 May 2005, 05:03 PM
#94
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Originally Posted by ALi-B
I amazed nobody has asked which is better:
The SUBARU reccomended oil (used by most dealers) such as:
Magnatec or Helix SEMI-SYNTHETIC
Vs
Carlube FULLY SYNTHETIC
logic goes that full synthetic is better than semi-synthetic, so which is better?
...
Of course, I could do what everybody else has done so far and look soley at the brand and say thats ****e, Just like Levi jeans are better than Wranglers
The SUBARU reccomended oil (used by most dealers) such as:
Magnatec or Helix SEMI-SYNTHETIC
Vs
Carlube FULLY SYNTHETIC
logic goes that full synthetic is better than semi-synthetic, so which is better?
...Of course, I could do what everybody else has done so far and look soley at the brand and say thats ****e, Just like Levi jeans are better than Wranglers
I didn't know Subaru recommended Magnatec .... a few years ago I heard nasty things about that Oil putting a big 'drag' on the engine (not sure if it was the usual internet bollox or correct?)
I agree that too many people in this world just look at a name and poo-poo it without any logic whatsoever
Skodas are great cars ...... but you try getting the 'Badge' brigade to whom 'Image' is all important to agree!!
Pete
Last edited by pslewis; 19 May 2005 at 05:05 PM.
19 May 2005, 05:24 PM
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Pete..... is this a hobby of yours, or do you have a medical condition that causes you to argue the toss with absolutly everyone???
My girlfriend suffers from the same, but that's only once a month!
Calling people d*ckheads is hardly constructive now, is it Mr Lewis. The only dribble I see here, is that which coming from your mouth...... or ar$e, i'm never quite sure which is which with you.
Go and play with your trains, atleast they won't blow up!
My girlfriend suffers from the same, but that's only once a month!
Calling people d*ckheads is hardly constructive now, is it Mr Lewis. The only dribble I see here, is that which coming from your mouth...... or ar$e, i'm never quite sure which is which with you.
Go and play with your trains, atleast they won't blow up!
19 May 2005, 05:55 PM
#96
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Originally Posted by chrispurvis100
The only dribble I see here, is that which coming from your mouth...... or ar$e, i'm never quite sure which is which with you.
Go and play with your trains, atleast they won't blow up!
Go and play with your trains, atleast they won't blow up!
*cough* this is what I mean by ******** *cough*
Pete
19 May 2005, 06:10 PM
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Pete, I love you, 
I hope you know that! Don't ever go anywhere, if you were to leave, many people on here would weep and call out,
' Where is the wise, cough, sorry, tw$t who thinks he is wise!'
You are becoming an institution mate.
I hope you know that! Don't ever go anywhere, if you were to leave, many people on here would weep and call out, ' Where is the wise, cough, sorry, tw$t who thinks he is wise!'
You are becoming an institution mate.
19 May 2005, 06:21 PM
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Pete; this is an extract from an article written by John Rowland, who is the Chief R&D Chemist of Silkolene/Fuchs:
A word of caution – You get what you pay for!
Costs of synthetics vary considerably. The most expensive are the “Ester” types originally only used in jet engines. These cost 6 to 10 times more than high quality mineral oils.
The cheapest synthetics are not really synthetic at all, from a chemists point of view. These are in fact specially refined light viscosity mineral oils known as “hydrocracked”. These have some advantages over equivalent mineral oils, particularly in lower viscosity motor oils such as 5w-30 or other oils with a low “W” rating such as 5w-50 etc and they cost about 1.5 times more than good quality mineral fractions.
We use several different grades of this base oil, where appropriate. This is the “synthetic” which is always used in cheap oils that are labelled “synthetic”. Yes it’s a cruel world, you get what you pay for!
Now, you may ask, why are these special mineral oils called “synthetic”?
Well, it was all sorted in a legal battle that took place in the USA about ten years ago. Sound reasons (including evidence from a Nobel Prize winning chemist) were disregarded and the final ruling was that certain mineral bases that had undergone extra chemical treatments could be called “synthetic”.
Needless to say, the marketing executives wet their knickers with pure delight! They realised that this meant, and still does, that the critical buzz-word “synthetic” could be printed on a can of cheap oil provided that the contents included a few percent of “hydrocracked” mineral oil, at a cost of quite literally a few pence.
So, the chemistry of “synthetics” is complex and so is the politics!
The economics are very simple. If you like the look of a smart well-marketed can with “synthetic” printed on it, fair enough, it will not cost you a lot; and now you know why this is the case. But, if you drive a high performance car, and you intend to keep it for several years, and maybe do the odd “track day”, then you need a genuine Ester/PAO (Poly Alpha Olefin) synthetic oil.
This oil costs more money to buy, because it costs us a lot of money to make, very simply, you always get what you pay for!
I trust that this will help you to make your decision, its certainly provided me with valuable guidance.
Regards
Simon
A word of caution – You get what you pay for!
Costs of synthetics vary considerably. The most expensive are the “Ester” types originally only used in jet engines. These cost 6 to 10 times more than high quality mineral oils.
The cheapest synthetics are not really synthetic at all, from a chemists point of view. These are in fact specially refined light viscosity mineral oils known as “hydrocracked”. These have some advantages over equivalent mineral oils, particularly in lower viscosity motor oils such as 5w-30 or other oils with a low “W” rating such as 5w-50 etc and they cost about 1.5 times more than good quality mineral fractions.
We use several different grades of this base oil, where appropriate. This is the “synthetic” which is always used in cheap oils that are labelled “synthetic”. Yes it’s a cruel world, you get what you pay for!
Now, you may ask, why are these special mineral oils called “synthetic”?
Well, it was all sorted in a legal battle that took place in the USA about ten years ago. Sound reasons (including evidence from a Nobel Prize winning chemist) were disregarded and the final ruling was that certain mineral bases that had undergone extra chemical treatments could be called “synthetic”.
Needless to say, the marketing executives wet their knickers with pure delight! They realised that this meant, and still does, that the critical buzz-word “synthetic” could be printed on a can of cheap oil provided that the contents included a few percent of “hydrocracked” mineral oil, at a cost of quite literally a few pence.
So, the chemistry of “synthetics” is complex and so is the politics!
The economics are very simple. If you like the look of a smart well-marketed can with “synthetic” printed on it, fair enough, it will not cost you a lot; and now you know why this is the case. But, if you drive a high performance car, and you intend to keep it for several years, and maybe do the odd “track day”, then you need a genuine Ester/PAO (Poly Alpha Olefin) synthetic oil.
This oil costs more money to buy, because it costs us a lot of money to make, very simply, you always get what you pay for!
I trust that this will help you to make your decision, its certainly provided me with valuable guidance.
Regards
Simon
19 May 2005, 06:25 PM
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I run Redline 20w50 all year long in Phoenix, Arizona. The ambient temp. ranges from 38 degrees F. to 117 degrees F. I believe Redline states their 20w50 flows as well as mineral based 10w30 at -30 degrees F.(that's a direct quote from the label)
19 May 2005, 06:31 PM
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But a lot of labels state that the contents are 'Synthetic' when theyre no such thing; its just dubious marketing... See the quoted article above.
Simon
Simon
19 May 2005, 06:37 PM
#102
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Originally Posted by GC8
Pete; this is an extract from an article written by John Rowland, who is the Chief R&D Chemist of Silkolene/Fuchs:
I trust that this will help you to make your decision, its certainly provided me with valuable guidance.
Regards
Simon
I trust that this will help you to make your decision, its certainly provided me with valuable guidance.
Regards
Simon
I appreciate that an expensive oil to make will be expensive to buy.
I appreciate that a top, top quality oil will last, and stay in spec., for a longer time than cheaper oils.
But, I do question whether there is 'really' any advantage when the oil will be changed at 6 months and/or 6,000miles .......... whether it 'truly' will make a difference?? This is NOT questioning the quality of advice given by those in the business, they believe that an expensive oil should be used - I think and believe that the effects will be marginal at the extreme.
However, a £30 oil verses a £20 oil would work out at only an extra £20 per year (given 2 oil changes) ............... I certainly would NOT want to risk keeping the same oil for 12 months, despite those saying that the expensive oil would be ok for that long!
Pete
19 May 2005, 06:45 PM
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I suppose that it depends how you drive it Pete; I used to live next door to an oil chemist (seeing as I lived in Matlock Bath Im guessing that he worked for Silkolene in Belper...); he told me that there was little practical difference between top quality oils and economy products over the first few thousand miles. This was in 1988 though, and he was referring to 'steady' driving. Even then he advised me to go for some thing 'better' for my hard-driven Lancia, even though I changed it every 3,000 miles. My twin-cam was producing a healthy 72BHP per litre, a UK specification Impreza produces 107BHP per litre with the added stress caused by a turbocharger... Id equate the extra £10 to an insurance policy Pete, you insure your car with a fully comprehensive policy but when did you last have it stolen or crash it? Youre paying for the piece of mind that comes with knowing that full cover is there, should it turn out that you need it.....
Simon
Simon
Last edited by GC8; 19 May 2005 at 06:48 PM.
19 May 2005, 06:50 PM
#105
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Originally Posted by GC8
Pete, you insure your car with a fully comprehensive policy but when did you last have it stolen or crash it?
Simon
Simon
"Triple R Synthetic Motor Oil is developed in association with Lotus Motorsport, is original equipment in all Morgan cars, and in all TVR sports and racing cars"
I still don't think that TVR would put rubbish oil in their cars?? Would they??
Do they breakdown all the time due to the Oil, or is it just crap build quality??
Pete
19 May 2005, 06:54 PM
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Now I know that youre having a laugh! But still, its an analagy, rather than a practical comparison.
Btw; I dont know that the CarLube oil isnt a genuine ester synthetic, it may well be. The point of my posts has been that not everything that proclaims itself to be 'Synthetic' is synthetic, and that you need to be very careful. If Simon (Oilman) can find a technical sheet for the product then you can be assued, or warned, as the case may be.
Btw; I dont know that the CarLube oil isnt a genuine ester synthetic, it may well be. The point of my posts has been that not everything that proclaims itself to be 'Synthetic' is synthetic, and that you need to be very careful. If Simon (Oilman) can find a technical sheet for the product then you can be assued, or warned, as the case may be.
Last edited by GC8; 19 May 2005 at 06:57 PM.
19 May 2005, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
Who said?? Third Party Only is MUCH cheaper!!
"Triple R Synthetic Motor Oil is developed in association with Lotus Motorsport, is original equipment in all Morgan cars, and in all TVR sports and racing cars"
I still don't think that TVR would put rubbish oil in their cars?? Would they??
Do they breakdown all the time due to the Oil, or is it just crap build quality??
Pete
"Triple R Synthetic Motor Oil is developed in association with Lotus Motorsport, is original equipment in all Morgan cars, and in all TVR sports and racing cars"
I still don't think that TVR would put rubbish oil in their cars?? Would they??
Do they breakdown all the time due to the Oil, or is it just crap build quality??
Pete
19 May 2005, 07:14 PM
#108
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Originally Posted by chrispurvis100
So they use carlube as their 'running in' oil?
All I do know is that TVR and Morgan, for some reason, supply their cars with CarLube Oil Triple R Oil in ...... thats the £12:99 Oil you are turning your nose up at.
Had it been called, CarLube RallyX Synthetic Oil, and cost £49:99 you would all be ranting about how BRILLIANT it was ...... because, of course, it MUST be cos' it's HUGELY expensive!
Don't you think??
Pete
19 May 2005, 07:42 PM
#110
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Question for Oilman, "How many Bulletin Boards do you peddle your wares?"
I am interested if you keep track, I keep seeing the same posts posted all over the internet, all saying the same.
Spanning Ford Escorts to Impreza's, MX5's to MIG's Vauxhalls .......
But, the underlying message is the same, "Buy your Oil from ME!" .... not a problem with that at all, by the way ... clever targeting
Pete
I am interested if you keep track, I keep seeing the same posts posted all over the internet, all saying the same.
Spanning Ford Escorts to Impreza's, MX5's to MIG's Vauxhalls .......
But, the underlying message is the same, "Buy your Oil from ME!" .... not a problem with that at all, by the way ... clever targeting
Pete
19 May 2005, 09:52 PM
#112
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Just been having a serious think about this topic ......
I doubt that ANYONE would argue that the difference over 1 minute of running an Impreza Engine on CarLube Triple R versus Oilmans 'Special' oil would make one bit of difference, yes??
OK, what about over 1 hour?? No difference again, I suspect??
What about 1 day/33 miles?? Surely daft to state there would be a difference??
And 1 week/230 miles?? Again, it would be laughable to suggest that damage was being done by using the cheaper oil??
1 month/1,000 miles?? Still, cannot really be argued that the engine is in dire danger of blowing up??
6 months/6,000 miles?? Come on, does anyone still believe that at this point the engine will be in pieces in some Engine re-build shop, due to a cheaper oil being used??
If there is a clear difference between these two oils, I would argue that it shows itself at an extended service interval ........ say, 24 months/24 months??
Put simply, a question for those who purport to know ........ at what time/mileage does the difference between these oils actually matter in the real world??
I suggest that at a 6 monthly oil change it makes very little difference which synthetic oil you choose to trust in, I think I'm right?
Pete
I doubt that ANYONE would argue that the difference over 1 minute of running an Impreza Engine on CarLube Triple R versus Oilmans 'Special' oil would make one bit of difference, yes??
OK, what about over 1 hour?? No difference again, I suspect??
What about 1 day/33 miles?? Surely daft to state there would be a difference??
And 1 week/230 miles?? Again, it would be laughable to suggest that damage was being done by using the cheaper oil??
1 month/1,000 miles?? Still, cannot really be argued that the engine is in dire danger of blowing up??
6 months/6,000 miles?? Come on, does anyone still believe that at this point the engine will be in pieces in some Engine re-build shop, due to a cheaper oil being used??
If there is a clear difference between these two oils, I would argue that it shows itself at an extended service interval ........ say, 24 months/24 months??
Put simply, a question for those who purport to know ........ at what time/mileage does the difference between these oils actually matter in the real world??
I suggest that at a 6 monthly oil change it makes very little difference which synthetic oil you choose to trust in, I think I'm right?
Pete
Last edited by pslewis; 19 May 2005 at 09:54 PM.
19 May 2005, 10:05 PM
#115
Originally Posted by pslewis
Question for Oilman, "How many Bulletin Boards do you peddle your wares?"
I am interested if you keep track, I keep seeing the same posts posted all over the internet, all saying the same.
Spanning Ford Escorts to Impreza's, MX5's to MIG's Vauxhalls .......
But, the underlying message is the same, "Buy your Oil from ME!" .... not a problem with that at all, by the way ... clever targeting
Pete
I am interested if you keep track, I keep seeing the same posts posted all over the internet, all saying the same.
Spanning Ford Escorts to Impreza's, MX5's to MIG's Vauxhalls .......
But, the underlying message is the same, "Buy your Oil from ME!" .... not a problem with that at all, by the way ... clever targeting
Pete
JohnD
19 May 2005, 10:06 PM
#116
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Does his turbo actually spool up below 3000 rpm ?
Originally Posted by jasonius
Ahh but only paying £13 for the oil he can afford to let some leak out to save the 20p for the sump washer..!
Jason
BTW according to your previous posts you don't take your scoob (if you've got one that is) over 3000rpm anyway. So PLEASE put this Carpet Lube stuff in your engine. If it dosen't melt we'll all galdly hold our hands up and in years to come people will and say 'remember old Pete the messiah who showed us the light about crap oil and dissmissed the scooby Cadbury's engine myth. Good old Pete RIP 05/012/05.'
What a hero.
Jason
BTW according to your previous posts you don't take your scoob (if you've got one that is) over 3000rpm anyway. So PLEASE put this Carpet Lube stuff in your engine. If it dosen't melt we'll all galdly hold our hands up and in years to come people will and say 'remember old Pete the messiah who showed us the light about crap oil and dissmissed the scooby Cadbury's engine myth. Good old Pete RIP 05/012/05.'
What a hero.
19 May 2005, 10:09 PM
#117
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Originally Posted by JohnD
I'm sure he has ALL the Engines of ALL the cars in the world at heart ... nowt to do with his Oil Retailing Business, of course!!
Pete
19 May 2005, 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
Just been having a serious think about this topic ......
I doubt that ANYONE would argue that the difference over 1 minute of running an Impreza Engine on CarLube Triple R versus Oilmans 'Special' oil would make one bit of difference, yes??
OK, what about over 1 hour?? No difference again, I suspect??
What about 1 day/33 miles?? Surely daft to state there would be a difference??
And 1 week/230 miles?? Again, it would be laughable to suggest that damage was being done by using the cheaper oil??
1 month/1,000 miles?? Still, cannot really be argued that the engine is in dire danger of blowing up??
6 months/6,000 miles?? Come on, does anyone still believe that at this point the engine will be in pieces in some Engine re-build shop, due to a cheaper oil being used??
If there is a clear difference between these two oils, I would argue that it shows itself at an extended service interval ........ say, 24 months/24 months??
Put simply, a question for those who purport to know ........ at what time/mileage does the difference between these oils actually matter in the real world??
I suggest that at a 6 monthly oil change it makes very little difference which synthetic oil you choose to trust in, I think I'm right?
Pete
I doubt that ANYONE would argue that the difference over 1 minute of running an Impreza Engine on CarLube Triple R versus Oilmans 'Special' oil would make one bit of difference, yes??
OK, what about over 1 hour?? No difference again, I suspect??
What about 1 day/33 miles?? Surely daft to state there would be a difference??
And 1 week/230 miles?? Again, it would be laughable to suggest that damage was being done by using the cheaper oil??
1 month/1,000 miles?? Still, cannot really be argued that the engine is in dire danger of blowing up??
6 months/6,000 miles?? Come on, does anyone still believe that at this point the engine will be in pieces in some Engine re-build shop, due to a cheaper oil being used??
If there is a clear difference between these two oils, I would argue that it shows itself at an extended service interval ........ say, 24 months/24 months??
Put simply, a question for those who purport to know ........ at what time/mileage does the difference between these oils actually matter in the real world??
I suggest that at a 6 monthly oil change it makes very little difference which synthetic oil you choose to trust in, I think I'm right?
Pete
19 May 2005, 10:32 PM
#119
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Originally Posted by GrollySTI
Surely you can see that it must also have something to do with how you drive those miles.
It's an Engine, it's designed to do what it does, it's designed to be stressed ....... both Oils stated are designed to cope with that - so not quite sure what you mean????
Pete
19 May 2005, 11:07 PM
#120
Originally Posted by New_scooby_04
Hang on, is 'car KY' really a Fully Synth and not a hydrocranked semi? (thus legally allowed to be described as a Fully Synth).
Originally Posted by GC8
But a lot of labels state that the contents are 'Synthetic' when theyre no such thing; its just dubious marketing...
But when you compare to main branded semi-synthetic to a lesser known full synthetic. Theoretically, PAO or not, the Full synthetic should be a better oil than any semi synth.
Bearing in mind Semi-synth is what the dealers use (and presumably that is what PSLewis's car has been fed on for all of its life), the question begs that switching to a budget Full synthetic is better than sticking to a main brand semi-synthetic.
TBH I don't know the exact specifics....but its an interesting point to take in.
The carlube Full-synth may be worse than a main brand PAO Fully-Synth which is in turn worse than a Ester Fully-Synth.
But in turn the Carlube Full-Synth is probably better than a Main brand semi-synth.
...It all depends on what perspective you look at it.
I have heard ofTetrosyl - big chemical corperation (I think they make T-cut, so may also own the carplan brand amongst many others). It's not uncommon for companies like this to purchase their basestock from the main oil companies.