Youth of today - Makes me sick
12 August 2004, 10:12 PM
#121
was in a petrol garage today next to a large car park and there were 2 chavs on bikes goin up to every car and havin a good old look. then their chavvy eyes caught sight of a woman on her own walkin through the car park. they then started to circle her looking for an opertunity to ****** her bag luckily a security warden turned up and they scarpered. and this was all in broard day light. and just shows they dont give a ****!
13 August 2004, 06:56 AM
#124
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In my humble opinion, Politics is misspelled... it should be Bolitics 
One particular person in this thread thinks a little too highly of himself and it would seem that he prefers nobody else to have even the slightest opinion in respect of politics at all.
Let's all hope and pray he never takes his political interest out of the classroom
Politics is what you make of it, and will never be a closed subject.
In reply to the original post, children today realise that they have a lot of protection so are not so fearful of the consequences of any action they take.
Schools are not able to intervene as they used to for fear of being at the receiving end of any police action themselves. The adult world really does have its hands tied behind its back.
Of course, parental guidance usually has a lot to answer for regarding these scallywags but this is not true all of the time.
One particular person in this thread thinks a little too highly of himself and it would seem that he prefers nobody else to have even the slightest opinion in respect of politics at all.Let's all hope and pray he never takes his political interest out of the classroom
Politics is what you make of it, and will never be a closed subject.
In reply to the original post, children today realise that they have a lot of protection so are not so fearful of the consequences of any action they take.
Schools are not able to intervene as they used to for fear of being at the receiving end of any police action themselves. The adult world really does have its hands tied behind its back.
Of course, parental guidance usually has a lot to answer for regarding these scallywags but this is not true all of the time.
13 August 2004, 07:16 AM
#125
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Originally Posted by unclebuck
That's ok. We've never had it so good according to our resident political experts such as scoobynutta555. lol
UB
UB
13 August 2004, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by the moose
Probably fairer to say that we're more divided than in prior decades. Those who have it good have it VERY good ... those at the bottom have a terrible time of it.
13 August 2004, 08:33 AM
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Originally Posted by chaarl
I'm not messing with you
A good sound bite there. My quote then proceeded to say "my knowledge is good". Not great, or excellent or god like......merely "good".
I have enough knowldege and have been around long enough/travelled enough to form a valid opinion based on what I've seen, backed up with what I've learnt.
13 August 2004, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by the moose
Sound to me like doing things the old way isn't really going to work, now is it?
And....breathe!
13 August 2004, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by TelBoy
Maybe, maybe not. But what i AM sick of, is a continual slide of moral values and behaviour generally here, which everybody seems to want to combat with words, not radical actions. We've gone so far down the road of political correctness, so far down the road of almost enforced ethnic integration, that everybody's too scared to do anything for fear of upsetting someone. I certainly don't want to turn the UK into a boot camp, but i DO want something done to make people start taking responsibility for their actions, rather than looking for somebody else to blame all the time.
And....breathe!
And....breathe!
13 August 2004, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by TelBoy
Maybe, maybe not. But what i AM sick of, is a continual slide of moral values and behaviour generally here, which everybody seems to want to combat with words, not radical actions. We've gone so far down the road of political correctness, so far down the road of almost enforced ethnic integration, that everybody's too scared to do anything for fear of upsetting someone. I certainly don't want to turn the UK into a boot camp, but i DO want something done to make people start taking responsibility for their actions, rather than looking for somebody else to blame all the time.
And....breathe!
And....breathe!
"People cannot be infallable, but they must be accountable". (OK, I cheated, that quote, ever so slightly changed, was from the movie Arlington Road).
13 August 2004, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by TelBoy
But what i AM sick of, is a continual slide of moral values and behaviour generally here, which everybody seems to want to combat with words, not radical actions. We've gone so far down the road of political correctness, so far down the road of almost enforced ethnic integration, that everybody's too scared to do anything for fear of upsetting someone.
And....breathe!
And....breathe!
A couple of points here.
Firstly, who has taken us down the road of political correctness? It's not as though this has happened without us knowing about it, and without our consent, is it?
Secondly, I defy you to find reasonable people who could take exception to the so-called PC things such as, say, stopping teachers smacking kids. I well recall our gym teacher, who used to take great pleasure in beating the boys, and who should never have been allowed to be in the profession in the first place. It's fine for the Daily Mail to shout about it, but most (not all by any means) of these measures have been taken for very good reasons.
A further example. My daughter's school had to cancel some activities which have gone on for years because of the cost of insuring the event, and although the parents grumbled about "nannying, PC state" etc, when given the option that their kid could take part so long as they signed an undertaking not to sue the school if the child was injured, they refused to do it. You can't eat your cake and have it, can you, and it's perhaps the spread of the greed culture which worries me more than anything else, together with the apparently growing belief that anything done by central government is bad, a waste of money, and to be avoided at all costs.
13 August 2004, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by the moose
Firstly, whop has taken us down the road of political correctness? It's not as though this has happened without us knowing about it, and without our consent, is it?
Originally Posted by the moose
Secondly, I defy you to find reasobable people who could take exception to the so-called PC things such as, say, stopping teachers smacking kids.
13 August 2004, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by TelBoy
Without my knowledge - no, obviously not. With my consent? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!
Well, you got one right here, unless i'm "unreasonable" now. Never did me any harm. Like all things, there are always horror stories, but it bloody well taught me right from wrong better than any "Look Terry, let's have a cuddle and a chat about you breaking little Tommy's nose..." chat.
Well, you got one right here, unless i'm "unreasonable" now. Never did me any harm. Like all things, there are always horror stories, but it bloody well taught me right from wrong better than any "Look Terry, let's have a cuddle and a chat about you breaking little Tommy's nose..." chat.
13 August 2004, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by the moose
A smack, fine. But when you get paedophiles masquerading as teachers, do you just put up with it? Accept that "kids will get over it"? Sorry, but we're going to have to disagree on this.
I don't think Telboy was referring to Paedophiles......
13 August 2004, 09:11 AM
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We will, yes. I'd rather see the introduction of better screening methods than abolish any form of corporal punishment, just because we can't identify the rotten apples in our schools. Now it's been abolished, it will never be brought back (not easily, anyway). And kids know this - they're not stupid. And so the level of discipline erodes. It's a downward spiral.
13 August 2004, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by TelBoy
. .......It's a downward spiral.
How anyone can say it is no different is really beyond me.
13 August 2004, 09:37 AM
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I can actually honestly say, that the fact that my school administered CP, had nothing to do with my "discovering" it, so to speak, at a later stage in my life (not consciously, anyway). Plenty of theories on that though, for discussion elsewhere perhaps.
13 August 2004, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by TelBoy
I can actually honestly say, that the fact that my school administered CP, had nothing to do with my "discovering" it, so to speak, at a later stage in my life (not consciously, anyway). Plenty of theories on that though, for discussion elsewhere perhaps.
Indeed
13 August 2004, 10:59 AM
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Some one on page 6 said that it is not only confined to the UK but Germany etc is going the same way, Sorry M8 but I beg to differ, Last night at 12:30AM I pulled into a petrol station in Böblingen Germany and there was a gang of older teanage lads loitering, I filled up my car (MY00 Scooby) then went to pay for the fule with my sat nav on the dash and my car phone in the cradle and didn't think twice about walking away from the car.
at least once a week I park my car in town or in car parks only to come back to find gangs of teanagers standing round it and looking from a distance usually about 6-10 ft away, then asking me about it. Never once has it been touched, scrached or dammaged, I have no parking dents either.
I parked in Hockeneim town centre in front of a gang of teanagers on bicycles, they spoke to me and looked I walked off came back an hour later and the car was still there but the lads had gone then I realised I had forgotten to lock it while I was talking to them, and nothing had been touched.
The germans have 2 languages formal and informal and a kid would never speak to a stranger or an adult in an informal way.
I live in Southern Germany where it is fairly tranqual and peacefull I can not vouch for mid to north germany but round my way the crime rate is ZERO, I do not even have an alarm on my car, I can leave it unlocked and not worry about it getting burgled or stolen.
I do not know what is taught in german schools or german homes but the kids have far higher respect and values than the plebs in the UK, I was not a goody goody at school but as has been said many times in this thread I was **** scared of the police and still am but also would never say boo to a goose, I would not even look at a lad in the year above me let alone gob off to him. I am now 34 so work out for yourself when I was at school, I started my school life in Manchester before moving to Crowthorne in Berkshire.
at least once a week I park my car in town or in car parks only to come back to find gangs of teanagers standing round it and looking from a distance usually about 6-10 ft away, then asking me about it. Never once has it been touched, scrached or dammaged, I have no parking dents either.
I parked in Hockeneim town centre in front of a gang of teanagers on bicycles, they spoke to me and looked I walked off came back an hour later and the car was still there but the lads had gone then I realised I had forgotten to lock it while I was talking to them, and nothing had been touched.
The germans have 2 languages formal and informal and a kid would never speak to a stranger or an adult in an informal way.
I live in Southern Germany where it is fairly tranqual and peacefull I can not vouch for mid to north germany but round my way the crime rate is ZERO, I do not even have an alarm on my car, I can leave it unlocked and not worry about it getting burgled or stolen.
I do not know what is taught in german schools or german homes but the kids have far higher respect and values than the plebs in the UK, I was not a goody goody at school but as has been said many times in this thread I was **** scared of the police and still am but also would never say boo to a goose, I would not even look at a lad in the year above me let alone gob off to him. I am now 34 so work out for yourself when I was at school, I started my school life in Manchester before moving to Crowthorne in Berkshire.
Last edited by Wurzel; 13 August 2004 at 11:09 AM.
13 August 2004, 11:35 AM
#146
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Originally Posted by Senior_AP
On my poll 12 said its worse, 2 said its the same and nobody thinks its better.
A landslide.
England is a ****hole and its getting worse.
Case closed.
A landslide.
England is a ****hole and its getting worse.
Case closed.
I violently disagree that "ooh, everything's getting worse, it's all going to the dogs". MAybe you're too young to remember the Brixton riots? The Poll Tax riots? The miner's strike? All of these things were MAJOR social events, and, correct me if I'm wrong, but the mood of unrest and despair is perhaps less now than it was in the 1980s.
Of course everyone's perspective changes - Tel (same age as me) thinks that things were better when he was at school, but although there are many schools where discipline is now a problem, perhaps he's just not aware of what it was like when he was a pupil. I recall one particularly nasty piece of work (who hospitalised me) who'd been kicked out of every school in the area, but as the local authority had an obligation to teach him, ended up back at the school he started from. This was in the late 1970's, so please don't tell me that it was all rosy back then.
Similarly, I used to see APPALLING vandalism around the poorer areas of the North-East - there's still a lot of it about, but it's no worse (and may even be a bit better).
Britain is NOT a ****hole, but if you're of a mindset to believe that it is, then I suppose it will be, at least for you. Personally, I think it's great - scruffy, poorly organised, but still great. And no, I don't live in an ivory tower, I don't have a trust fund I live off, I have to work far more hours than I'd like, and I hate the traffic. Overall, though, I'd not choose to live anywhere else, even though I have the options so to do.
13 August 2004, 11:50 AM
#147
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Originally Posted by Wurzel
Some one on page 6 said that it is not only confined to the UK but Germany etc is going the same way, Sorry M8 but I beg to differ, Last night at 12:30AM I pulled into a petrol station in Böblingen Germany and there was a gang of older teanage lads loitering, I filled up my car (MY00 Scooby) then went to pay for the fule with my sat nav on the dash and my car phone in the cradle and didn't think twice about walking away from the car.
at least once a week I park my car in town or in car parks only to come back to find gangs of teanagers standing round it and looking from a distance usually about 6-10 ft away, then asking me about it. Never once has it been touched, scrached or dammaged, I have no parking dents either.
I parked in Hockeneim town centre in front of a gang of teanagers on bicycles, they spoke to me and looked I walked off came back an hour later and the car was still there but the lads had gone then I realised I had forgotten to lock it while I was talking to them, and nothing had been touched.
The germans have 2 languages formal and informal and a kid would never speak to a stranger or an adult in an informal way.
I live in Southern Germany where it is fairly tranqual and peacefull I can not vouch for mid to north germany but round my way the crime rate is ZERO, I do not even have an alarm on my car, I can leave it unlocked and not worry about it getting burgled or stolen.
I do not know what is taught in german schools or german homes but the kids have far higher respect and values than the plebs in the UK, I was not a goody goody at school but as has been said many times in this thread I was **** scared of the police and still am but also would never say boo to a goose, I would not even look at a lad in the year above me let alone gob off to him. I am now 34 so work out for yourself when I was at school, I started my school life in Manchester before moving to Crowthorne in Berkshire.
at least once a week I park my car in town or in car parks only to come back to find gangs of teanagers standing round it and looking from a distance usually about 6-10 ft away, then asking me about it. Never once has it been touched, scrached or dammaged, I have no parking dents either.
I parked in Hockeneim town centre in front of a gang of teanagers on bicycles, they spoke to me and looked I walked off came back an hour later and the car was still there but the lads had gone then I realised I had forgotten to lock it while I was talking to them, and nothing had been touched.
The germans have 2 languages formal and informal and a kid would never speak to a stranger or an adult in an informal way.
I live in Southern Germany where it is fairly tranqual and peacefull I can not vouch for mid to north germany but round my way the crime rate is ZERO, I do not even have an alarm on my car, I can leave it unlocked and not worry about it getting burgled or stolen.
I do not know what is taught in german schools or german homes but the kids have far higher respect and values than the plebs in the UK, I was not a goody goody at school but as has been said many times in this thread I was **** scared of the police and still am but also would never say boo to a goose, I would not even look at a lad in the year above me let alone gob off to him. I am now 34 so work out for yourself when I was at school, I started my school life in Manchester before moving to Crowthorne in Berkshire.
It's not just Germany that teaches their kids respect and family values. Have spent a fair amount of time in Italy over the years and always impressed by the kids' respect for the older generations.
A few times we'd be walking back through town late at night and would meet gangs of youths down dark alleyways. Being from the UK we'd initially feel threatened by this but were always amazed and pleasantly surprised when they'd all politely move out the way, say hello and generally act with respect.
You can imagine that happening here can't you
IMO this country is going downhill, attitudes are changing, respect and discipline are being eroded. I don't profess to know what the answer is but I know is it's so bad I now just want to emigrate. And I know many people who feel the same way (of varying ages/backgounds).
I can't quite fathom people who expend so much energy defending this country and denying there is a social problem. I can only imagine they walk around with blinkers on
It's these people that exacerbate the problems by refusing to acknowledge that there is a problem in the first place.*** Disclaimer: I apologise for posting on this thread without a degree in politics. I accept that I am not qualified to have an opinion based on my life experiences. I also do not read the Daily Mail before The Moose trots out his usual put down for anyone that wants to live in a better world yet thinks that the softly, softly approach might not be the best way
***
13 August 2004, 11:50 AM
#148
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Originally Posted by the moose
Not everyone responded to your poll, you know.
I violently disagree that "ooh, everything's getting worse, it's all going to the dogs". MAybe you're too young to remember the Brixton riots? The Poll Tax riots? The miner's strike? All of these things were MAJOR social events, and, correct me if I'm wrong, but the mood of unrest and despair is perhaps less now than it was in the 1980s.
Of course everyone's perspective changes - Tel (same age as me) thinks that things were better when he was at school, but although there are many schools where discipline is now a problem, perhaps he's just not aware of what it was like when he was a pupil. I recall one particularly nasty piece of work (who hospitalised me) who'd been kicked out of every school in the area, but as the local authority had an obligation to teach him, ended up back at the school he started from. This was in the late 1970's, so please don't tell me that it was all rosy back then.
Similarly, I used to see APPALLING vandalism around the poorer areas of the North-East - there's still a lot of it about, but it's no worse (and may even be a bit better).
Britain is NOT a ****hole, but if you're of a mindset to believe that it is, then I suppose it will be, at least for you. Personally, I think it's great - scruffy, poorly organised, but still great. And no, I don't live in an ivory tower, I don't have a trust fund I live off, I have to work far more hours than I'd like, and I hate the traffic. Overall, though, I'd not choose to live anywhere else, even though I have the options so to do.
I violently disagree that "ooh, everything's getting worse, it's all going to the dogs". MAybe you're too young to remember the Brixton riots? The Poll Tax riots? The miner's strike? All of these things were MAJOR social events, and, correct me if I'm wrong, but the mood of unrest and despair is perhaps less now than it was in the 1980s.
Of course everyone's perspective changes - Tel (same age as me) thinks that things were better when he was at school, but although there are many schools where discipline is now a problem, perhaps he's just not aware of what it was like when he was a pupil. I recall one particularly nasty piece of work (who hospitalised me) who'd been kicked out of every school in the area, but as the local authority had an obligation to teach him, ended up back at the school he started from. This was in the late 1970's, so please don't tell me that it was all rosy back then.
Similarly, I used to see APPALLING vandalism around the poorer areas of the North-East - there's still a lot of it about, but it's no worse (and may even be a bit better).
Britain is NOT a ****hole, but if you're of a mindset to believe that it is, then I suppose it will be, at least for you. Personally, I think it's great - scruffy, poorly organised, but still great. And no, I don't live in an ivory tower, I don't have a trust fund I live off, I have to work far more hours than I'd like, and I hate the traffic. Overall, though, I'd not choose to live anywhere else, even though I have the options so to do.
You point out specific events. I refer to a "general" dwindling of standards, a culture of "general" lack of respect.
No, not everyone voted on my poll but a 12, 2, 0 is a good indication so far.
I'm proud to be English but embarassesd by England.
Last edited by Senior_AP; 13 August 2004 at 11:53 AM.
13 August 2004, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by blip
It's not just Germany that teaches their kids respect and family values. Have spent a fair amount of time in Italy over the years and always impressed by the kids' respect for the older generations.
A few times we'd be walking back through town late at night and would meet gangs of youths down dark alleyways. Being from the UK we'd initially feel threatened by this but were always amazed and pleasantly surprised when they'd all politely move out the way, say hello and generally act with respect.
You can imagine that happening here can't you
IMO this country is going downhill, attitudes are changing, respect and discipline are being eroded. I don't profess to know what the answer is but I know is it's so bad I now just want to emigrate. And I know many people who feel the same way (of varying ages/backgounds).
I can't quite fathom people who expend so much energy defending this country and denying there is a social problem. I can only imagine they walk around with blinkers on It's these people that exacerbate the problems by refusing to acknowledge that there is a problem in the first place.
*** Disclaimer: I apologise for posting on this thread without a degree in politics. I accept that I am not qualified to have an opinion based on my life experiences. I also do not read the Daily Mail before The Moose trots out his usual put down for anyone that wants to live in a better world yet thinks that the softly, softly approach might not be the best way ***
A few times we'd be walking back through town late at night and would meet gangs of youths down dark alleyways. Being from the UK we'd initially feel threatened by this but were always amazed and pleasantly surprised when they'd all politely move out the way, say hello and generally act with respect.
You can imagine that happening here can't you
IMO this country is going downhill, attitudes are changing, respect and discipline are being eroded. I don't profess to know what the answer is but I know is it's so bad I now just want to emigrate. And I know many people who feel the same way (of varying ages/backgounds).
I can't quite fathom people who expend so much energy defending this country and denying there is a social problem. I can only imagine they walk around with blinkers on
It's these people that exacerbate the problems by refusing to acknowledge that there is a problem in the first place.*** Disclaimer: I apologise for posting on this thread without a degree in politics. I accept that I am not qualified to have an opinion based on my life experiences. I also do not read the Daily Mail before The Moose trots out his usual put down for anyone that wants to live in a better world yet thinks that the softly, softly approach might not be the best way
***Excellent!! Yes yes and yesser!! Yesser isn't a word but yesser anyway!!
13 August 2004, 11:57 AM
#150
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Originally Posted by blip
I can't quite fathom people who expend so much energy defending this country and denying there is a social problem. I can only imagine they walk around with blinkers on It's these people that exacerbate the problems by refusing to acknowledge that there is a problem in the first place.
*** Disclaimer: I apologise for posting on this thread without a degree in politics. I accept that I am not qualified to have an opinion based on my life experiences. I also do not read the Daily Mail before The Moose trots out his usual put down for anyone that wants to live in a better world yet thinks that the softly, softly approach might not be the best way ***
It's these people that exacerbate the problems by refusing to acknowledge that there is a problem in the first place.*** Disclaimer: I apologise for posting on this thread without a degree in politics. I accept that I am not qualified to have an opinion based on my life experiences. I also do not read the Daily Mail before The Moose trots out his usual put down for anyone that wants to live in a better world yet thinks that the softly, softly approach might not be the best way
***People have mentioned Germany and Italy. I have experience of Holland and Denmark.
In ALL of these countries there's a high level of what many people here would call "PC stupidity", yet they have many fewer social ills (though it depends where you go - there are bits of Germany I'n not care to venture into) then we see in the UK.
Primarily, though, they all have a higher level of stable family units, lower levels of teen age pregnancy, and a general acceptance of society as a good thing. In the UK we seem obsessed with the idea that central government is bad, that societal change is bad, and that everything was good in the good old days. It wasn't. It never has been.
Edited to say - thanks for the insult, Blip. I'm tempted to respond in kind, but there's little point, so have some right-on hugs and kisses instead.
Last edited by the moose; 13 August 2004 at 12:00 PM.