JTaylor

Time will tell.

Geezer

Leavers have voted to leave, without any idea of what sort of deal they are going to get. It's quite astonishing, really.

If someone knocked on your door and asked you to support an enterprise, without knowing any details of how it would affect you, you would slam the door in their face, yet this is exactly what has been voted for.

I suspect that if the referendum was held and the details were known, and they were "ok, we'll have less immigrants, but trade with the EU is going to cost us a fortune, you can't visit the EU without a visa" then a\lot of people would have rejected it out of hand. Obviously that is just an illustration, but.....

Theresa May is asking us to take a leap of faith.

Part of me wishes it does all go **** up, then we will see who the Brexiteers try and blame their woes on.

I can well see us re-applying to join the EU in 20 years, and then we'll have Euro, free movement, and no rebate or privileged status like we do now.

hodgy0_2

what is fascinating is even arch Bexiteers are looking a bit sceptical with respect to the hardliners

below is an article by Christopher Booker (and anyone reasonably informed will know that Booker has campaigned for 30 years to leave the EU)


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...ver-the-cliff/

astonishing words from Booker

"Dr Liam Fox, the International Trade Secretary, showing that he has learnt no more about the real world than was evident in the referendum campaign. Babbling about all those wonderful “free-trade deals” he imagines winning, he mentioned the World Trade Organisation (WTO) 20 times and the EU’s single market only once. "


the big problem May et al have, is they are caught between a rock and a hard place

Hard Brexit is a nonsense - only lunatics like Fox support it (but amazingly he has some influence)

Soft Brexit - where some limited freedom of movement is allowed - has its own problems because the "limited" bit will most likely be "only if they have a Job" the sort or "work permit" approach

the problem with that is - informed people will simply point out this was pretty much what we had when we were in the EU

i.e. EU rules state that you have to have a job (or a reasonable change of getting one) to enjoy free movement - it was never a carte blanche to move ***** nilly around the EU

certainly interesting times

stilover

Yes, but Remainers voted to remain for a deal that they know very little about, and no idea what that deal will be in the future. And neither did the UK Government, considering Brussels can pass laws and change deals to suit themselves.

And what veto would we have? None, because the UK representatives would be out voted, and new laws passed anyway.

The way we have it now, is we can make our own laws, and make our own trade deals that suits the UK.

So to vote `remain` and have no idea what deal they have or will get in the future. It's quite astonishing really.

Norman Dog

iTrader: (1)

When the EU started to let all the ex commie sh!tholes in is when the problems really started.

How on earth did the country manage before 2004, eh?

Although big business definitely benefits from an unlimited supply of cheap labour, working class Brits certainly don't.

JackClark

wrx300scooby

Well said

hodgy0_2

below are the facts regarding our votes in Europe

https://fullfact.org/europe/eu-facts...-uk-influence/

The British government has voted against EU laws 2% of the time since 1999

Official EU voting records* show that the British government has voted ‘No’ to laws passed at EU level on 56 occasions, abstained 70 times, and voted ‘Yes’ 2,466 times since 1999, according to UK in a Changing Europe Fellows Sara Hagemann and Simon Hix.

In other words, UK ministers were on the “winning side” 95% of the time, abstained 3% of the time, and were on the losing side 2%.

JTaylor

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/bu...-a7343736.html

wrx300scooby

Just a blip

stilover

That's because, just like house prices, sterling can only go up. Never down.

House prices went up 200% in 10 years. They fell by 2% for a month, and people cried property crisis. F**k'in hell

***Above figure are for example only. Please don't post some gutter press cutting quoting houses only went up 178% and down 3.2%***

hodgy0_2

the thing with this stuff is you have to separate the "noise from the signal"

you will always get short term volatility around economic indicators - the noise, i.e. the wild ups and downs

and it is easy to cherry-pick a small range or sample size

and it can distract you from the signal (or trend)

but I think the trend (in peoples living standards) will be unequivocally down - i.e. most people will be worse off

there will always be a few winners - but far more losers

stilover

Think !!! So not based on any facts at all then? Just your hunch? Your gut instinct?

Quick, get Mrs May on the phone. Call off Brexit !!!!

scoobyboy1

iTrader: (16)

Since I voted to leave the EU, My mortgage has dropped in monthly payments and we have had a pay rise at work this month, So upto now personally Im glad with my decision

hodgy0_2

yeah sure think

but since you "thought" having no VED invalidated your insurance

and kept "thinking" it whilst being shown your "thoughts" were delusional cr4p

I would keep quiet about your capacity to "think"

JackClark

Selfish bull****.

scoobyboy1

iTrader: (16)

Its not selfish, as my wife benefits from it too!! Plus the extra money I save on the mortgage payments a month I can take my kids out so they benefit and with the extra few pound I have left I give to http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/

stilover

At least I `think` we (as a nation) are better off making our own decisions, laws, & trade deals.

Try getting behind your country instead of always looking for the negatives. Think negative and negative things will happen.

We (as a nation) should lead, and not be led by a bunch of un-elected bureaucrats, who want a United States of Europe. They're even moving to a United European army.

Err, no thinks. The Euro is in crisis. The EU is in crisis, and I want us to protect our own country. If you are so sure that being part of the EU is that important to you, then move to Europe. However, there's a very long que to get in. Oh yes, there's another crisis !!

stilover

You should know by now on here. It's very un-British to do well.

Get a payrise? Reduced mortgage? Not fair.

Bunch of Liberals on here. If one get a payrise, we all have to have one, or nothing.

Christ, lots of British F1 fans on here would rather Rosberg won the F1 world championship rather than one of our own.

hodgy0_2

you sound like the England football manager

as Jtaylor posted "time will tell"

if in 5 years time it is all fine and dandy - I will admit I was wrong

I have no problem with that

neil-h

the great "one of our own". Love it.

Torquemada

well, conversely, Brexit immediately f*cked me. Pound went to absolute **** against the dollar, pretty much overnight. I'm selling my apartment in the UK so that means I have lost a bunch of money.

Time will indeed tell.

DoZZa

iTrader: (4)

Multicultural society vs Culturally diverse society.

Are they the same thing?

hodgy0_2

They also sort of miss the point that the reduction in interest rates and the massive trillion £ injection of cash into the UK economy by the BOE post Brexit vote

Is not really (on a UK wide level) something to crow about

It just underlines how weak our economy is - and we haven't even left yet

And now we hear that the treasury is guaranteeing to underwrite the inevitable additional costs to companies like Nissan when we Brexit

neil-h

That wouldn't happen to be using the same pot of money that the Brexit campaign said would go to the NHS, or that the Labour Party have said will go to areas that lose out on EU funding by any chance?

stilover

Or maybe they're trying to stop Nissan doing what Renault (owners of Nissan) have done, and opened up a factory in India to produce cars. India, where the labour rates are far lower than here in Britain. So if Nissan up sticks and move, many thousands of people will lose their jobs.

Funnily enough though, India is thriving (was predicted that they will boom like China did) due to companies wanting cheap labour. China is becoming too expensive. As their economy grows, so does their standard of living, and wages need to rise to match that.

No doubt if Nissan does move, it'll give the Remainers a good old moan as to another example of how Brexit has ruined Britain.

Oh hang on a second though !!! Is India in the EU? No. Do they negotiate their own trade deals? Yes. Are they growing as an economy by not being in some Bureaucratic democracy where everyone has to be treated equally? Yes.

Will we now be able to negotiate our own prosperous trade deals with 2 of the biggest economies on the planet (USA & China) and negotiate a prosperous trade deal with the next up coming large economy, India? Yes we will

You need to email India, and tell them they're doing it wrong.

No doubt China got your email years ago .......... and ignored it, even though you clearly know better.

dpb

Well all that stuff we sell to China and India should be made easier now the pounds dived

Turbohot

I overheard someone saying on Sky TV last night: " I work in a diverse environment..... I work in a multi-diverse environment". I thought to myself that WOW, this person doesn't just work in a diverse but a multi-diverse environment! the speaker was specifically indicating the ethnic variety; in relation to Brexit. I'm not sure whether she was a bit nervous for being quizzed on TV or else, but the term in the context sounded a bit schizophrenic.

I said I 'overheard' because I was multi-tasking at that time. My eyes weren't fixed to TV, but my ears were attentive to the sound of it.

stilover

And share prices are up on the back of what you've said.

Plus, what people need to realise with sterling. It's being affected by speculators. Big powerful companies who can adjust exchange rates to suit themselves.

And suiting themselves is exactly what they are doing. Probably making hundreds of Millions of pounds off Brexit. Not because of anything that actually effects us. But just because they can buy and sell huge amounts of sterling at whatever exchange rate they decide to make it.

Exactly the same with oil.

dpb

Does share price affect the average person ?