Death penalty for owners of mad dogs
24 August 2016, 04:39 PM
#121
The human race is intrinsically "dumb". And for as long as it continues to be "dumb", sadly, children (and the occasional adult) will continue to be maimed and killed by dogs.
There is a lot of nonsense being spouted on this thread about dog behavior, particularly that they are unpredictable wild animals.
I see that the dog bite stats are being posted. Bites and "maulings to death" are quite different behaviors.
Anyone with half an ounce of understanding of dog behavior will know that the vast majority of dog bites are down to people not understanding all of the warning signs before the bite finally comes. That bite is generally a last resort response from the dog, and contrary to some of the nonsense posted on here is a pretty predictable response at that. Its not the involuntary and unpredictable act of a genetically programmed hunter resorting to its natural wild state.
Unfortunately dogs can't say "ffs stop that, you're pi55ing me right off". Their response behaviors are more limited.
Dog maulings and the more prolonged attacks are a different behavior, and one more likely to have been heavily influenced by inappropriate or intentional training of those behaviors. Dogs are natural scavengers, not hunters. They have sharp teeth because they are carnivores. Hunting and fighting dogs are bred-in breed traits. Studies now conclude that dogs and wolves evolved separately from a common ancestor, not that dogs evolved from wolves.
What we need (as always) is for people to be better educated in dog behavior. We teach (or at least should) children the dangers of crossing a road, or talking to strangers. But how many of us take the time to understand what is likely to make a dog bite?
Having said all of that, I agree with the OP that the owners (or more specifically those that have taken inadequate care to prevent tragic events such as the one which prompted this thread) should be heavily penalised for allowing this to happen. If my dog bit anyone (or worse) and that was due to my ignorance or lack of care and attention, I'd accept responsibility for that.
If, however, some random child runs up to a dog and teases it to the point of getting bitten, then my sympathy lies with the dog and its owners.
There is a lot of nonsense being spouted on this thread about dog behavior, particularly that they are unpredictable wild animals.
I see that the dog bite stats are being posted. Bites and "maulings to death" are quite different behaviors.
Anyone with half an ounce of understanding of dog behavior will know that the vast majority of dog bites are down to people not understanding all of the warning signs before the bite finally comes. That bite is generally a last resort response from the dog, and contrary to some of the nonsense posted on here is a pretty predictable response at that. Its not the involuntary and unpredictable act of a genetically programmed hunter resorting to its natural wild state.
Unfortunately dogs can't say "ffs stop that, you're pi55ing me right off". Their response behaviors are more limited.
Dog maulings and the more prolonged attacks are a different behavior, and one more likely to have been heavily influenced by inappropriate or intentional training of those behaviors. Dogs are natural scavengers, not hunters. They have sharp teeth because they are carnivores. Hunting and fighting dogs are bred-in breed traits. Studies now conclude that dogs and wolves evolved separately from a common ancestor, not that dogs evolved from wolves.
What we need (as always) is for people to be better educated in dog behavior. We teach (or at least should) children the dangers of crossing a road, or talking to strangers. But how many of us take the time to understand what is likely to make a dog bite?
Having said all of that, I agree with the OP that the owners (or more specifically those that have taken inadequate care to prevent tragic events such as the one which prompted this thread) should be heavily penalised for allowing this to happen. If my dog bit anyone (or worse) and that was due to my ignorance or lack of care and attention, I'd accept responsibility for that.
If, however, some random child runs up to a dog and teases it to the point of getting bitten, then my sympathy lies with the dog and its owners.
So 'a random child', a young human being, running up in all innocence to a dog gets bitten, maybe badly mauled, maybe killed, yet your sympathy goes to the dog and its owners? Only an insane human would attack a child in this way whatever the provocation, yet a dog does it and it's ok because the child asked for it? That's a twisted point of view to say the least and is typical of those owners who put their animals before the welfare of their own kind.
24 August 2016, 04:48 PM
#122
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So 'a random child', a young human being, running up in all innocence to a dog gets bitten, maybe badly mauled, maybe killed, yet your sympathy goes to the dog and its owners? Only an insane human would attack a child in this way whatever the provocation, yet a dog does it and it's ok because the child asked for it? That's a twisted point of view to say the least and is typical of those owners who put their animals before the welfare of their own kind.
I trust my dog more than i trust any stranger,
Would need to be pretty important to me to save you from a burning building before my Dog,
If i had to choose between my Dog and another human it would be my Dog everytime.
Try keeping an eye on your kids or if you cant then find one a those leash things you can attach them to
If they run up to random dogs, or lick plugs, touch fires or other stupid stuff,Glad we don't have any real dangerous wild animals here eh
24 August 2016, 05:31 PM
#123
I put my Animal before any human not related to me
I trust my dog more than i trust any stranger,
Would need to be pretty important to me to save you from a burning building before my Dog,
If i had to choose between my Dog and another human it would be my Dog everytime.
Try keeping an eye on your kids or if you cant then find one a those leash things you can attach them to If they run up to random dogs, or lick plugs, touch fires or other stupid stuff,
Glad we don't have any real dangerous wild animals here eh
I trust my dog more than i trust any stranger,
Would need to be pretty important to me to save you from a burning building before my Dog,
If i had to choose between my Dog and another human it would be my Dog everytime.
Try keeping an eye on your kids or if you cant then find one a those leash things you can attach them to
If they run up to random dogs, or lick plugs, touch fires or other stupid stuff,Glad we don't have any real dangerous wild animals here eh
25 August 2016, 10:56 AM
#124
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So 'a random child', a young human being, running up in all innocence to a dog gets bitten, maybe badly mauled, maybe killed, yet your sympathy goes to the dog and its owners? Only an insane human would attack a child in this way whatever the provocation, yet a dog does it and it's ok because the child asked for it? That's a twisted point of view to say the least and is typical of those owners who put their animals before the welfare of their own kind.
Take your blinkers off Paben, and read it again without the ignorance (in the truest sense of the word) that appears to afflict you about dog behavior.
You've stated that "only an insane human would attack a child in this way"
Dogs, clearly, are not human. They don't see a child the way you or I would, so your comparison is irrelevant. Having said that, there is probably more risk of being violently attacked by a random stranger than there is of that child being "badly mauled" or "maybe killed"
If you must put it in human terms, however, consider the act of a provoked dog biting to be similar to that time you punched wee Johnny in the face in the school playground because wee Johnny wouldn't stop calling you fat/gay/ginger/ugly* (*delete as applicable) despite you telling him several times that you'd punch him in the face if he didn't stop.
25 August 2016, 11:01 AM
#125
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Putting the above attitude into practice would actually render you culpable of a criminal offence in quite a number of countries. Elsewhere, it would just render you culpable of being a complete and utter kn*b.
I'd also rescue my dog from said burning building first before putting myself at risk to try and rescue a random stranger. And I suspect many who have an emotional attachment to their pets would too.
25 August 2016, 11:06 AM
#126
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If you form a bond of friendship with a dog it is given unconditionally by the dog. They truly become part of your family, and who wouldn't rescue a family member before a stranger?
25 August 2016, 11:22 AM
#127
That's not what I said (posted). The risk of a dog even biting, far less mauling or killing a child that simply runs up to it is quite probably less than the risk of that child being run over whilst running to see the dog.
Take your blinkers off Paben, and read it again without the ignorance (in the truest sense of the word) that appears to afflict you about dog behavior.
You've stated that "only an insane human would attack a child in this way"
Dogs, clearly, are not human. They don't see a child the way you or I would, so your comparison is irrelevant. Having said that, there is probably more risk of being violently attacked by a random stranger than there is of that child being "badly mauled" or "maybe killed"
If you must put it in human terms, however, consider the act of a provoked dog biting to be similar to that time you punched wee Johnny in the face in the school playground because wee Johnny wouldn't stop calling you fat/gay/ginger/ugly* (*delete as applicable) despite you telling him several times that you'd punch him in the face if he didn't stop.
Take your blinkers off Paben, and read it again without the ignorance (in the truest sense of the word) that appears to afflict you about dog behavior.
You've stated that "only an insane human would attack a child in this way"
Dogs, clearly, are not human. They don't see a child the way you or I would, so your comparison is irrelevant. Having said that, there is probably more risk of being violently attacked by a random stranger than there is of that child being "badly mauled" or "maybe killed"
If you must put it in human terms, however, consider the act of a provoked dog biting to be similar to that time you punched wee Johnny in the face in the school playground because wee Johnny wouldn't stop calling you fat/gay/ginger/ugly* (*delete as applicable) despite you telling him several times that you'd punch him in the face if he didn't stop.
You dare call me blinkered when you would put the safety of your dog before that of a human being? And this repeated 'run over by a car' argument is just nonsense and irrelevant.
Where people are concerned the Fire Brigade has its priorities sorted even if you don't. In a fire they will risk a lot to save a human; they will risk nothing to save a dog.
25 August 2016, 11:45 AM
#129
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You dare call me blinkered when you would put the safety of your dog before that of a human being? And this repeated 'run over by a car' argument is just nonsense and irrelevant.
Where people are concerned the Fire Brigade has its priorities sorted even if you don't. In a fire they will risk a lot to save a human; they will risk nothing to save a dog.
Where people are concerned the Fire Brigade has its priorities sorted even if you don't. In a fire they will risk a lot to save a human; they will risk nothing to save a dog.
The car analogy wasn't an argument. It was contextual. (look it up if you don't understand the concept). Were you not the one proclaiming that domestic dogs will be banned? I'm just putting the risk into context.
As for saving my dog first - that's a choice. A choice I am at liberty to make. I have no moral (or legal) obligation to put myself at risk to try and save a stranger. But I can chose to do so to try and save something of massive importance to me.
The same choice you would make if you could save your child but in doing so had to let 10 other random children die. Surely the lives of 10 are more important than just one? You may counter and saying but that's different - but its not. Its not about putting an animal before a human. Its about saving something of massive importance to you in priority to something that is not.
Selfish? Yes. I'll happily admit that. A very "human" trait.
If we're talking irrelevant arguments, your fire brigade example is so irrelevant as to be laughable. Its their job. Its the job they chose to do, and its the protocol they adhere to. As such it has zero relevance to this discussion and further undermines any credibility you have so far attempted to portray in this discussion.
Last edited by Devildog; 25 August 2016 at 11:47 AM.
25 August 2016, 12:00 PM
#131
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Pit bulls and breeds like that have far worse tolerance for being friendly like normal dogs. Put these dogs into the hands of the scummish people who decide to own them and you are asking for trouble...as we have found out with all the children mauled to death over the last decade or so.
25 August 2016, 12:06 PM
#132
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Seriously. Do you people actually engage your brains, or alternatively do any research before posting.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/ne...o-bite-humans/
http://www.dogbiteclaims.co.uk/dangerous-breeds.html
Pit bulls and "breeds like that" are actually more tolerant of humans than many "normal" dogs
Last edited by Devildog; 25 August 2016 at 12:08 PM.
25 August 2016, 12:16 PM
#133
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is there a facepalm emoticon big enough....
Seriously. Do you people actually engage your brains, or alternatively do any research before posting.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/ne...o-bite-humans/
http://www.dogbiteclaims.co.uk/dangerous-breeds.html
Pit bulls and "breeds like that" are actually more tolerant of humans than many "normal" dogs
Seriously. Do you people actually engage your brains, or alternatively do any research before posting.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/ne...o-bite-humans/
http://www.dogbiteclaims.co.uk/dangerous-breeds.html
Pit bulls and "breeds like that" are actually more tolerant of humans than many "normal" dogs
Infact name all the breeds of dog that killed kids over that time frame. What have they in common.
More tolerant of humans my ***.
25 August 2016, 01:56 PM
#134
is there a facepalm emoticon big enough....
Seriously. Do you people actually engage your brains, or alternatively do any research before posting.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/ne...o-bite-humans/
http://www.dogbiteclaims.co.uk/dangerous-breeds.html
Pit bulls and "breeds like that" are actually more tolerant of humans than many "normal" dogs
Seriously. Do you people actually engage your brains, or alternatively do any research before posting.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/ne...o-bite-humans/
http://www.dogbiteclaims.co.uk/dangerous-breeds.html
Pit bulls and "breeds like that" are actually more tolerant of humans than many "normal" dogs
Your delusion obviously knows no bounds. But then what can be expected from a fool who considers dogs to be more important humans?
25 August 2016, 02:21 PM
#135
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Not sure where i said dogs are more important than humans. We all know the traits of owners of these dogs and what damage they have done to children over the years.
People harping on about banning diy and cars are idiots and cant face the reality.
Only a matter of time before the government does something on licensing of these breeds.
25 August 2016, 04:17 PM
#136
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lol, really.
Just do a quick Google search and you will see that what you state is totally untrue.
In fact, here http://bfy.tw/7ODI
Just do a quick Google search and you will see that what you state is totally untrue.
In fact, here http://bfy.tw/7ODI
25 August 2016, 04:20 PM
#137
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lol, really.
Just do a quick Google search and you will see that what you state is totally untrue.
In fact, here http://bfy.tw/7ODI
Just do a quick Google search and you will see that what you state is totally untrue.
In fact, here http://bfy.tw/7ODI
25 August 2016, 04:20 PM
#138
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Is it an intelligence thing? Clearly lacking in some cases wouldn't you agree?
Who are we, as humans to decide the importance of an animal on this planet?
25 August 2016, 04:41 PM
#139
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25 August 2016, 04:49 PM
#140
Clearly lacking in your case, and if you have to ask why a human life is more important than that of an animal then I pity you. The Law plainly thinks this to be the case as does any right thinking person.
And as for fire fighters, they do a building search following training standards and guidelines. They will not put fire fighters' lives at risk to search for pets inside a burning building. If during a search they discover a pet the animal is left to fend for itself and find its own way out or die in the fire. This is official policy. Fire fighters lives will not be put at risk for a pet.
25 August 2016, 04:59 PM
#141
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Did you even read the information given in the links posted?
I'm not defending any particular breed here - but you need to get your facts right.
25 August 2016, 05:09 PM
#142
Scooby Regular
If you want to limit the discussion to just deaths caused by dogs (not what Toffee pie was saying at all) then clearly the bigger, stronger breeds are going to feature more highly, particularly those which more attractive (sadly) to the scum elements of society.
If you consider me a fool for placing the life of my family pet dog ahead of a random human, then that is entirely your prerogative. Doesn't necessarily mean its true, however.
I'm basing my position on facts and experience. You and toffee pie appear to be doing so from reading the daily mail - but please feel free to present facts to evidence the contrary.
25 August 2016, 05:10 PM
#143
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Clearly lacking in your case, and if you have to ask why a human life is more important than that of an animal then I pity you. The Law plainly thinks this to be the case as does any right thinking person.
And as for fire fighters, they do a building search following training standards and guidelines. They will not put fire fighters' lives at risk to search for pets inside a burning building. If during a search they discover a pet the animal is left to fend for itself and find its own way out or die in the fire. This is official policy. Fire fighters lives will not be put at risk for a pet.
And as for fire fighters, they do a building search following training standards and guidelines. They will not put fire fighters' lives at risk to search for pets inside a burning building. If during a search they discover a pet the animal is left to fend for itself and find its own way out or die in the fire. This is official policy. Fire fighters lives will not be put at risk for a pet.
Cant say I have ever read such closed minded opinions such as yours.
Cuz the law says so, cuz the goverment says so. Of course, cuz what they say is gospel isn't it!
25 August 2016, 05:16 PM
#144
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Your thoughts are more superior to mine and anyone else's you happen to disagree with?
Why? What makes our great Paben's thoughts and opinions so much better than anyone else's?
Your a fool if you walk through life thinking that your own opinion is the last and final word. I pity you sir for being that fool.
Why? What makes our great Paben's thoughts and opinions so much better than anyone else's?
Your a fool if you walk through life thinking that your own opinion is the last and final word. I pity you sir for being that fool.
25 August 2016, 05:56 PM
#145
Wrong on so many levels? Which levels?
Fire Brigade policy is not made by me and is fact. And what the Law says is actually gospel, or are you a career criminal who ignores such niceties?
What I do know is that anyone who puts dogs before humans is in need of treatment, but I suspect from your attitude in general that you are probably not all there.
25 August 2016, 07:26 PM
#146
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I think you're confusing tolerance with size and strength. The consequence of a bite from a much larger stronger dog is likely to be far worse. That does not make those breeds or types less tolerant.
Did you even read the information given in the links posted?
I'm not defending any particular breed here - but you need to get your facts right.
Did you even read the information given in the links posted?
I'm not defending any particular breed here - but you need to get your facts right.
Its owner falls into a social class and b)
the dog is of a certain breed.
25 August 2016, 10:49 PM
#147
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Wrong on so many levels? Which levels?
Fire Brigade policy is not made by me and is fact. And what the Law says is actually gospel, or are you a career criminal who ignores such niceties?
What I do know is that anyone who puts dogs before humans is in need of treatment, but I suspect from your attitude in general that you are probably not all there.
Fire Brigade policy is not made by me and is fact. And what the Law says is actually gospel, or are you a career criminal who ignores such niceties?
What I do know is that anyone who puts dogs before humans is in need of treatment, but I suspect from your attitude in general that you are probably not all there.
Do you see me conversing with any other member on here the way I do with you? No, you dont. This is because you are a complete bigot. If the dictionary was to have been compiled today, it would say the following.
bigot
noun [ C ] UK /ˈbɪɡ.ət/ US /ˈbɪɡ.ət/ disapproving
Also know as a Paben, who have strong, unreasonable beliefs and who does not like other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life as a Paben:
Last edited by DoZZa; 25 August 2016 at 10:52 PM. Reason: Don't want to upset the English teachers!
25 August 2016, 11:31 PM
#148
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Paben and markjmd - you've come across as incredibly ignorant on this thread.
26 August 2016, 06:42 AM
#149
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-wildfire.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-fell-ice.html
http://wgme.com/news/local/man-dies-...-new-hampshire
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-35209924
(close to 2 Millions hits, for the phrase 'man dies saving dog')
26 August 2016, 07:47 AM
#150
Blah blah bloody blah. Same old record different thread!
Do you see me conversing with any other member on here the way I do with you? No, you dont. This is because you are a complete bigot. If the dictionary was to have been compiled today, it would say the following.
bigot
noun [ C ] UK /ˈbɪɡ.ət/ US /ˈbɪɡ.ət/ disapproving
Also know as a Paben, who have strong, unreasonable beliefs and who does not like other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life as a Paben:
Do you see me conversing with any other member on here the way I do with you? No, you dont. This is because you are a complete bigot. If the dictionary was to have been compiled today, it would say the following.
bigot
noun [ C ] UK /ˈbɪɡ.ət/ US /ˈbɪɡ.ət/ disapproving
Also know as a Paben, who have strong, unreasonable beliefs and who does not like other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life as a Paben:
What on earth are you banging on about now? Utter drivel!
Actually I see you conversing with others on here in exacty the same way; when someone dares to disagree with your opinion you soon resort to bullying, insults and even threats.
In case your ravings have made you lose track, I simply believe a human life to be more valuable than that of any animal; maybe even yours.