Hatch08

It should pay but it doesn't. Mapper #2 and #4 have fully equipped garages so they did the mechanical work as well

RAGGY DOO

iTrader: (1)

Chevron equals bob rawle

the shreksta

iTrader: (20)

so who are they?

Hatch08

I can PM you who they are if you want to. But then you can't claim the Grimmspeed TMIC. Would you like to give it a shot?

Tidgy

i only ever use clinic, if i get an issue i pick up the phone speak to kev and they have it in to fix it, if its an issue with something they have done there's no bill, if its something else its my bill. works quite well that way

Hatch08

That's how it should be done

the shreksta

iTrader: (20)

well the only places i can think of with everything under one roof are.....

roger clark motorsport
thwaites
scoobyclinic
engine tuner
area 52
slowboy racing
fb tuning

Dan_SCR_RA

Im not taking messages today if you mean me..... iv blocked the little *******

Tidgy

*****, just can't take it,,,,,,,,

hahahaha

RAGGY DOO

iTrader: (1)

Why pm the names ?
have we all signed non disclosure agreements with mappers ?
i can’t figure out the constant need for secrecy
They are not gods

the shreksta

iTrader: (20)

I totally agree, name and shame all the way

RAGGY DOO

iTrader: (1)

Its not even name and Shame
folk are terrified to say anything
I’f it was any other tradesman would you not speak up ?

Tidgy

half the time people do say and argument ensues thats nothign to do with technical knowledge but just hes best in the world, no hes best int he world, no hes best in the world etc etc

Some of the things i've seen when engines/cars have been stripped with suposedly well respected tuners is shocking.

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

Hence my post.

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

I agree. There

Tidgy

problem is it devloes into a slag fest, then someone will threaten to sue if the posts arn't removed and the thread will be gone. I still rememeber a very widley known and well respected tuner who actualy had polls created on here and voted down their competition

Ash Webster

Andy does my mapping. I actually managed to have a full on email conversation with him (holy ****!). He told me why my car was giving me the exact symptoms it was and how i could fix it. And advised me that 550's were his limit for ESL due to poor performance with higher injectors etc. Car now runs amazing and i have a big smile on my face as opposed to driving around with virtually no boost available. Knowledgable bloke. not cheap or easy to get hold of but hes always sorted mine out.

And to answer other peoples questions about mappers and trust etc - some of the people moaning will be moaning that no one is available to map their car in 10-15 years time.. Unless you have a degree of trust then go learn it yourself. No two cars are the same (especially modified ones like ours). I for one will be stuck for luck if Andy just decided to stop mapping one day.

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

I agree, the bloke is far too busy for his own good to be honest. That's the trouble with travelling mappers who use different venues. I used him up at Pole Position as it is the furthest south he travels which is still 3 hours from me. As he's only there 1 day a week (not every week either) you can imagine that Pole Position build cars, book customers in and Andy is full on busy wiring & mapping from the second he arrives to when he leaves with little to no time for pleasantries or customer chat. It's a real shame as he's a really nice guy. Once he had sorted my issues I honestly couldn't fault the car, it was perfect.

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

550's is the limit for ESL lol
New one to me.
Just needs a decent amount of time to map properly,not the hour(if your lucky) that seems to be the norm for tuners that road map.
Btw I run 740's on my v3 running ESL.

cuprajake

iTrader: (11)

depends who you go to, andys spent a good few hrs mapping my cars when he comes not just a flash and drive away

the problem with tuning scoobs esp is theres so many variations in mods

like the vw guys all tend to do/use the same thing

hpfp/intake/exhaust and a map

these parts are asl only sold by a handful of people which is why there are so many generic maps for the vag group

now if you lined 5 scoobs up, each one would have a different intake, a different exhaust, a different decat down pipe, intercooler so these take more time, and if you get a crap mapper then the generic map they dl wont be as good,

everyones guna make a mistake along the lines somewhere, when me/andy first went mafless on my bug it really didnt like it, a quick fettle and happy days, he actually came back to me to sort it. hes just suck a busy bloke

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

I agree. When Andy first mapped my FSTI at Pole Position I arrived 8am, had a downpipe fitted and then had to wait until very late in the afternoon/evening that same day for Andy's slot on my car. He spent a whole 30 minutes tops mapping it and low and behold it developed a map related overboost issue 3 hours down the road. Took 3 months of chasing him to get another appointment to fix it, while I had to drive the car, my daily around carefully the whole time. Thankfully he finally met me privately on a Saturday and spent the time to do it right. Was brilliant after that and was so happy with the car I let him map it a 3rd time after another upgrade. Was a different bloke when he had time and we talked and got on very well.

Tidgy

Problem is when the practises they use are known to be poor at best and there are countless reported problems where do you draw the line?

hamzi95

The issue here is the mappers are not doing health checks before mapping the cars, some will be happy to map a car with faulty mechanics and sensors, very few will refuse to map the car and tell them to get it fixed first.

This is the problem.

Tuning isn't magic, everyone has made it into some black art taboo, all mappers should achieve the same result in a gear 3 pull provided those mappers stick to a threshold of power:safety.

I'd never let my car go to a mapper who does a dyno only tune and lets it go.

I only know of 1 mapper who does a dyno tune + road rune and he also doesn't go around being worshiped like a subaru god.

Most mappers will do a high power tune, do a roughish map down low, because they are happy to let the closed loop fueling bring the afr's to the optimum level.

now what happens if the closed loop cant bring the AFr's to a stoich level ? smells like fuel and ****.

Mapping is way 2 expensive for what it is frankly, and that is the truth.

mappers are sending cars out in 2 hours and charging £300+

and you know why they can?

because your engine is worth, in some cases, more than 10 times that amount

Its a hamster wheel, so find someone honest, he may not be the best mapper, but his ego may be able to accept not being the best so he will take his time and give a ****.

Tidgy

Any mapper doing this is just **** full stop and i know several who do yet people rave about them.

Tidgy

You can;t know many then, i dont know any decent mappers who wont road test after a dyno map.

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

When Duncan mapped my first car he road tuned it, spent another hour on the dyno fine tuning then went out on the road for further tuning and checks. Took half a day, car was brilliant and faultless.

Unfortunately now I believe he does most of his mapping at Surrey Rolling Road from what I hear he never road tests the cars once off the dyno. This is second hand info, not personal experience so I'm happy to be proved wrong.

Also, I fully agree with the comments about basic health checks prior to mapping. It should be done every time, but I know isn't being done. I know Simon used to do this and turn people away without charge if there was an issue.

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

Well said hamzi
It's not the black mysical art that some tuners make it out to be!
£300+ for What is some times less than an hour spent on tuning is a p155 take!
I'm thick as **** but manage to tune my car with no problems,even on Bigger injectors.

Problem is most are too busy and far too greedy.
Ffs there is more of an art and at least proper qualifications for decent engine builders and they don't charge upwards of £300 and hour.

hamzi95

I dont need to, because i can map myself

Ash Webster

I hear your point bro but why dont you start doing it then? £300 an hour sounds like a decent wage to me unless youre on a 6 figure salary already?

I'm just trusting someone who knows a lot more about mapping and Subaru in general than me. I'm happy to pay them for this service. He didnt have to tell me 740s were (IN HIS OPINION) too big for my ECU, he gained nothing monetarily from it. What should i have done? just say nah mate i know better just map it anyway? again bro i appreciate what youre saying and kudos to getting them to work on yours.

Tidgy

He used to go to use clinics dyno, he never road tested them while he was there and that was a long time ago. It's why i say i wouldn't trust him to map my lawn mower, people make mistakes, but there's a big difference between a genuine mistakes and a bad working practise.