Ok, after the great undertaking debate, what about the following!?

Im sure we have all seen, and maybe some have done the following..

Long queue of traffic in left lane at 2 lane roundabout wanting to go left and straight over. So someone drives along right lane indicating right, goes all the way round roundabout, and turns the equivalent of left (i.e. queue jumps by going 450 degress round roundabout.

Is it legal?

For my vote I rekon yes. I cant think what law you would actually be breaking!

robski

I seem to recall that if you go round a roundabout more than twice, this is an offence, could be talking out of my a... what you've listed above is just cheeky http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif

Definitely naughty in the eyes of the law.

I'm sad to say I have never even thought of doing the above, however, there will be a time when it is appropriate http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif I can't see anything wrong with it, but you never know.

Robski

LOL http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif

I am deeply disappointed.........that I have never thought of this!!! http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

Guys,

I dont encourage use of this, as it has a habit of annoying other road users

so I am told http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

robski

I have been doing this for years and cannot see why anyone would object to it on a legal ground.

If people get narked then tough, there is nothing stopping them from doing it either and at least it shows knowledge of lane discipline.

I done it a few times. Nothing wrong with it, only showing a bit of initiative. I call is Neil Manuvere #2.

Neil Manuvere #1 is when you are waiting ages for some traffic to clear and you want to speed it up. If you are near a pedestrian crossing facing the direction of the busy road, all you do is get you passenger or you to quickly hop out, press the button on the pedestrian crossing jump back in and wait.

Bingo Lights will change and you'll be able to get out MUCH faster. This is ideal in London and other clogged up towns.

Neil Manuever #3 Is mischivous but not illegal. You are coming up to a set of traffic lights with one set of lights indicating a turn right into something like a supermarket.

Most traffic lights will have a sensor that detects a car turning right and triggers the traffic lights to red for cars comming the other way. All you need to do is put a wheel over the sensors and you'll trigger the traffic lights and stop the cars coming the other way.

All this is of course hypothectical and i've only performed such manuvers when talking with mates.

Probably legal. But damn annoying when you're turning right and the 5 cars in front all try this maneuver. Usually results in a blocked roundabout and a lot of irate people.

Happens most mornings down here in sunny Fleet.

Raj

We do this in Croydon all the time when visiting Warner Brothers Cinema as its the same exit that queues right back up to the Purley Way for all the mad Ikea fans!

Nothing wrong with it if you say you changed your mind on the way round the roundabout, vaguely like driving round one until you find the right exit when you are geuninely lost, ahem, officer http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

This is very annoying, if everyone did this the traffic congestion would be worse, lane discipline in Aberdeen is bad enough with people turning right from left lane regularly. 1 1/4 times round a roundabout is showing your impatience and inconsideration for other road users, I consider this to be on a par with driving up the outside of traffic queueing for road works and trying to push in!!

Sorry for the minor rant but this does annoy me.

Good job for you then you Northern monkey that i dont drive in Aberdeen eh http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/tongue.gif

If the exit from the island is clear, then surely this manouvre is helping traffic flow? well thats what I tell myself when I do it http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

DazW

No sunilp, it sounds like you would fit in well with the rest of the Numpties here.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Murray53:
<B>I consider this to be on a par with driving up the outside of traffic queueing for road works and trying to push in!!
[/quote]

Actually, when queueing for roadworks you're supposed to use both (or all on a three-lane road) lanes, and then merge in turn where the cones start. It's people who think they have to queue in one lane as soon as they see the 'man with spade' signs that make the queue two or three times longer than it needs to be. In Germany, I believe it's illegal to not use both lanes, and also illegal to not merge in turn. I think the reason that people queue in the one lane is because there are bloody-minded people who won't merge in turn.

As far as I am concerned, if I whistle up the outside of a queue for roadworks in the clear lane, I am entitled to merge in turn as I am at the head of my 1-car queue.

I do it, but it's illegal to go full-circle on a roundabout according to the highway code as i remember... http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

Owain McRae.

As the traffic invariably travels faster after you are into the roadworks, after 'merging' it seems obvious that if the traffic merges before reaching the obstruction/roadworks the faster it will flow. However people trying to merge at the last minute cause the traffic at the front of the queue to stop to let them in causing further delays. It is those people who wait until the last minute I was refering to - and I do not let them in.

I disagree. It either merges a mile before the roadworks or at the roadworks. It makes no difference to the flow where it happens. The ideal would be both lanes fully used right up to the roadworks, then merge in turn. Theoretically if the speed limit was 35mph and everyone left the correct gaps, two lanes travelling at 70mph could merge into one at 35mph without any interruption to flow.

Extending your theory, traffic would move faster if everyone only used the left lane from the moment they got onto the motorway http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

Hmm, interesting. When traffic is supposed to 'keep left' it generally hogs all the lanes, and when you get to roadworks with signs that say 'use both lanes' people all use the left lane. Perhaps it would be better to put the signs the other way around http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

[This message has been edited by carl (edited 19 December 2000).]

Absolutely right, happens every morning on the 62 as the lanes are designed to "merge" at the intersection with the M6. Unfortunately it's not just me in the third lane.

There is an occassional middle lane moron who won't let anyone in, occassionally a prat(coincidentally happened this morning)pulls out and blocks the lane. But in the main it works, however its often quicker to use the left lane then switch after the junction http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif

Nice to know what the legal position is. If someone holds up traffic in the third lane by pacing with the middle does it constitute obstruction?

Carl

I do not think you got my drift.

I agree that two lanes travelling at 70mph can easily merge at 35mph if drivers left the gap to allow this. However if the driver waits until the last minute and this causes another to slow down or even stop, the result is what we have at almost all road works.

....anyone not had that terrifying moment when the road signs say "USE HARD SHOULDER" but the HGV on your inside sticks in the inside lane, and on your right there's nothing but concrete barriers? http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/eek.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/eek.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/eek.gif

...best reasoning behind fitting loud air horns i've seen in a long time!!!

Owain McRae.

Yes, but what to do about it? I always try to let these people in without braking to keep the flow going.

Heh heh

I remember doing this going into Hatfield poly all those moons ago. Went to a 10 year reunion and they've changed the layout now because everyone must have started doing it.

Owning a mini then meant I could also invent a few parking places in the none too large car park there....Christ those were the days.. http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

Justin

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by banshi:
<B>Nice to know what the legal position is. If someone holds up traffic in the third lane by pacing with the middle does it constitute obstruction? [/quote]

I admit to doing this (especially a few years ago when i drove a Frontera). The problem with going from 3 to 2 lanes (or 2 to 1) is that many drivers in the outside lane will try to merge left (far back from the actual constriction) which slows lane 2/1 down plus opens a gap into lane 3/2. Mr BMW 318is (with aircon) will then instantly zoom ahead to take advantage of the gap in the outside lane (and thus p*ss off everyone else).

As far as i am concerned, once the traffic queue has stabilised, then lanes 1, 2 (and 3 or 4) should all move at the same speed. I suppose that it could be construed as "obstruction" (just like many sped humps), but it is also being fair.

It is interesting that in _most_ cases, if there is an HGV on the inside lane, as the cones are reached, they will usually wave you into the lefthand lane. Maybe they appreciate your way of thinking!

mb

So what about when the motorway queues up and you use the services or the exit/entry to jump half a mile of traffic jam?

The problem with merging at the last minute is that it creates a stop start right at the point where its one lane. So the traffic crawls through the start of the obstruction, accelerating as it goes.

Everyone should be in less lanes well before the actual reduction is started, that way they should easily proceed through at the correct speed.

I too block the outside lane once Im starting to approach the obstruction.

robski

I do this all the time http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif I've never even considered that it may be illegal, how can it be http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/confused.gif You only go round the round about once....I know it may piss a lot of people off but I bet most of it's because they didn't think of it http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/tongue.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/tongue.gif

Police followed me round a roundabout for about 5 mins - It was patently obvious they were following me. When they pulled me over, cos I got bored of goign round the roundabout they didn't mention the fact that they were a bunch of muppets and said I should wash my car more often cos the rear number plate was partly obscured - I had to disagree, cos I reckoned a blind man 200 metres away could read it!

People always go on the outside and round to jump the queue - I do it if in a rush - but it doesnt half piss people off - cant see it being illegal though - cant see what possible law you could be breaking!

Steve, you managed to negotiate a roundabout for such a long period of time, i thought your speciality was going fast in a straight line and t-boning london buses?

Sunil http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

Elland bypass into Halifax always had this problem. They put up "Merge in Turn" signs, and hey presto, everyone does! No more narky fights.

It's that simple. Driver education!

Next time somebody accidently walks in front of you at work or someplace, try making w@nker motions with your hand and saying "why don't you effin look where you're going knobhead".

Think about that next time your driving and imagine what small minded plonkers we can all be at times.

Or in Sunil's case small plonkered minds. http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif