Chip and pin
 

Ok, watching the news this morning about chip and pin (and how it's the saviour of fraud LOL :D) and the wonderful presenters were harping on about how you'll never have to sign again in the shop when they have eventually all moved over to a chip and pin system. At this point, the missus pipes up 'Not if you pay by cheque!'. Stone me, I'd completely forgotten about cheques and how irritatingly long they can take to sort out in a shop, so I think I'm going to have to dust off my old cheque book and annoy everyone by exercising my civil liberties and freedom to sign for things ;)

what a load of rubbish. good idea but the takeup has been far too slow. Northampton was the UK trial area for Chip n pin about 4 years ago but there are still plenty of retailers without chip n pin terminals!

Also loads of people now just give their cards to partners/friends to use and let them know the pin...and most retailers/bars etc will happily let this happen.

Oh, and a few places won't accept cheques now! Many Shell petrol stations don't.

Actually - cheques are far safer than chip and pin. You can't exactly clone a cheque book, or watch someone type in their 4 digit code and mug them in the car park.


If someone steals your cheque book you can cancel before the cash leaves your account, unlike switch/visa/mastercard.


Only problem with cheques is, you can't budget when the cash will be removed from your account - it could be 4 days, it could be six months.

my brother said when he was in australia , about 12 years ago , they had chip and pin then ! nothing like being in the uk to watch progress in action :)

And don't forget when you don't even get your new chip n pin card because some eastern european immigrant working at the post office has stolen it and the pin letter too and spent £11k before you even realise it hasn't arrived!

Chip and Pin is the banks way of saving huge amounts amount of money by not paying out on fraud claims . You can easily prove it wasn`t the correct signature that fraudulently obtained the money or goods and then the bank pays out to the victim of the fraud who had the account raided. However you can`t prove who pressed in the correct Pin number so the victim pays and the bank wins. Chip and Pin may be slightly more secure but the main problem is cloning and online fraud so we will see what happens in the long run. I suppose if you are stupid enough to give out your Pin you deserve to lose cash , but its the OAP`s that are going to suffer I`ve seen loads of them with the Chip and Pin cards in a wallet and then the number on a piece of paper or even written on the card in felt tip so they remember it !. As ever bank wins everybody else loses !.

Standing in a shop yesterday while this was being discussed - nice lady in front of me announces to the till girl that she has changed all her pin numbers to 1234 so that she can remember them. Wonder if she got home without getting mugged.

p.s. - Does anyone else feel like a 12yo doing schoolwork when putting in the pin. left arm wrapped round the terminal/schoolbook so no-one can cog your answers :D

So from midnight if a shop tries to get you to pay and sign on the dotted line in the old fashion can you refuse and demand to use the chip and pin machine?

My shell garage and the illegals who work in it struggle to understand English let alone work that technology. They hardly ever use it.

Gary

What the hell are they!?!

We must be going to the same garage!!

Haha, exactly the same as my local Shell garage too :lol1: They've got chip n pin terminals there and have had for a year or two...i've probably been asked to use them about Twice.

I dont need to pay their prices anymore ..........since the scoob left me I can use any old crap petrol :norty:

Works without any major problems for 26 years now over here. Cheques gradually will:

a) become more expensive
b) not be accepted anymore
c) disappear

Although, this being the UK and all that... hmmm...

That's because you know that anyone using a cheque is either deliberately committing fraud or else they have no money in their account.

Never understood this one, i live in one of the most expensive areas in the country, the local Tesco garage, which doesn't sell Optimax or equivalent, is host to a steady stream on Bentleys, Porsches and Ferraris and yet some people are so anal about using high-octane petrol in a <£20,000 car.

You can still have a chip and sign card if you ask your bank, it just isn't widely known or advertised.

A few issues with it though...

1) The Yanks don't use it at all. They're looking at biometrics.
2) It doesn't make any difference in terms of card security in offline environments.
3) The Chips can be hacked, and when they are, they provide far more sensitive information that a criminal could ever have obtained from the old magnetic stripe.
4) What will happen when people purchase things in advance, e.g. fuel, and then find they can only pay with their PIN. Regardless of "being prepared", it will happen.

What i have noticed, is that if you use c&p abroad, their terminals are well shielded from prying eyes!!

unlike 2/3rds of the uk ones which are in free space..

and do we have a uniform method of operation do we f**k

on some its chip up, on others chip down, press enter to start, confirm card etc..

ffs, why couldnt they just state some basics, and get everyone to agree to it, if they didnt agree, then you can have access to the system ffs.

oh and despite the triumphant heralding, sig,s will always be accepted, due to some people being mentally impaired or having sight probs

mart

More things to remember..... PIN numbers, credit card login details, website login details, bank login details etc etc...

How do blind people verify the amount? Sounds flippant but in Australia and NZ they don't have the option for signatures, it's PIN only and they have nowhere near the fraud levels as in the UK.

Actually it's at the discretion of the retailer whether they accept signatures or use the PIN. If they are equipped to use the PIN but accept a signature then the responsibility fails on the retailer and they wear any costs if the transaction is fraudulent.

"due to some people being mentally impaired "


what...like those on here that struggle to remember a few numbers or use a pin machine?

and dont forget your ID card, social service number, and chip embedded under the skin,

you will be controlled, just wait until you get an id number at birth!!

bladerunner here we come

Mart

We went to Amsterdam last August for a long weekend. Fully expected there of all places to be c&P. Most suprised to find that we had to ...YES HAD TO sign for everything.
Yve

Lets not forget the physically impaired who cannot manage punching a pin number in but can just manage a signature of sorts.

I doubt Frank Williams could manage the pin method, not exactly mentally impaired though is he?

Have to admit this bugs me.
Like it in france where they have a little flap that comes down over them- works fine.
But over here they just leave it exposed, so the pikey can see the number over the shoulder of dimwits and mug you outside.
Great idea :rolleyes:

As usual- no problem with the concept, as has been proven to work well. But once again, the british implementation leaves a lot to be desired!

What's not to understand? These sub 20k Jap cars were designed to run on high octane fuel in Japan (100 ron?). Therefore people over here with imported STIs and the like have to fill up with the highest octane they can find. Don't do this and say hello to a several grand engine rebuild.

When debit cards were introduced they had a built in delay of three days (IIRC) so that the money left your account in the same time as if paid by cheque. This was to encourage the use of the new-fangled technology. Somewhere in the intervening years this feature has quietly been removed.

You can be sure that more onerous requirements will eventually be imposed with C&P cards, e.g. to use the card you permit us to make your details available to companies in whose products you might have a passing interest:rolleyes:

Time for a return to cash methinks.

Took my gran to the supermarket last week.
At the check out, all gone thru, my gran hands over her card, the cashier says to her...
"do you know your pin?"
my gran..."yes dear, it's 3...."
me.."STOOOOOOOP!!!"

Bless her!

Christ on a bike Mart ... you been on the happy pills again? :lol1:

no its exposure to SN unrestricted.. has a strange effect on people :D:D