YO!,
I can't agree when someone says the standard brakes are adequate, though.

If you think that they are up to the job, I can't see you driving the car to anywhere near its potential. Which is no bad thing, don't get me wrong.
Cem
http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

Its funny you say that http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

I've been told exactly the same this by a friend; don't need to change anyfink.

However hes also a professional driver, my thinking is that us mortals need a few more upgrades so that we can keep up!

Anyroad, im off to the track to meet said racing guy to follow him round a few corners - dont tell him though!

First mod in any car http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

Change the nut behind the wheel..

Richard

Andrei, I sometimes ask myself that same question. I then get stubborn and say "no way" http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

Best I can do is relate to another toy: guitars (axes for those in the know http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

My first guitar(s) were in the sh*tty range of the scale. I used to dream about a real Strat... The fact that I didn't sound all that hot was of course due to the guitar, not me.

Now I now you can be damned sure that the real good players can get a decent tone out of any piece of crap (say $80). But I didn't know back then.

Today (25 years later) I have moved up in the "price range" and have a few good axes. Do they sound better ? Yes. Do they make *me* sound better ? Yes again. Would they have benefitted me back when I started playing? Mmmhh, maybe they would, maybe not. Maybe I can only appreciate the fine instruments now because I know how the real bad ones sound/feel (the writer-with-a-lousy-youth syndrome ?).

Baseline is: I'm an average player, so I need all the help I can get from the instrument.

Back to the car then: the Impreza is the first car where I started "modding". It is probably the car that needed it the least.

In my own way, I'm a bit max power. I don't admit it, and I feel a lot better than the plastic-kit-slam-to-the-ground crowd, but in lucid moments I realize I'm the same. I didn't need the 17" wheels, or the STiV spoiler, or ... (fill in all other mods) If I would have spend all that money on driving courses, I would be a lot faster today in a standard car than in my heavily modded thing.

Would I do it again ? You bet, because it is fun. I'm a kid. OK, I know, my car may actually handle worse than before (think about that), but I'm having fun.

It's a shame Sport Auto is not available in English, because it is such a good benchmark to see how good cars actually are. The standard Impreza with the tyres we all love to hate, the body roll, the restricted exhaust, crappy brakes etc... manages to go round the Ring in a fantastic time, only 10 seconds slower than the new M5, 12 seconds slower than the new Audi RS4... in the hands of a capable driver.

In my hands, it got zapped by Nova's, Kadetts, a Jetta, a Golf diesel ... all that glorious power and I felt I was driving backwards.

So to finish (sigh of relief in background): I'm with Rich on this one: we can do a lot to upgrade the nut behind the wheel.

I'm personally starting with a MIRA course next month, and I'll see how it goes on from there.

Was this clear as mud or what http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif

EvilBevil

Great Analogy!

I too have been known to weild the odd axe from time to time (we must talk http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif)

And it works so well...

If you spend £500 on a guitar. You are buying a pretty descent instrument. If you spend £1500 on a guitar you are probably buying a world class instrument.

But the difference between the £500 guitar and the £1500 guitar is actually very very small. The difference between a £150 guitar and the £500 is astronomical.

An average guitarist could feel the difference between the £150 guitar and the £500 easily. But it takes a seriously good guitarist to truly exploit the differences between the £500 and the £1500 one.

The reason for this, is that, you can only use the benefit of something that is betterm if you are limited by the thing you are currently using.

The "seat-to-steering-wheel" interface, is unquestionably the most important and dynamic component in a car.

Cheers

Simon

PS. I wonder if Joe Satriani can drive? http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif

Joe can't drive, but he can surf and fly!

Rich http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

.....*up in the sky !* http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

DJ

Subarussian

Yeah I know where you are coming from....but how could any of us drive a Soob without a rorty exhaust, or upgraded wheels/tyres, or uprated brakes etc ....oops here we go!!!!

I note you are a skier - me and the missus too - I could have a chat with you about the amount of ski gear/clothing we spend our money on probably unneccesarily!!

There is a comparison here too - I ski on Atomic Beta Race 10.26 GS race skis - they're without a doubt better than I am so I have to have tuition to get the best out of them.

(Probably means I need driving tuition too - something I mean to do next year, probably Don Palmer or similar). http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif

Are they?

I am not sure but it did feel like it last Saturday when I was taken in my standard UK Scooby (except the exhaust all other bits are standard, including tyres) around the track by a professional racing driver.

People talk a lot on this BBS how the standard Scoob is inadequate and you need to upgrade tyres, breaks, suspension, geometry, ECU, etc, etc, pretty much everything... Well I can testify that in the hands of a capable driver even a standard UK car kicked ass! EVOs, Porches, Ferraris - I saw them all falling behind (and one Ferrari continued on to the grass at 90 mph when it tried to follow our line around the corner).

So, what is my point? I don't know, it's too late and I can't think of one. Just thought I'd open up a debate.

Cheers,

Andrei


[This message has been edited by Subarussian (edited 07 October 2000).]

Interesting analogies. Skis - definitely. Tennis rackets/strings is another relevant one.

Blow Dog - the standard brakes were really amazing. They were smoking after five 4-mile laps, true, but they did not let us down.

Because Subaru can't get it right and many people are forced to resort to third parties to make the car perform as originally intended ?

Hey you guitarists then, how about a Marshall JMP-1 valve MIDI pre-amp, studio use only, £200.

Chris

That is really tempting!

Would you email me with a the price you REALLY want! http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

Cheers

Simon

Its kinda like here in the States where you see cyclists with a huge spare tire hanging over their seat agonizing over spending $1000 on a set of Mavic ceramic rims to save weight

...or another analogy you never see a world class chess player playing with one of those "Carved out of Rare Marble" Franklin Mint chess sets....always mismatched pieces on a dumpy board...

Mike

I was told by a friend of mine, who runs his own performance driving school, that the best way to make my car go faster is :

1) Put a better set of brakes on it.
and
2) Learn to drive it!