It will be worth the wait that is all I am prepared to say.
Just trust me ;)

You will be very happy.



[Edited by ARRON BIRD - 10/07/2003 22:39:44]

Surely a car such as the STi should not need a "handling kit" !! They should do it right in the first place. Don't go on about they dial in the saftey of understeer. You try and tell a bloke at Lotus that's what you should be doing :rolleyes:

i agree with u here these Performance packs n all are a pile of bollox for paying that price for a car when they know it could be better is a sham. they should come as standard with all these bits.

its a bit like computers u buy one

Doesn't the new S2 Elise come with skinnier front tyres to create more understeer to cater to the lower common denominator? And isn't there an upgrade pack you can buy aftermarket which is basically new front wheels which are wider? Is this basically not the same thing? The Ferrari 360 is exactly the same. The "Sport" handling pack gives you new wider front wheels and tyres for the same reasons.....

Besides, the car sold as new has to conform to EU Typre Approval. Because of this, Subaru are limited to the size of the wheels they can fit and the gap between the wheels and the arches as you have to be able to fit snow chains to get EU TA. It's the same reason you can't buy a PPP on a new STi, you have to have it registered first as the PPP wouldn't pass EU TA Noise regs.

You could also argue that the £2000 you save on the STi 03 over the STi 02 pays for most of these upgrade goodies anyway....

Matt :)

[Edited by mutant_matt - 11/07/2003 08:57:48]

I am told it should it should be august :)

How do you know anyway?

I thought the new Elise was designed to be less tail happy.......but not understeer. I could well be wrong though!

Agree with the above, this should come as standard. It's a complete con

Then why is the USDM STi 300BHP and has the DCCD in standard trim for £19000 on the road Matt? I wouldnt say anyone is "saving" £2000, i would say everyone is paying £8000 too much. Sadly its all the car manufacturers that do this to the UK, so we have very little choice in the matter.

John you miss the point mate.
If you totally rely on the centre diff and nothing else you would certainly get less understeer and more sideways fun.
Your car has the diff but you also have some suspension and geometry modifications to get it to do what you want it to.
The standard STI 7 and 8 is perfectly good enough for 90% of end users. Its the extra 10% that want and can use the extra.
I`m not blowing my own trumpet but feel I can tell what I want a car to do and can criticise it quite quickly...any car really.
If my car had the centre diff now with the way the handling is I reckon I could get in the top ten in most Clubman tarmac rallies.....it is that good.
Bye bye understeer and thats with baldish(sorry John ;) ) front tyres.
All I can say is be patient and get your cheque book out but only if you think you can really justify the cost and drive to tell the difference.
Lets not forget Prodrive like all other "Tuning firms" are out to improve things and make money. Its a buisness.
Bit like Shnitzer for Bmw.
Why buy an M3 and put Schnitzer springs on it???
My mate has!!!!
See you all at Bdford Autodrome this winter when its more fun for a full test!! :)

I am not missing any point Arron, you know that too! :p

My car has uprated suspension on it for one reason only, i used to boil the fluid in the dampers at 9 miles round the Nurburgring, the Stock STi struts couldnt hack it. Apart from that i loved the stock STi5 TypeRA suspension, it was perfect for daily use and trackday use.

No one is relying on the centre diff, i can drive a car with a normal VC diff very quickly too, but having the DCCD makes the car better than not having it and makes it more enjoyable.

If you want to prove how good your car now is and how good the PPP kit is, enter it in the Ten of the Best competition on August 3rd, I have one place left for our teams entry and challenge you, with your Prodrive upgrades to come and beat my stock engined car on the 1/4 mile, 1.2 mile high speed run and handling circuit, all officially timed independantly.

You are a handy driver, so i will have no advantage over you there, this will be pretty much a test of the car and what it can really do. The results will be published for everyone to see.

You up for it? or are you too scared? :D

I`m up for it you to55er!!!!
When is it???
Are you paying for my fryed clutch????
I`m more intersted in handling than drag racing but its pretty handy in a straight line aswell ;)
Give Mike a call he may even take the Official thrash bucket along to save my ware and tare. I know he cant drive aswell as me but he can pedal a motor along ok :rolleyes:
PS I dont need laps on the Ring to boil my stryts I can do that on the way to work!!!!!!
You pooooooooooooooooofter!!!

[Edited by ARRON BIRD - 11/07/2003 12:51:07]

can you not read, August 3rd! :p

I will leave it up to you to call Mike, i dont mind which one of you does this, but could you please let me know asap that either you or Mike is doing this so i can get you the details for entry etc.

That is unless you are indeed chicken when it comes to taking a challenge, so far that has been the case. :D:p

John, are you not even remotly scared of the bug eye on the handling test?

I am not scared of anything Sammy, especially being beaten by a better car/driver if that did happen.

If Mike or Arron want to prove how good this car is, they have the invitation, i have nothing to prove, i won lasts years handling circuit competition in the Subaru entry and was 4th fastest overall with a stock engine and suspension against the top 73 road legal modified cars in the country.

Ohhhh John stop it now your making me all damp and urgent!!!!!;)
Pooooooofter!!

LOL stop squalking Arron. :D

PSML

John I forgot the :p and my money is on Arron on the handling test, the others will not be as close imho.

What you have to remeber about america is that they have lowers taxs to start with, thus reducing the cost of the car.
Secondly, you never pay retail price in the US. I was living out there and the rrp for an S2000 was about $28k but the dealers were charging about $36k. According to my sources in the US the STI is going for about $40k out there.

John's car, out of the box, has revisions to the front setup that came from the S202 on it.

I *believe* the UK car did not get these to the same extent. It ain't just the DCCD that is different...

your source is wrong!

I have friends over in the USA that own the USDM STi and they paid MRRP for the car. Some dealers are trying to hike up the price by putting a $4K premium on it, most people are ignoring these dealers and going elsewhere.

I can put you in touch with a car salesman i know personally at a dealers in Seattle who can give you a USDM STi for normal retail price today (or rather i could earlier in the week as he had 2 cars in stock he was selling for the standard on the road price.)

Mattel?

John dont kid yaself mate.
Your car is far from the way it left the factory!!!
You have done your fair share of "fettling!!"
Or should I say Felsteading;)

My car has a lot on it as standard you dont get on a UK Turbo of teh same year, such as the rear plated R180 large LSD, the DCCD adjustable centre diff, a front mechanical LSD, bigger rear vented brakes, 2 pot rear calipers, 2.25 turn quicksteering rack, bigger driveshafts, bigger hubs, bigger wheel bearings, 7900rpm red line 300PS engine, Automatic Intercooler water sprays, Climate control Air con, Electric folding mirrors, SWRT limited edition seats, Roof air vent, Lightweight glass, Alloy bottom wishbones, Soild front droplinks, Carbon Fibre/alluminium strut brace, inverted strut suspension, centre diff release handbrake, aluminium bonnet, more eficient rear wing, stiffer suspension bushes etc etc You get the picture. :D

What model is that John? I don't think I've ever seen you mention what car you drive?? :confused:

The mods to my car are

AP Racing 330mm 4 pot brakes
Leda B Suspension (not on the car last year when i was fastest Subaru)
White line 22mm Anti Roll Bars (not on the car last year when i was fastest Subaru)
White line rear drop links (not on the car last year when i was fastest Subaru)
Braided hoses
White line ALK
Spec C fuel pump (adds no power, just surge safe)
17" or 18" wheels/tyres
Rear cusco strut brace (which was my prize at TOTB last year for fastest Subaru so wasnt on the car)
Scoobymania back box (adds no power, just sounds nice :D)
SECS engine monitor (not on the car last year when i was fastest Subaru)
Bump Steer mod and geometries setup for road use

Engine was and still is stock power and still has the cats in the exhaust and a standard air filter and filter housing.

LOL @ STi wanna Subaru

I forgot to mention, last year i had a missfire so was down on power, that is why my top speed run was aborted, so i should have been even faster. ;):D LOL

...and that's just off the top of your head, eh?

;)

John I mean bits over standard STI Type R you muppet!!!

John do they have enough Skylines mate as Steve has expressed an interest