hi all
any one know were ill get a 05 that has been made to fit my uk99 they need addapting to fit some one must do this
was given a number but lost it or a hybird to do the same
fast spool with plenty go
HELP
thanks
Trev

You should get an email from Mark at lateral performance in a few milliseconds :rolleyes: :D

thanks m8

LOL @ Andy :D

trev, send Andy F an e-mail about the turbo, i am sure he can help you out ;)

UK99

If you are getting the car EcuTek mapped (you won't believe how good a 99 is with this turbo and a good map!!), then you will also need an uprated fuel pump and fuel pressure regulator, which Mark can supply at the same time.

Two of the three that we have mapped in this spec, in the last two weeks, have burst the pipe from the turbo to intercooler :eek:, so a set of Samco turbo hoses is also needed.

Pete,

Can you post/email a brief of what you could expect torque/bhp wise with the addition of the TD05, pump and regulator.

I'm running a catless exhaust system (ScoobySport DP/Catted Centre/ Magnex BB) and a Ecutek ECUat the mo and wondered where to go next.

To say the least I don't understand Turbo's and the advantages / disadvantages

:)

J (email sent aswell)

The TD05 with front entry mod has made over 360 bhp and 350lb-ft on a number of cars now. Spool up and power at 3000 rpm is similar to the TD04.

Andy

Cheers Andy.... :)

Is there good reason that no change to the TMIC is required?

J

to get 350/350 I would change the TMIC.

David

J, YHM

for others that are interested, we contain things to approx 340bhp and 320lb with the top mount IC, for safety/reliability reasons.

320 BHP at our local rolling road is about as good as it gets with a TMIC whilst leaving a safety margin running on pump fuel. Trying to run more you end up retarding the ignition or throwing fuel in to contain the detonation and IMHO they just don't safely make more.

This may be equivalent to a different figure on other rolling roads. Some of our US friends would probably claim this at the wheels with quite conservative modifications ;)

For significantly over 310 BHP on the most conservative dynos I recommend a FMIC.

The figures I quoted were with a FMIC. With a top mount I'd agree with Pete & John. The FMIC makes a big difference at this level.

cheers

Andy

Pete,

As a matter of interest, what boost levels are these TD05'd MY99/00s running to achieve this sort of power?

Andrew...

Mid range peaks at 1.35 to 1.40, depending on how the car feels when mapping. Obviously it tails off to match available injector duty up the range, but its still holding around a bar at the redline.

what kind of price and what year car does the turbo need to come from how much is a new 1 to do or am i defeating the object
i want 1 like please mail me some speck m8 like age of doner and stuff thanks
Trev

Has anyone tried running the stock top mount with a catch tank?

I wonder whether it improves things enough to run more boost at the top end safely - there's margin there, 1.15 bar on mine with 440's and APS tmic (not the best cooler in the world, but reduces pressure drop well) = 97.8% IDC. I guess that gearboxes quickly become an issue at this level though, certainly did for me.

Richard

In order to go higher than the 350 figures quoted with a front mount, what turbo do you start looking at after the TD05 ?

or is this one of the best available with a direct entry to it ??

TD05/06-20g hybrid is good for 440+ bhp with similar spool/lag to a TD05

Andy

[Edited by Andy.F - 18/07/2003 16:08:33]

what price can you do this for andy 5/6 im tempted for when i had it rebuilt was going 5 but considering 5/6 ya no !
have orderd some headers to compliment it so may have a turbo to jonny is also going up this path i beleave !!
cheers trev

I would definitely go for one of andyf's 20g's. having recently fitted a front entry TD05 with gruppe-s headers , I have increased lag to a similar degree as a TD06 anyway without the reward of the 06 power.this is especially noticed in second gear.

I do not know which headers you have got but I am sure my increase in lag is down to the gruppe-s up-pipe , as the same set-up on another scoob but with standard headers was much stronger low down.

the headers will allow you to run lower boost and still make good peak power but I am not convinced the lag is worthwhile in the <350bhp level.

[Edited by T-uk - 7/30/2003 8:50:20 PM]

T-uk's car with TD05, headers and FMIC gets 1 bar at 3000 RPM in 5th gear. There is no significant lag when stamping on the throttle over 4000 RPM, the yee-ha point when flooring it from low revs in 2nd gear is at 3800 RPM, 3600 RPM in 3rd, 4th is about 3400 RPM but less of a yee-ha gear ;)

Without the headers it would all be about 200 RPM lower I reckon.

Although there is a kick at 3800 RPM there is still good torque at 3000 RPM.

In 3rd gear beyond 3200 RPM it equals a decat MY00 car.

Here are some 3rd gear plot of wheel horsepower and torque, yellow plots are AE802/decat, blue plot has TD05, headers, FMIC, FPR at 4 bar, 3 port solenoid, 1.3 bar midrange, 1.25 at 6000, 2ml/litre NF. Take off 10 horsepower for Optimax map, but the bottom end is the same. Blue plot was on a hotter day (by far) but had a Blitz vs STi backbox, so these should cancel each other out. These first two were on the same car. The red plot is with a TD05, FMIC, 550s, 3 port, 1.5 bar midrange, 1.4 bar at the top, but plain Optimax and no headers.

Don't worry about the absolute numbers, just compare the shapes of the graphs and where the torque is. If you want to work out estimated Star Performance rolling road results multiply the power by 1.23. It is rough and ready, but tells the story of the difference between TD04/5/headers I think. Nothing more ;)

In summary, I think the headers are good for running more torque and power with less boost, but they do not seem to unlock extra power for a given octane of fuel. The difference in lag is present but small. Crossover points for all three cars are interestingly all at 3000 RPM. They were all done on the same bit of road, possibly different directions, but there is less than 1% error on this road for this, weather conditions were different, I tried to control the weights in the same ways.

I suppose you could be caught out in 2nd gear with the TD05 if you are at 3000 RPM out of a tight corner.

http://www.johnbanks.dsl.pipex.com/3roaddynoplots.gif

[Edited by john banks - 7/30/2003 10:08:33 PM]

Andy-F

Just a quick plea for help. I want to buy a TD05 for my MY02 along with injectors, Fuel Pump, regulator and bigger TMIC so that John Banks can sprinkle some magic dust :) :) :) .

I have tried to follow the threads to work out who is actually who between yourself, Mark (lateral performance) and Gav to try and buy one.

It's like watching Columbo on daytime telly..help please :) :) :)

Midlife....

JB when are you convincing T-UK to turn the boost up to +1.5bar midrange just so see the difference with the headers @ the same boost level ;):D.. just for seeing the difference of course ;)

Jan

Mark supplies a range of different turbos which are built up by Turbo Dynamics. These include VF hybrids, TD hybrids, Garrett hybrids, and various combinations.

Andy works at present with TD05 based turbos. His two main services are conversion of TD05 to front entry with refurbishment, or conversion of TD05 to TD05/06 with refurbishment. You need one or the other option, because the 06 hybrid comes with a new front end so you don't need to convert the 05 to front entry.

Suggest you speak to both suppliers about what you want, and what budget you have. Consider how happy you are to break gearboxes/engines when setting your power levels.

Mr J we have and you make no more torque because you end up retarding the ignition. Same with leaning out the fuelling from 11.5:1. Believe me I tried :D Sweet spot hit at efficient low boost level.

At this level on this setup with this turbo I believe it is getting octane limited.

Water injection would help it along probably. T-uk would not let me grenade tune it with 5ml per litre of NF for TOTB (and I don't blame him with all the gearbox and engine problems that could ensue) and would not let fit my 05/06, if so he could have had another 50 WHP, but you end up running 12:1 and "too much" ;) boost.

If you look at results that people have achieved at this level, the best ones tend to be at lowish boost. Beyond about 1.3 bar with headers, I suspect the exhaust sides are getting upset. It is easy to think 350 BHP at 1.25 bar, does not mean you get 2.5/2.25*350 = 389 unless the turbo is considerably bigger and you improve something else, like say the heads to STi say.

With trivial extra torque, the car can feel a lot quicker, but you have killed the top end and lost 20WHP without realising. No substitute for at least some semi-objective method of measuring your results in some way to see if you are really gaining or just think you are. On both MD304s and TD05s I have tried to add 20 WHP say from 280 to 300 on Road Dyno, if using pump fuel I find it impossible to get over about 280 with either. They are both similarly sweet at that point, push them harder and they fall over.

[Edited by john banks - 7/30/2003 10:43:44 PM]

Midlife, IMHO forget the bigger TMIC and get water injection instead if you don't want to go the FMIC route.

John

Thanks for helping me sort out the names...it was getting like "Cleudo" with Mr Peacock in the dining room with the hammer etc :)

At *cough* 43 *cough* years of age I'm not into redlining the car at every opportunity but just ENJOY driving. I have (still in the garage) an MR2 which was fabulous to drive but lacked anything kiddy related...older dad :) I'm not after absolute speed but (as Isaac Newton knows) its the rate of change that counts hence the mods.....

I don't want a "grenade" but if the engine / gearbox lets go then I have to rebuild..:( :(

By Water injection do you mean an IC water spray ???

Midlife..

No as in http://www.aquamist.co.uk

Suggest go for the TD05 then at about 1.25 bar. You may end up eating a gearbox, you might be lucky. Engine should be fine with this, they seem pretty reliable at this level.

John

Thanks again... :) I guess I might have to look at the clutch / gearbox..:)

Midlife..

[Edited by midlife-crisis-scooby - 7/31/2003 12:03:05 AM]

I should perhaps add that I am happy with the set-up other than low down in second gear:D.

as john said over 4k the car goes well and I have no complaints. smaller round-a-bouts are where the second gear lack of pull during spool show up.john's car with standard headers did not have this issue in second over the same round-a-bouts.

I think I will probably try a different up-pipe after the weekend. I am trying to adjust my driving style to suit but it feels cr4p when you hit the loud pedal to pull you out the slide and nothing happens.