Guys,

I've seen lots of posts lately about people buying from abroad for £15k or so.

Has anyone on this BB bought a brand new UK spec car from a UK dealer? For the full RRP?

I am really concerned now if I made the right decision to buy in the UK (full price). Do you know any good reasons / advantages to do it? What are the disadvantages / issues with buying/owning/selling an IMPORT?

When I originally did my research the problems with Imports that I came across were:

- Personal loan only up to £15k
- Problems with insurance (very few companies insure / very expensive - £2-3k)
- Need to add stuff (ABS, etc) to satisfy the UK spec requirements
- Re-sale value lower than UK cars

The problem is that I've already agreed to give up my company car on the 4th March so I can't wait 6 months for an import... A-a-ah! Decisions, decisions.

As one Russian saying goes - "A bitter truth is better than a sweet lie", so give it to me! http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/frown.gif

Ta,

Subarussian

Several problems with importing from holland or anywhere else, that may be particular to your position, they nearly always want 50% deposit at time of order, then the remainder on delivery, you only get 1 year warranty, which is transferrable to Subaru UK. Plus of course a 6 month wait.

These may be a problem for you they may not.

BTW I am one of the fools that paid full UK list price for my UK car, but have no regrets at all.

[This message has been edited by Ian Cook (edited 17-02-2000).]

Subarussian,

I have a `94 WRX. Bought from an import specialist. Never had any problems with servicing or parts though have not needed many. There are many specialists out there who seem able to supply most bits! I don't have ABS but am happy without. Insurance through Norwich Union is £1150, age 28, 3yrs NCD, based in Nottingham and my driving licence is littered with points (14 to be precise). Extra power is a bonus but isn't noticeable if you can't drive the car (all Scoobies are outstanding performers)! Hope this helps.

Kevin
Nottingham

Anyone interested in importing from Holland should go to

Yeah, I boight mine from Robinsons in Rochdale. Part exed my Sport (which I bought there) arranged the finance to my liking. I cannot afford to be without a car, cannot part ex in Holland and don't have a sack of cash. I'm happy, you can always find someone who got a bargain you didn't, whether it's cars or whatever. I no longer care. I have an Impreza Turbo and I didn't part with fifteen grand.

Sub,

probably a bit late now I know AND I cannot comment on the state of your personal financial sitiuation - HOWEVER you can get unsecured personal loans of up to £25k at 8.8% apr at last count from Direct Line.

There are a number of others that go up to £20k with excellent interest rates. As far as I know Direct Line don't give a monkeys what kind of car it is!

R

Personal imports are a great deal

- insurance is the same as UK sourced car, if youre company wont quote you a reasonable figure, go somewhere else!. There are loads of insurance companies that dont discriminate against personal imports.

The only thing you need to add to a UK spec car bought from Europe is the car alarm, price range 300-600 quid. They dont make em without ABS.

Re-sale is only an issue if you sell the car within 3 years as the warranty is only valid 1 year. 2nd+3rd year warranty can be bought for a few hundred quid. If you sell to a dealer they wont know its an import unless you tell them. If you fill the paperwork in properly then there will be nothing on the registration document that says the car is an import.

If you need a car, then drive a banger for 5 months and keep reminding yourself that you are saving 5,000+ pounds!!! while you wait. You wont regret it.

ps. There's a F*** Orion going for 395 quid in the For Sale section.

Sorry Gazzer, I've got to disagree with a number of your points.

1. Depreciation
I lost 4 grand on my UK 99MY DBM in 10 months. When I advertised it on this BBS, people were not falling over themselves to buy it, "wowed" by the advantages of a UK delivered car. Are you suggesting that a 10 month old import is worth less than 11K? Of course it's not. I'd be surprised if you couldn't keep one for a year, and then get back what you paid for it, given the waiting list on the continent. The maximum firm offer I had from a dealer for my mint 10 month old impreza was 16750GBP (ie. a loss of 5000GBP after 10 months), and most dealers weren't even interested.

2. Hassle factor
I agree that buying UK is less hassle, but Dutch dealers I spoke to in 1998 were courteous, helpful and spoke English. With some Dutch dealers now selling more RHD than LHD cars, I would expect the process to be pretty slick. I had a large amount of hassle getting my UK 99MY from a UK dealer - was constantly fobbed off over delivery dates, and was car-less for 2 months after selling my previous car after being told "your new turbo will be here within 2 weeks".

3. Risk
Yes, you risk several thousand in deposit, against maybe 500quid in the UK, and most Dutch dealers don't seem to accept credit card deposits. But how many car dealers disappear overnight? In a lot of cases we are looking at businesses which have been established for decades. With the amount of business they are doing, they're probably safer than the struggling UK dealers.

4. Flights/Ferries
Oh dear, a day in a foreign country collecting the car! Look on it as a nice day out, with the opportunity for a gentle drive back on some fine roads - make a big dent in the running in mileage.

5. Dealer Nearby/Warranty
The position with IM is now clearcut, and you should have the same aftersales service wherever you bought your car from. Yes, the warranty is for one, not three years, but as has been pointed out, these can be cheaply extended.

6. Alarm
Okay, a few hundred quid. Look at this as an opportunity to get something other than the standard fit sigma - may be harder for thieves to crack, since they wouldn't be expecting it.

6. Wheelnuts/Mats etc.
Scratching the bottom of the barrel I think.

Sorry for the long post, but after my costly experience with a UK car, and the bull**** flying around and lies I was told when I originally considered importing one, I feel quite strongly about this. I regret not importing one myself now, and don't see why anyone else should make the same costly mistake. I really think that anybody who pays full list for a UK turbo nowadays is mad.

On the subject of Alfa Romeos.....a colleague at work was looking to sell his 3.0GTV - 12 months old, mint UK car which cost him 30K. The maximum a dealer would offer was 14K, private 15K....precisely because people were buying imports for 22K.

If an imported impreza turbo really loses 3K in the first year (making it 12K to buy second-hand), let me know who's selling it. We'll sell our micra runaround car, and replace it with something a bit more exciting!

Howzabout...

Dark Blue Metallic. MY99. T-Reg. 14,000 Miles. New tyres. 2 year warranty remaining. Tracker 24 Lifetime subscription. Air-con. Prodrive Handling Pack. Quickshift. Ram-Air Filter. Scoobysport rear box.
(Optional Passenger toilet-roll holder)

Anyone interested?? Email me!

Subarussian,

I've had my Scoob for nearly a year now, bought brand new March'99 from UK dealer. I've no regrets, three year warranty, high residuals, insurance not a killer etc etc.
The thing is, I'm so wishy washy I can see a good argument for both sides. I think at the end it's down to how much the money is to the individual. i.e. if you earn 100k a year and want one you are probably unlikely to bother importing.
Once you have purchased the UK initially, you are in the 'stream', and as long as the second hand values stay competitive you can change every two years or so with much less outlay than on a another model eg. Ford.
Have I convinced you http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif

blubs.

Subarussian

I bought new MY99 UK in July from UK dealer. Used a Personal Contract Plan (great with the high residuals of scoobies) to pay for it. Equivalent roughly to a £8000 loan, with £6500 (old car) deposit.

I for one want the peace of mind that (should) comes with a UK warranty, dealer backup etc. Makes my life that bit easier in the long run, though may cost a few pennies more in servicing.

Anyhow, whichever way you do it, Big Grin Factor http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

I bought from Holland (Gertjan van der Velde in Zuid Beijerland). Car turned up in just less than 5 months.

My options were:
finance through Subaru UK, 4k deposit, 300ish quid a month, 10ish grand to buy at the end of 3 years.

Go Dutch, get a loan from Egg (10.2% APR with option to take payment holidays, early repayment with no penalty) for 320 quid a month over 4 years, buy car outright from Holland and grin.

I would disclose that the car is a personal import when selling, otherwise all sorts of nasty stuff could happen. You are required to pass on the evidence of paying VAT when selling the car within 6 years, and the VRO do know that the car is an import. Still, you can't have a car that was 16k (inc aircon) and expect it to be worth over that after a year!

Either way, it's a grin. I would have gone the UK route for the dealer support, but my local dealer is more than happy to take my money for servicing and do any warranty work. Insurance is no problem as Mark_S states, and deposit is "only" 30%.

You'll enjoy the car, and not have the nagging doubt that if something goes wrong after a year it'll be expensive. http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif

I had a golden opportunity to buy a UK-spec car from Holland in April 1998 (my girlfriend is Dutch, and we visit her family regularly), at least a year before the import bandwagon started big time. Price at the time was 15K-ish (maybe less), and delivery was quoted at 4-6 weeks!!! In hindsight I was foolish not to do so, but at the time I had a deposit on a 99MY from a UK dealer, IM told me that they would not honour the Dutch warranty at all (lying b*******), and there were scare stories going round that only UK sourced cars would be serviced.

At the time residuals were high, and when my MY99 arrived, I could have sold it for over list. 10 months on when I came to sell though, I took a 4000GBP hit! So...

Blubs >>> I can assure you that residuals are no longer high, and if anything things have got worse since I sold mine. And 6K is still a lot of money, even if you do earn 100K a year.

BarryK >>> You may not have parted with 15K in one chunk, but buying UK is a lot more expensive in the long run.

Mark_S >>> It is (or was) possible to buy a turbo without ABS from Holland. It was called the Impreza 555 (I think) and was several thousand guilders less. I think it came without airbags too, and there may have been other differences.

So, to answer your original post, subarussion, if I had my time again, I would go the import route. Even if I was in your position, I'd order an import, and get something cheap'n'cheerful for 6 months. If you can't decide, take 6K in tenners from your bank account and pile it up on your kitchen table. I don't think you'll have to look at it for long to come to a decision.

Advantages of buying in UK are as follows:

* Depreciation is much lower than an import

* No hassle factor

* Lower risk

* No flights/ferries to collect it

* Dealer is nearby in case of problems

* You get 3 year warranty

* You get an alarm

* You get locking wheel nuts

* You get mats

* Road tax/registration is included

* Number plates are included

When you calculate the total cost of ownership over a period of time, then the UK car costs about the same as an import. So don't worry.

regards,

Gary.

I bought a Alfa Romeo 156 From Holland saving 6K, I had enough of it after 6 months and decided to go for a scoob instead, trying to sell the Alfa was a complete mare. The fact is that people in the UK are still now clued up on the European Market, so they think it is a dodgy import and don't touch it. In the end I sold it to my dad. And no I was'nt advertising for the UK price.

Decided to go the UK route for MY99. Alfa Romeo also offered extended warranties on the import, but Subaru did not and I hate independent Warranty companies they will do anything to get out paying a claim. Alfa Romeo would service the car, Subaru wouldn't.
Nice to have a few stamps from the official dealer.

Give it a few more years and I think your average second hand car buyer will reconise that he is buying a good imported car and not an overprice second hand UK car. This is what will drive prices down.

would challenge all of gazzer's reasons...

I know where you can buy a NEW UK spec car sourced from Holland with just a £500 deposit (credit card will do) and a few weeks wait.... 10 sonic blue cars coming in real soon...price £16750 all inclusive (incl tax + plates) - nothing else to pay until car arrives

Advantages of buying in UK are as follows:
* Depreciation is much lower than an import

no it isn't - a UK car will lose 5k in the first year, an import about 3 k - this is due to the lower initial purchase price - both lose money at about the same rate in percentage terms

* No hassle factor

ditto - no hassle with the method I am describing

* Lower risk

??? -no risk involved

* No flights/ferries to collect it

ditto - cars delivered in UK

* Dealer is nearby in case of problems

all european sourced cars have exactly the same dealer backup in UK

* You get 3 year warranty

big deal - warranties costs £230/year for year 2 + 3

* You get an alarm

wowee - a whole £250 worth

* You get locking wheel nuts

£16.50!

* You get mats

this is getting silly

* Road tax/registration is included

ditto the above - car is 16750 on the road

* Number plates are included

as above - included

if you want to save a shed load of cash mail me for the importer's details:
(not posted here due to risk of time wasters)
maimailto:Paul.webber@avecia.com

Paul W (NB I have no connection with the company concerned other than being a customer myself)

sorry - double posting due to crappy server response - thought the first one hadn't gone through

Paul

[This message has been edited by pwebb (edited 18-02-2000).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by ^Gazzer^:
<B>Advantages of buying in UK are as follows:

* Depreciation is much lower than an import

* No hassle factor

* Lower risk

* No flights/ferries to collect it

* Dealer is nearby in case of problems

* You get 3 year warranty

* You get an alarm

* You get locking wheel nuts

* You get mats

* Road tax/registration is included

* Number plates are included

When you calculate the total cost of ownership over a period of time, then the UK car costs about the same as an import. So don't worry.

regards,

Gary.

[/quote]

There is no evidence of lower re-sale values for UK spec imports.

Dutch dealer was more helpful than any UK dealer I' dealt with. He even threw in some freebies.

EU law protects you fully, so no risk

You can get the car delivered if you wish

Ok, only 1 year warranty

Alarm - what's £500 when you are saving £7k?

Ditto

Ditto

When you say included, you still have to pay it!!! It is just included in the total bill.

Cost of ownership is calculated on running costs per mile (no difference there then), servicing - same again - and depreciation. No real evidence for this either. If residuals are lower for imports, it still won't be £7k!!!!

IM are ripping off people in the UK . Apart from the extra effort needed to import it, there isn't a good argument for not importing.

Hi Rus,

If your car doesn't have ABS that will probably adversely affect your insurance premium. I don't know by how much. Also, if you are buying a car that doesn't have ABS fitted, consider how much you want ABS (you probably do, quite a lot), work out how much extra it will cost to have it fitted and throw that into the calculation of savings.

I bought a UK turbo from a UK dealer last June for full price. I wanted the car <I>right then</I> http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/cool.gif and I was lucky enough to have the cash so I went ahead. I have no regrets at all http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif. Maybe if I had then had the information that I have now about ease of service/parts for imports I would have at least considered buying an import, though I think I would have gone for an Sti for the same money rather than a UK spec car for less. My big worry about an import would have been - and still would be - the warranty. Even with a Dutch UK spec car you only get a one-year Subaru warranty (don't know if it's the same warranty as the UK cars during that time) so you will need to buy an insurance-based warranty beyond that. Some will tell you that's not a big deal but before you make up your mind on that take a look at some of the recent threads about the horror stories of some poor folks who have had to claim on those warranties. Not all Subaru dealers are great, but at least you have a choice of which one you go to. Some of the insurance companies will force you to go to some backstreet breakers who will f*&% with your car.

Finally, ask yourself this: can you bear to wait 5 or 6 months driving round in a F*** Orion? There is probably an old Russian saying that says "Life is sh1t without a decent car".

[This message has been edited by DavidG (edited 18-02-2000).]

[This message has been edited by DavidG (edited 18-02-2000).]

Wow! What a response! Thanks a lot for all the info and advice! I am still not sure though which route to take ... http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/confused.gif

Just checked

I wonder if the official WRX due 2001 will be available in Europe cheaper than in the UK. Anybody heard any news about it ?

After the very poor trade in I got for my old car, and the mediocre dealer service from where I bought mine, I'd certainly consider importing next time, for any car; not just an Impreza. And I do consider 6k to be lots of dosh, earning 100k just means you spend more money on what you'd buy under normal circumstances; with the exception of the Scoob, of course.

DavidG,

The proverb, "buy in haste, repent at leisure" is an apt one. I'm not badly off, bought my scoob for cash too, but would not say that I'm rich enough or stupid enough to not think twice about pi$$ing away 6 grand. This is probably true for all scoob or potential scoob drivers. If 6 grand really did mean that little to us, then we'd be driving 993RS's Turbo4's or the like.

Gary.

Slightly off topic but a question has just sprung to mind.

What is the situation if your EU import gets nicked? Will the insurance cover the cost of a UK replacement or is it another 6 month wait?

What have people who have already imported put down as the value of the car on their insurance given that 'new' EU imports appear to be selling in the UK at a premium above actual import cost?

GCollier, I'm neither rich nor stupid. I didn't buy in haste and neither am I repenting. As I said in my post, I have no regrets. As I also said, I didn't know about the Dutch import route at the time I bought. If I had, I would have seriously considered it because six grand is obviously enough for anyone to stop and think.

In any event, I think by the time you pay for aircon, associated costs (travel, etc) and additional warranty, you're talking about less than a 6,000 saving (and Subarussian says that in the case he looked at it's less than 3,000), though I take your point. It's still enough for plenty of extra goodies and a nice holiday http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/cool.gif. Bear in mind that you also can't quantify the peace of mind that you get from the 3-year Subaru warranty, even though that's a real value to some if not to everyone. Check out the P1 vs Sti 6 debates: there are plenty of people who will go for the P1 over the Sti and one of the reasons is that the P1 comes with the full Subaru 3 year warranty.

Whatever you do DO IT QUICK!....as i predicted to my work colleagues many moons ago...European Dealers WILL BE FORCED TO INCREASE THEIR PRICES to bring it in line with the UK AND NOT VICE VERSA like all you muppets thought....this will narrow the difference to circa 12% max......Alfa have already stated this intention i beleive....the rest will soon follow no doubt....THE CONSUMER IS NOT KING!!!!

Sadly yours

Sunil the bean-counter

[This message has been edited by sunilp (edited 18-02-2000).]

What about Mitsubishi, reducing prices in UK?

PWebb,
I got a free fire extinguisher with my Belgian MY 99 too!

Saved £6000 (still no VAT bill either).

That's £3000 earning me interest. Hoorah!

I'm thinking of daytrading with the VAT fund

A small point :

Deposit @ 30% of Dutch basic price works out at about £4,000.

UK VAT is added after the car is imported.

Kevin
MY00 555 blue from Holland.

I really think that it is a matter of personal choice and if you choose to buy from holland (or wherever) or in the UK, then you do for your own reasons.
If you've saved £6,000, great I take my hat off to you and I expect it makes driving a great car that much sweeter. But for those who decide to buy a UK car, (myself included)you do for your own reasons and really shouldn't be made to feel like an idiot for doing so. http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/frown.gif
I've had to scrape together the money to buy one and had to think long and hard about whether or not I can afford to run one etc. If I'd have had £5,000 or whatever it is for a deposit 6 months ago then I would have imported, I didn't so I ordered a UK one.
I know I'm paying more, but like I say it's down to personal circumstances and choices.

Just enjoy the car, wherever you got it from!
http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/biggrin.gif
Cheers
Iain. (11 days and counting!)