Ah, I didn't need to do the advanced course after the first drive.

You'll probably still be amazed at what you learn, I know I was.

Edit to say I was replying to Jeff's post, but someone snuck in, which made my reply sound arrogant, which it wasn't meant to be.

:D


[Edited by TaviaRS - 11/4/2002 2:40:52 PM]

I'm off to do the first 2 parts of the HPC course with John Lyons on Friday. Has anyone done this course and have any helpful hints to pass on ?


Jeff

Done the first part :D

It is very useful and you learn a lot. Best tip - keep an open mind, you are not as good as you think you are. You are obviously prepared to learn, otherwise you wouldn't be doing it. Second tip - Assume you are doing the 1 day course (think they call it part one) then get a good nights sleep before hand. I found it tiring and I'm used to driving 2-300 miles per day. Assume you are doing the 1 day course (think they call it part one).

I love driving and would class my self as average, so I got a lot out of it. Yes I know the theory, its the application thats the hard bit and does take practice (lots). Also found it different to the Institute of Advanced Motorists, which I just couldn't get to grips with.

Most of all, ENJOY IT. :D

I'm doing the 1st drive & the Advanced course...


I am looking forward to it...



Jeff

IAM Course is fantastic, I took mine just over a year ago, and I do believe you get more out of your car by doing this..

Jeff or TaviaRS.
Where can I find more info on this course? I want to do some form of course in the car as this is the first 4wd car I've owned and I'd like to find out more about the cars limits somewhere that v little damage could occur!

Paul

http://www.high-performance-course.co.uk/

This isn't the IAM course....!



Jeff

I've done the whole HPC 2 day jobby, and can offer the following advice:

1) Check all your fluid levels, tyre pressures etc before turning up. Your car will be working quite hard, especially at Chobham and MillBrook.

2) John has a certain way about him that can make you feel really quite stupid if you do things wrong, after he's told you how to do them right. Keep calm, and don't get wound up - it's nothing personal, its just his style. You'd have to change every aspect of your driving at once, to keep him happy, so don't worry that he has a few stern words every so ofen.

3) Get used to the idea of double-declutching...

4) If there are people about, in a crowded town street, you can't go slow enough. If you are on a straight, clear, dry, entrance/exit free road, you can't go fast enough.

5) Enjoy it! MillBrook is like a perfect driver's playground, and you only get an hour!

6) Use what you learn, you'll be amazed.

7) If you have specific questions, make sure you ask. He sometimes assumes you know more than you do.

8) When he does his demo laps, hold on tight; you won't believe how fast your car can go round corners - I've never experienced anything like it.

9) His primary issue is safety. He won't loon about, but he doesn't hang about, either. Safe, smooth, speedy...

I'm still not brilliant myself, but I am now aware of my limits, and that they're a lot closer than I thought...

My observation, anticipation and communication is much better...

Dan

Also Chocky, why not try an airfield day? Would suggest a skid pan but not many let you use your own car. I normally take my new car, once run in, out on an airfield day. OK it is fairly harsh on tyres, but there is plenty of space to play and at this time of year it will be slippy (cuts wear and helps the car slide).

The course Jeff is doing is good for learning to drive, which is not car specific. Does help though.

Couldn't agree more. With HPC, you get about 2 expensive hours of on-limit handling/high-speed antics. With an airfield day, you get a 7 hrs for the price of 1 with HPC, and the freedom to experiment.

John HPC Lyon will teach you to drive, not necessarily learn the cars limits...

If you want a list of trackdays available (in addition to the ones in here) have a look at http://www.uktrackdays.co.uk which lists nearly all the trackdays available in the UK, in date order. Try an airfield one for what you want to learn, esepcially as "normal" tracks have nasties like armco and gravel traps.

I'm doing this to try and make me a better road driver...not because I want to go faster around a track.


Jeff

Quite right too. The airfield suggestion was so that he could explore the limits of the car in a controlled environment.

I've done first drive, full HPC and some refresher training with John. Echo all of the above. Stay open minded and in learning mode. Appreciate and absorb his driving ability.

You'll be exhausted by the end of it. Anticipate when to cover the horn (lots of horn use at junctions, overtaking), get good at double declutching, gear changes, steering.

I think that this course makes one a better, safer road driver. Once your awareness has increased, guys like Don Palmer and airfield days are a great next step.

May well see you at an Xmas Bruntingthorpe gig.

TaviaRS

I agree that an Airfield day would allow you to find out the limits of your car....however I still think that training from someone like Don Palmer will show you the limits are further than you think and what to do to recover the situation.


Jeff

So John drives *your* car for demos ;)

When Don Palmer drove my car (which may or may not have been my company car:D), I was scared s$$$less for two reasons:
- what physically would happen if it went pear-shaped
- what financially would have happened if it went really pear-shaped.

I didn't discuss it, but if a tyre had rolled off a rim for some reason, I/we could have been well up the creek.

Do HPC cover the insurance angle when John drives your car?

I believe so.....I'll check on Friday.


Jeff

Does he really make you double declutch, or just heel-and-toe?

Both. Up and down (and up and down and up and down and up and down).

Firstly, John is fully insured to drive your car, as I'm sure Don Palmer is, too. No worries. And they don't put a foot wrong, anyway.

I think the main difference between John's and Don's courses is that John's lays some driving foundations and brings your perception of your handling/performance limits in line with your actual limits, whereas Don's extends your limits to nearer where you think they should be!

I think Don's course is a natural progression for those people who've been on John's course. I'm saving up for it next year!

try one of Motorsport events acadamy days best of both worlds in terms of track and road skills

Ignorant hat on....

What is double declutching? I have heard it mentioned many times over the years, particulalry with regard to vans/trucks?

Cheers

Matt