My understanding of torque and BHP takes a dip ( http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/confused.gif, sorry had to use the new smilie) when I hear people rave about the Integra Type R compared to the Scooby.

This is my understanding: The Integra has 190BHP but only 131 lb/ft of torque compared to the Impreza’s 215BHP and far superior 214 lb/ft.

So how can some folk praise the Integra R to high heavens.

Or am I missing something?

P.S. I know that the Integra needs to get up to 6000rpm to come alive with the VTEC stuff but the whole thing still puzzles me.

The Integra gets praised for a good chassis and handling (or the reviews I read did!).

To get along a decent wack with an Integra, you have to cane the pants of it. If you aren't in the mood, it's a bit sloooowww.

Chris.

It's also down to BHP and torque/ton, not sure of the weights of each car but most parts in the engine bay of the Integra are made of alloy (engine mounts etc)and minimal accesories.

JackC

The reason that the integra does not feel as slow as the torque figures suggest is that power is a function of torque and rpm i.e. take torque multiply by rpm and some constant and you get power. As the integra revs so high you get the power but it is high up the rev range.

I don't think that either number is a good indication of the feel or speed (for want of a better word) of a car, referance to a dyno plot is best.

btw. Does anyone else who has driven one think that the gearshift is ridiculously long?

oops

[This message has been edited by Paul Wilson (edited 24-01-2000).]

I drove a honda integra type-r for about a year before the scoob. The gearshift was a bit longer than the STi but just as accurate...and an absolute pleasure to use http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/wink.gif

Round the twisties in the vtec zone it used to feel very fast and incredibly agile.

Now that i've fitted some new shocks on the scooby it almost feels like the old honda ;-) just as responsive but not as compliant.

As Paul says, a lot is down to torque/bhp per ton. The Integra is quite a bit lighter than the Scoob.

Its also much shorter geared than the Scoob (UK and Imports) afaik, and therefore the torque defecit is less obvious.

Plant your foot in it below 4,000 rpm in a high gear, though, and nothing much happens.

Handling is excellent, esp for front driver.

Gearshift is longer than quickshift Scoobs, but shorter that standard cars.

D

Can't believe anyone is even comparing the two - we had a loan car from honda at work - it was vaguely amusing for 5 mins but I soon became tired/bored of driving like a loony trying to keep it in the 'hot zone' - I think I would tire of a car like that in less than a week. The scooby (all versions) delivers power with such comparitive ease there really is no comparison. On a long fast drive you will arrive fresh and invigorated in an impreza, red-eyed and with frayed nerve ends in the honda - or am I getting too old?

Paul W

You're getting too old http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/tongue.gif

Hi All,

I agree - almost all very high revving 4 valve NA engines I've driven (not 6-litre V12s Diablo...) feel gutless unless you thrash them.

I've always loved the torquey power delivery of a well sorted turbo motor - fun when you want it to be, but you still have the choice of going one gear higher, and surfing the mid-range torque http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/smile.gif.

A low torque peak is a good thing from a drivability point of view, but one that stays flat as high in the rev range as possible is even better as it allows you to gain additional benefit from lower gearing.
Even my Standard UK98 Impreza is pretty good in this respect, so the Sti must be something else.

Cheers,

Alex

I'm about to start a new job with a company car. My STI will be staying (naturally) and just used for weekends. I could have the Type R or 318/323CI coupe BM.

Instead I am going to go for the Lexus IS200 Sport. I think this, whilst less powerful then the Type R, will suite most needs.

Just check out the spec.

It is also about Power. On a track power rules so when caning the cars to an inch of their life on the road, the Integra keeps up very well.

Ben

KRS -

the Lexus is not a bad motor, though pretty heavy. Especially loaded. I test-drove a couple in Oz before buying a Subaru - very smooth engine, not much grunt below 4,000, not too bad above but the rev range isn't huge so get busy with the lever (6,400 rpm max). Pedals still too light (I was expecting BMW/Audi rifle-bolt weightings). For the money, the BMW 318i is a bit pathetic - 21 grand for a lo-tech, eight-valve nineteen-hundred. Extremely refined though, if that's your bag (more so than any other car in its class). BMW steadfastly refuses to sell the 320i in the UK - last time I looked, anyway - which means you can't have that in-line six unless you go up to a 323i - no wonder the Lex has found lots of homes.

If you go with the Lexus, get the 17 five-spokes, if they're not already included - there's no discernible difference in ride or handling between the 16s and 17s, and the 17s look a lot better, IMHO.

Andy T