Hot under the collar. :lol:

Seeing as it's mostly right wing/conservative people who seem to have voted Brexit, this is quite amusing.

Just so our Brexit chums can't complain it's from a 'left wing rag', it's from the Daily Mail ;)

Some of the views in this thread would appear to back that research up :lol1:

How do you work that out, when so many Labour constituencies voted leave?

maybe because the vote was not done on a FPTP constituency basis

just a thought................................

I see Pete has done his usual disappearing act. As soon as his rubbish gets called out, and saying 'wake up' is all he has left, he vanishes. Fear not though sheeple he'll be back at the next opportunity to blame something else on those evil schemers at the EU and the lefties who fanatically support them.
​​​​

Yet, by your own words, anyone who doesn't support Brexit is a Lefty Liberal :wonder:

Nope, the remoaners are.

No posts for 8 hours(?!) :wonder:

The Catalan issue on BBC News is quite interesting. The big banks are looking to move out of Catalonia, and several smaller businesses have already moved.

Could that be because it's better to be in the EU? :Suspiciou

I expect it will be because they are expecting spain to crack down hard on them.

Managed three days :lol1:

Looks like normal service has resumed :facepalm:

what's actually more interesting is the lunatics who think we can just "revert to WTO" are being taught a lesson in international trade


https://www.ft.com/content/92bb5636-...83c97?mhq5j=e7


"Trump opposes EU-UK WTO deal in blow to May’s Brexit plans "

http://www.politico.eu/article/us-ro...e-woes-deepen/

"In a fast-developing second trade spat, Washington has teamed up with Brazil, Argentina, Canada, New Zealand, Uruguay and Thailand to reject Britain’s proposed import arrangements for crucial agricultural goods such as meat, sugar and grains after Brexit. The fact that the U.K.’s opponents include the U.S., Canada and New Zealand is a significant setback because Britain is trying to style its former colonies as natural strategic and commercial allies after it has quit the EU."

the Empire 2.0 strikes back :-)

Why not let this thread die.

We are just going over old ground. We say get used to it, you lost, we are going, and you lot pop up supporting each other, denying and still crying after 18 months.....

Just let it go.

I KNOW I won't convince even one of you hardline remainers, and I suspect you know the opposite is true.

So let's just leave it, it's boring.:sleep:

Why not let this thread die.

We are just going over old ground. We say get used to it, you lost, we are going, and you lot pop up supporting each other, denying and still crying after 18 months.....

Just let it go.

I KNOW I won't convince even one of you hardline remainers, and I suspect you know the opposite is true.

So let's just leave it, it's boring.:sleep:

Hohoho

So now we're getting to the sharp of it all ( about to witness our folly ) you want it brushed under the carpet!

Whatever.
Still in denial I see...

Last time I looked, we're still in the EU! What you're suggesting is like leaving a football match at half time when you're 1:0 down! The game isn't over until they blow the final whistle!

If (when?) public opinion is strongly against Brexit, then the decision can easily be reversed!

Theresa May's government is crumbling around her! The Brexit negotiations are so far a complete disaster! This week, thousands of passengers stranded after the collapse of Monarch airlines due to the weak pound! Car sales are plummeting as people reign in their spending as inflation rises faster than wage growth! Now it looks like massive defense cuts are also on the cards to fill the shortfall after Theresa May shook the magic money tree a little too hard to pay off the DUP! Public sector pay freeze has lost all public support!

Things are not going well in the UK and its all because of Brexit - opinion is changing! No wonder you're afraid to keep up your weak arguments!

Yawn........

precisely

it is going to be **** - just how **** is still under debate

The perceived wisdom in the Brexitidot camp is that when we leave the EU we will be able to start trading using an already defined set of tariffs and quotas using WTO rules.

At the moment despite being a founder member of the WTO we don't have any, they are all held in a EU wide pool by the EU which is the 29th member of the WTO. This was all pointed out to the Bexidiots

The WTO is a consensus organisation with 160+ members many of which have no particular liking for the UK and many of who have things they want from us, ranging from market access for products we don't really want such as hormone fed beef to The Falklands in the case of Argentina.

Any one of them can slow our negotiations and we have cast ourself adrift in a world where at the moment we are leaving the largest trading block globally many are joining regional blocks to amplify their power. The EU, MERCOSUR, ASEAN, East Central and West Africa (ECOWAS, EAC ECCWAS) all created to amplify the trade power of their members, most now more powerful as a collective than the UK. Many include members we want to do trade deals with such as Brazil, most will insist in the fullness of time that we deal with their trading group not themselves as in the case of Brazil.

There might be some mitigation if a major industrialised country had gone down this route before us but we are trying something not tried before, (apart from North Korea!!!)

To makes matters worse the WTO makes the EU look agile, decisive and harmonious. In the last decade little of substance has been achieved by the WTO as attempts at improving market access in contentious areas such as regulated services or reductions in Non Tariff Barriers have floundered on the reefs of national interest. These failed negotiations conducted over a decade have left the WTO with little interest in further attempts to improve services access and very needed NTB reduction.

This is hugely damaging for the UK because the refocusing of our economy on Services in particular regulated services started by Thatcher has left us with an economy that is almost uniquely unsuited to trading using WTO rules. Mainly because there are none in the areas where we generate some of our most lucrative exports.

These lucrative exports are made possible not by the WTO but by our membership of the EU a club we are now leaving and in the process leaving these markets as well.

To further compound our problems even Trade deals will be hugely problematical because gaining market access to a partners market for our banking, insurance etc services is unlikely, for the reason that the WTO's attempts to do the same failed, countries prefer not to allow 3rd parties to trade without costly pre-conditions such as local ownership in their regualted markets.

None of this is a problem for us in the EU and ironically the only trade deals outside the EU itself that make any attempt to improve regulated services access and reduce NTB's are the EU Korea and EU Canada deals.

Of course many Brexiteers might say, hang on we are going to become a Free Trader leading the global Free trade revolution, they are deluded, free trade doesn't exist, countries want to regulate everything from a banking license to the frequency a wireless device uses and they aren't prepared to give that up for the sake of a small country on the edge of Europe with ideas well above its status.

And again the WTO can't help. WTO rules don't cover regulatory compliance thats well beyond the WTO's competence and this is hugely damaging because despite Brexiteers childlike fixation on Tariffs its NTB's that cost more and can in many circumstances stop trade entirely.

oh and just one other thing - I read some confusion up thread from the usual Brexidiots around what any "transition" or "extension" deal from the EU might look like

the ONLY one that will be offered by the EU is full compliance with membership (FOC ECJ Payments) but no say (so no Farage cluttering up the EP)

so when you hear our Brexit politicians talk about anything other than excepting the above conditions of a "transition" post 29th March 2019

they are talking nonsense - and a hard Brexit on WTO is what we will get

we can talk about what we want till the cows come home - but we'll be like the drunk at a party mumbling to himself

faintly amusing until you see his piss stained trousers

In answer to the OP, based on what is becoming evidently clear: Brexit is not a good thing.


So, no. Let's not leave.

tbh SWS, you could go on and on - daily

Goldman Sachs - buying up office space in Frankfurt announced in the last few days (along with many many other Banks and Insurance co's)

Astra Zeneca - preparing to move facilities and investment out of the UK back into the EU

I don't really bother - to the Brexit Jihadis - it is a death cult

Yawn, more of the same.
Wat MIGHT happen.
What people are PREPARING to do.....

I think I'm going to have to leave you flat-earthers to cry about this among yourselves.

Bye.

It’s not “ what might happen”. It’s what is happening. It will be funny when all the expats in Europe who have homes have no right to be in the country without a visa so selling a home will be fun :)

And we needed visas before the EU? Before Schengen?

I still have my passport and have to queue up to show it getting into Belgium, France and back into the UK.

Why would I need a visa? And why would I not just get one, if I did need one? Is there NO travel between countries not in the Schengen agreement?
And why would anyone HAVE to sell their house?????????

You flat earthers. Are you frightened of other stuff too? Ghosts? Monsters? THEY don't exist either. :D

Apparently they're phasing out landing cards, or you'd need fill that as well !

Holiday abroad and living abroad are two different things. If we are not part of the EU you will need an approved visa to work in a country. Also you cant compare how your passport worked before we joined the EU as it will not work like that as Brussels wont let it happen.

As for selling a house if you cant work abroad and dont have access to funds to support your life how will you be able to hand onto your house. All countries require you to have enough cash to support yourself thru your stay.

Oh dear. Where to start?

Almost all people living abroad are retired, or have holiday homes, working in the UK.
Those who need to work will get visas. The Europeans want the tax revenue, need the skills and want them to spend.
The above will ONLY come about if we insist on visas for Johnny foreigner to come to the UK and work. Instead, we'll allow in those who have jobs to go to, the skills to do them and if no UK person wants the job...just as we should have done in 2002, and just as the Europeans do now.

And how do you know what Brussels will let happen, or not happen? More doom-mongering, I'm afraid. This is why this thread needs closing, because you flat earthers just keep repeating the same old lies and doom saying.

Read the above.

The French, for one, and almost certainly the Spanish NEED people to live in rural areas. Those are the retirees. They pay taxes, they spend, and pay more taxes. And they have an income. They are NOT a burden on the European country they live in, they are a bonus. Without them, old houses fall into dereliction, old French people have no-one to sell their houses to, so no funds for retirement, and local economies go bust. Trust me. I saw what happened here when loads went home after the crash in 2008.
Nor are they a drain on the local health service, as they either pay in, or pay up front. No other choice, unlike the stupid UK..........

You need to stop the doom-mongering and wake up, smell the coffee.
The world is good, the word is BREXIT!

The 'Europeans' don't have skilled workers ??

For those going on holiday, nothing much will change as the UK is already outside of the Schengen area and still has passport controls. The major difference for holiday makers is likely to be whether you can stand in the EU passport queue or the other passports queue. At some point the EU wants to introduce entry controls into the Schengen area which means applying for an electronic travel authority which will cost €5 and will be very similar as you currently have travelling to the US, Canada or Australia. Maybe a bit of a ballache for frequent business travellers, but for holidaymakers no real big deal!

As for people living, working or studying abroad, then you are probably right that the EU will probably have the same restrictions on UK citizens as the UK puts on EU citizens. ...but I guess you missed the whole bit about the UK wanting to restrict EU migration, which means the EU will restrict UK migration.

According to the leaked document from the government, ristrictions will be applied for anyone staying longer than 3 months (if that is 3 months on 1 trip or three months within a 12 month period is not currently clear!). So, if you want to stay longer than 3 months, you will have to apply for a residency, work or study perermit which will be granted according to the rules, requirements and political will of the country you want to visit - typically, this requires you to prove you have sufficient funds to support yourself for the length of your stay and that you have suitable health insurance. This is pretty much the current situ for staying in any non EU country for longer than 1-3 months. Generally, when you a granted a permit, it will only be valid for short period - typically the length of your planned trip upto a maximum on 1 year - if you want to stay longer, you have to keep re-applying. Once you stay somewhere for a few years, then they may grant you longer permits upto maybe 5 years.

The crux of it is, if you're rich, then you'll be fine, if you're not so rich, then you probably won't be granted a residency permit. Poor people may have a chance with work or study permits, but work permits will be restricted depending on local demand for your skills.

So, no, its not going to to difficult to go on holiday to the EU, but living there will be a lot harder for a lot of people. Particularly all those retired Brits on the Costa del Sol who really aren't that well off and won't be able to afford private health insurance.