There's been a few threads recently on poor driving. I've recently started commuting into Central London by motorbike (instead of the tube) and I can assure non-bikers that it is a real eye-opener.

I have listed below some of the poor driving which I have witnessed recently, all of which have caused needless "close shaves" with me and other drivers/riders:

1. Starting a manoeuvre then indicating
2. Not checking blind spots
3. Jumping the lights
4. Being principalled
5. Pulling out of a junction, then looking
6. Using a mobile phone and therefore being unable to indicate
7. Impatience

This is just from car drivers. White van man, motorbike couriers (and even taxis) really aren't that bad. It's just easy to stereotype these categories.

One last point - some people think that motorcycling is dangerous. It is, but when did you see two motorcyclists crash into each other?

Comments welcome, particularly from bikers ...

What do you mean by being principalled?

Being principalled: Drivers who won't let somebody into a line of traffic because they were there first (etc etc).

Yes they were there first, but a little give and take can help avoid a 'near miss'.

Dave,

You think that's tough, try it without an engine !!

However, I agree with your comments & although I'm more aware of bikers (engine & pedal powered) when I'm driving, they can still catch me unawares when they fly up the inside at the lights !

Keep yer wheels rolling,

John

Let’s not get all hypocritical. All of you who ride a bike (probably a relatively large number) will remember their first bike, and if they’re like me, also look back and shudder at the riding gear they used to wear. I started with a 4th hand chipped helmet, an ex-Army combat jacket, baseball boots and some tragically inadequate gloves. A couple of spills showed me that this was NOT the right sort of stuff to wear!

I currently wear a 2-piece leather suit, good boots, and change my helmet (at a minimum) every 3 years. I also have a selection of visors which are used dependent upon how sunny it is. Thing is, my kit cost around £1500, which isn’t really affordable to the average 19 year old first biker.

How many of us can truly say we haven’t done it? Not just with bikes, I might add – I bet we’ve all had a first car which was of dubious legality and had the barest minimum of tread/brakes.

Re safety – a 100+dB Supertrapp pipe on my town bike (650 Bros) tends to ensure that slow-moving traffic is aware of my presence!

Couldn't agree with you more about bikers not having accidents.
As long as we aren't talking about pizza delivery.
Be warned thought, there are more and more 'younger' [for want of a better word] drivers taking to two wheels as opposed to four.
I myself was taken out by a Fiesta while on a CBR600 at a roundabout. Ended up under a taxi. Driver didn't see me and kept going.
Be careful out there.

People always think that motorcyclists (keen committed ones) are being 'holier than thou' when we start talking about how much better riders/road users we are than just car drivers, remember we ride AS WELL as driving.


These are the things that any biker could have written you up as a list before you started riding, not cynical just true.


To a degree it's part of the experience, that 'wide awake, playing a part in the whole event of travelling thing, actually seeing what everybody does.

Fun but just a little bit scary.

City centre accident figures have dropped massively (proportionally) over recent years.

Serious Motorcycle accidents have moved from the city into out of town areas, usually where rider input (or lack of) has been the principal cause rather than a car driver.

That can only be good, people who want to push that hard know what the consequences can be.


Riding a bike will make you a better car driver too, there's nothing like being vulnerable to focus the mind and once you have you will give more attention to what you are doing in your car too.


Mike.

welcome to driving in london mate!!

I know what you mean, I face the same problem day in day out, and to be honest busses are the worst, they think they have a god given right to just pull out, this really takes the f***ing pi**!!

oh and the twits in their giant merc, beemers, jags, astons etc etc!!

I was a motorcycle courier for a while in London. A real eye opener. It really does enable you to ride/drive with so much more awareness afterwards. You just have to 'slow down' when you go somewhere else as London traffic seems to be fairly unique in the UK. Once inside the M25 there is no place for people who dawdle. If you see a gap then go for it. Everybody does the same so there are not as many accidents as you would imagine.

In the several months I was working there were very few couriers off after crashes. A few minor spills maybe but nothing major.

I agree with Dave about his 'cose shaves'ist - althoug whebn I was a couries a cra 'phone took up all of the boot and were confined to Government ministers!

All you have to do, when driving/riding anywhere, is assume that they ARE out to get you!

Ride/drive safe!

Dave

PS: if I was going into Central London to go shopping, as opposed to getting bladdered, I would driver rather than take the train.

Having been a London courier, I agree with Mike T about awareness. Riding any sort of 2 wheels in London means you have to be so much more on the ball. Not only 4dr commuters in their snug boxes but pedestrians (specially tourists) are completely suicidal & dangerous to 2 wheels. The best way to look at it is that everyone is out to "do you" and to ride defensively (but ascertively). That car will pull out so cover the brake, try & make eye contact & position yourself so that they know this piece of the highway is yours. That person has got his hand up so watch out for black cabs descending from any direction. That light has just gone green - do the Green Cross Code before you move off. Etc etc

Buy the best protective gear you can afford & wear it at all times. If you're running on the cheap, the minimum is to make sure you have stout boots, gloves and put as much as you can into a a good helmet. Get leathers, body armour as soon after as poss. I don't believe in dayglo for the sake of it but riding with headlights on at all times is essential. Louder horns (like scoobies). Also say/indicate "Thank You" - works wonders.

There is, unfortunately, a new breed of biker hitting the streets & that is the moped rider. These fall into 2 sub-categories. 1 is youngsters who find it a cheap & easy way to get on the road & be mobile & stylish (?). I haven't heard of any accident figures yet but I would imagine that in this age category it will rise. These people bomb around with scant regard for their own safety, pulling out & doing stupid overtakes etc. Shell suits, trainers, no gloves & a £30 helmet will cause a drain on A&E resources. 2 is commuters (sorry DT - I hope you don't ride one of these things). I think a certain amount of new found freedom from traffic jams & tube delays causes this breed to decide that they can tear-arse their way to work & back. It makes it dangerous for not only car drivers but other bikers as well as they are unpredictable & not necessarily up on the laws of physics/dynamics as well as those of the land. Just plain inexperienced on any form of transport. On my bike LHS of road, indicating left (well in advance) & slowing down, do a safety check to the left (moped behind, space on my right) look front again & start to turn, get 6th sense & abort as **** tries to come up the inside....

Rant on mopeds over. Social comment time. There are specific areas in London that it is literally more dangerous than others to drive. In these places think about what that car car COULD do & it will. Scary. I used to live in one such area & just coming into the edges meant that it was time to get extra extra alert. I have mentioned this to other people/couriers and it is not just a phenomenom restricted to the area I used to live. Prehaps someone has done a study on it.

Driver education. Give them all compulsory on the road motorcycle training for 2 weeks.

The "awareness" comments are oh so true. The lack of distractions (radio, mobile phone, conversations with passengers) means all your attention is on your riding and your survival.

A technique used to teach advanced riding and improve your awareness is to do a running commentary about what you see and the actions you take.

Safe riding.

P.S. Watch out for Volvo drivers particularly if they have a phone glued to their ear.

So when you bike riders travel, do you occupy a lane or do you thread up between lanes?
You are rare (and virtuos) if the former. If the latter, could you tell me the legality as well as being dangerous, it seems to often involve undertaking and (obviously) not keeping to a lane.

After nearly taking a couple of guys off by chnaging lanes and not seeing their rapid progress "through" between the lanes, I am very careful with this manoeuver.

But, I feel strongly that anyone who makes up lanes by riding inside or outside slower moving vehicles is risking their life. Do not blame others if they fail to see you, you should NOT be there.

I havent ridden a bike for many years, I wonder if I would think differently if I still rode?

Also, many, many drivers do inconsiderate and dangerous things (myself included), but bikes seem to have a different set of road rules than other vehicles.

Nic

NickF

You're right, one forgets one's pimply yoof. But it does make one glad to be older & wiser.

Nic

Filtering through traffic is not illegal. There's nothing to say that it is legal either but because it is per se not illegal, you won't get nicked for it. However, whilst filtering you must pay great attention & if you have an accident you may have more of a struggle to prove liability than may otherwise be the case.

I'm glad you made the distinction about urban accidents. I live near the famed (in biking circles) Cat and Fiddle road from Macclesfield to Buxton. Its a regular Bank Holiday biker carnage zone and whilst I can't remember the exact number of fatalities, I think last year there were about 12 deaths and plenty more serious injuries. It would be fair to say that very few of these involved other vehicles or were caused by other vehicles.

If the local press are to be believed, most are not young kids as you might expect, but born again bikers who have the money to buy powerful bikes, but perhaps not the ability...

Regarding the point about undertaking on a bike, when I got taken off my push bike by a car whilst undertaking up the inside of a queue of traffic (he decided to park, so did I at 25mph into his wing), the kindly police orrificer told me it was my fault.

Do the same rules apply to motorbikes as bicycles?

Nic, Mike,

As far as I am aware too, filtering is legal. But not over zig-zags by crossings for example.

As for nearly knocking bikes off by changing lanes, did you indicate in plenty of time? When I filter I am VERY aware of other cars/pedetrians etc. I look at drivers and their actions as well as cars to attempt to figure out if someone is suddenly going to change. Haven't quite got the true telepathic link going yet but close...

If you're in a car and stuck in lanes whilst bikes are freely filtering down the middle, the best thing to do is to stay where you are. Don't make sudden changes at the last minute- more dangerous than staying where you are.

Dave

PS: nearly had an *urban accident* this morning. Daddy in people mover was letting sonny Jim off at school - except that he had parked on the main road (2 lane) rather than be *inconvenienced* by actually having to go into the school and have to wait to get out again. Nothing coming the other way so I indicated right and started to overtake. At that point his right indicator came on and he started to move. As I was already overlapping his car in the other lane I used the horn thinking he just hadn't looked. His response? He accelerated more quickly! You'll be pleased to know that a Scoob out accelerates a Renault people Carrier... But then looking in my mirror at his reactions it was all my fault. Back to the telepathic link again... Pillocks shouldn't be allowed on the road.

Dont get me started on people carriers http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/frown.gif they have taken over from Mercs and BM's on my hate list of drivers and cars.

I'm sure somebody will leap to sorrect me if I'm wrong, but I seem to remember reading in the highway code that 'filtering' on a motorcycle is actually legal.

(Surely anything which is not illegal must be legal)?

Mike.

Just to make you lot feel a bit better, I live in one of the worst places for accidents in Europe. The standard of driving in Cyprus is absolutely astounding. Has to be seen to be believed.