Porsche 997
 

What are they like in the 3.8ltr version? My daughter heads to uni in 18 months time so I can finally get a 2 plus 2 car so I was going to take my time and find something that's worth keeping ? but are they worth keeping?

Steve,
Simon bought a 991 4s, which surprised me as it was 4WD. However, he said he thought it was a much better drive than the 2s. He didn't keep it for long though as he said it was quite dull to drive as the "toy".

Damn, I was hoping to get a car to keep for quite a while as I don't do many miles but would like something with a soul :(

Awesome.
Get one.
The 991 has got too big; a real shame.

Engine reliability needs research...

had a quick search of the 991 and they are way out of my budget even allowing for over a year buy in time :D

I had a 997.1 Carrera S manual.

First 18 months was fantastic, loved it to bits. Fuel consumption was slightly better than an STI Impreza and insurance was very cheap, I don't think it ever cost me more than £500 a year to insure it.

Seemed to get through tyres and brakes at a boring rate. It then developed engine troubles after about 18 months and after that I lost my love for the car. It wasn't a rear-main seal issue for which some 911s are well known but something to do with the valves, and I know the car cracked a piston. Ended up having most of the engine replaced but the problems continued so I sold it.

They're lovely cars but for what it cost me and what I got out of it, I didn't think it was as good as it should have been. I want to return to the marque but I think it'll be with a GT3.

I think the 2nd gen versions were more reliable.

Steve,
It's not to say you wouldn't get on with it..... have you tested one yet?

TNG,
That sounds really bad mate. :(

It's the main thing that has put me off Porsche ownership, reliability and maintenance costs. I've come close a couple of times, getting in to a Turbo. Ultimately I've backed out because of the true cost to own. I'm going to have to get one at some point though...... you can run, but you can't hide. :D

Not really matey, I knew what I was getting myself in for. Back then I didn't have a wife and kids so I could afford it all very easily, but the thing is I got bored of it. I could have one now but I don't think it's worth the financial sacrifice.

I lost a lot of money on the car but I sold it and used the proceeds to fund a house purchase and wedding, and I've ticked the Porsche box.

I was tempted by a 997.2 but I had already been put off. Having taken one out I can say it's a better car for sure and picks up more quickly.

Your A45 or my Cosworth would be quicker in a straight line though, and probably be a better car on a wet B road in the hands of an amateur. However they're not as special as a Porsche 911, not got the pedigree and image, and that is essentially what you're buying when you go for one.

It wasn't about the ability to "afford" for me, but like you, moreso the justification of potential spend over life of ownership. Some of these cars are not just about the initial purchase cost. It's the entire cost of ownership. I'm in a similar situation with the GTR.

I do remember driving the 997 turbo. I thought it was a fantastic car, and at the time, it was the only other car I'd drove that came near the sheer performance feeling, of my then SPEC C.

I know I'm going to end up in one at some stage.

I had a 996 Turbo for a while; tough motor, very reliable and fast enough when the occasion demands. Brilliant car and you can pick up a lowish mileage one for sub £30k. I regretted selling mine as it disappeared up the road, and recently have been hankering for another.

I think the turboa use a stronger engine; certainly the case with the first gen 997.
I'm still blown away by the 2.9s 0-60 time of the 997 Turbo S!

The turbo engines use the GT1 block, so very strong.
Most don't have issues unless there's been an over-rev and then the timing chain can stretch.

Potential catastrophe if that happens.

Unusually, mine had the RMS go.
Overall, 2 years ownership cost me a small fortune for a car I never really gelled with.

Not yet and probably won't in the near future, I'm looking a quite a few different cars and all seem to be in the £30k mark. I would buy a Chevvy Challenger SS if they did it in right hand drive

Have you considered going for an older 911? definitely get a sense of occasion and the feeling of driving something special, also has the benefit of probably going up in value.

Something like this.

http://www.classicheroes.co.uk/cars-...miles-from-new

It was reading about your problems that put me off owning a 911. Like you I was after a 996 Turbo (Couldn't afford a 997 Turbo at the time) but after doing research on the internet about how many 911 were having problems, I backed out. Warranty cost was high, and Porsche's attitude to anything warranty wise, or their keenness to find something on the car none OEM (even wiper blades) to say the car isn't covered.

Is it definitely a 911 you want?

Have you considered an R8? I owned a V8 manual for 3 years. Used only at weekend, I needed one set of new tyres (that had been on the car 3 years anyway) and apart from servicing, fuel, and insurance, it didn't cost me anything else. Car never missed a beat.

They look better than a 911, get's looks like no 911 can ever get (not that that's really important, but shows that people really like the car) and was 100% reliable.

Best of all in 3 years 3 months of ownership, I never lost a penny in value. Got back exactly what I paid for it. :thumb:

The 996 has had a poor press over the years but the 996 Turbo has an entirely different engine, stronger and far more reliable. I had mine for 18 months without problem and sold it for the same as I'd paid for it.

All 996 Carreras,986/7 boxsters suffer from potential engine issues.

The 997.1 Carrera also does. The 997.2 Carrera much less so, therefore much more reliable.

To avoid the problems altogether, but as mentioned earlier in this thread, encounter other expenses, go for a Turbo.

I've got a 996 Carrera 4. I love it. It's had engine work. Costly engine work. But it will aid me when I eventually sell.

They are relatively cheap to run. Avg 24 mpg. Cheap insurance (I'm 41, in a rural area, parked on driveway, clean license - £200 fully comp/protected :D)
Servicing is achievable through Indy, as OPC isn't necessary unless you want their (expensive and restrictive) warranty.

Minor service about £300
Every other year, major service £500 ish

Pads and discs can be expensive, as can tyres (they're 'Kin huge)
Suspension parts do need replacing which can amount to a fair wedge of money.

FWIW, if you're handy with spanners, even better. I'm not brilliant by any means, but I've done a fair bit of stuff myself, just because the car is so well built and engineered. I enjoy working on it (infrequently due to necessity, I hasten to add!)

Most change the backboxes to Dansk, or similar. Circa £600
PSE (porsche sports exhaust) is desirable as it is switchable ;) a lot more if not already fitted.

Obviously, Carrera 2 is rwd. Carrera 4 is AWD. Carrera 4s is wide body version of Carrera 4. Arguably the most desirable Carrera (I disagree tbh)

Some people incorrectly badge their cars as "s" models, just because they've got tiptronic "s" auto boxes. S cars tend to be a little taughter.

On the subject of tiptronic, try it. Works well in turbos, not so much in NA cars. You might like it.
Tips are also,cheaper to buy.

These cars are VERY sensitive interior colours and transmission.

Interiors on the 997 were a marked development from the 996. The stereo, even with Bose, isn't all that. I upgraded mine with a pioneer double din, subs and new speakers.

Xenon lights (aka litronic iirc) are a must, although because you sit so low, the car tends to light up the road and underneath other cars :D

All in all, great car to own. Not the fastest, but if you want something with pedigree and heritage that is tangible, they're great.
Go into it with your eyes open. Engine problems WILL (not "can") cost around 5-figures.

I live down by Wales, yet the car gets serviced & maintained in Bolton, at Hartech.
http://www.hartech.org/porsche_996_9...ers_guide.html

Read this, as Hartech are widely regarded as THE place to get your car sorted. A lot of knowledge on that site.

The other place is www.911uk.com

Dan :)

The 987.2 3.4 DFi engine is very strong.

Very, very few reports of any issues.

Meant to add that Zip, I'd inferred the .2 versions of the "7" were much better. My bad! :D

There was me thinking that Porsche were fairly bulletproof. Engine issues appear to be more of a problem than I had envisaged....... that's personally turned me right off for a future purchase. :(

I have to admit, it is a crying shame.
911s have always been my realistic dream car; compact, mostly RWD, lovely sounding six pot engine and what I always thought was bullet proof build but it seems they've rather lost the plot with incredibly strict servicing/warranty rules, constant engine trouble and so on.

The 997 seems the best model (still compact; the 991 is too big), fast, fairly modern but I'd brick myself running one.

It's like pulling the girl you've lusted after for years only to find she has bad halitosis and wind.

I'll probably still get one one day anyway..!

Great analogy :lol1: but you'd still do her though. :norty:

I was wanting something newer, I'm not that into the marque that I would have an older car. I'm never luckily and I would guarantee if I came to sell a model like the above I would loose a fortune :D

Just to note:

991's are not actually that much bigger but are lighter than 997's

Almost 4cm wider though - not handy on on country lanes.

and yet you get people that only buy the 4s as its wider and "looks better" ;)

FWIW, the engine woes are still pretty low in terms of percentages.

IIRC, something like 4% on the 996.1 (3.4L), 9% on the 996.2 & 997.1 (3.6L)
997.2 (3.8) is pretty low indeed.
Turbos/Mezgers are virtually bomb-proof.

But these were ALL £70k cars. And still have running costs of this price-range.

Personally, I would either go for a turbo (996) or see Grant @ Hartech and source a sorted 997 Carrera. Happy motoring and worry-free.

Dan