Chemical attack in Syria
08 April 2018, 03:30 PM
#1
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Chemical attack in Syria
This latest chemical attack cannot go unpunished. The World has got to act as Putin is out of control just denying any involvement in anything Russia is implicated in. It’s time Russia were removed from the UN Security Council for starters. How can you have an organisation responsible for acting on what is happening in the World when one of it’s key members is responsible for many of the attrocities they are trying to prevent. Russia vetos absolutely anything that isn’t in their sole interest and prevents the Security Council from being able to successfully vote and act on attrocities being committed. It’s a pathetic and ridiculous situation.
Assad and Putin are getting away with murdering innocent people and the World just sits back and watches saying how awful it is but does nothing about it. This isn’t about the UK and US being World police it’s about the rest of the World acting together to stop this.
Wars happen all over the World I get that but the use of chemical weapons is an absolute attrocity and a war crime which both Putin and Assad are committing and should be held responsible for.
Putin should be on trial in the Hague for plenty of other crimes not just Syria. He should be behind bars not in charge of Russia and doing whatever he wants globally with no retribution. He has taken Russia backwards and to the days of the USSR.
Assad and Putin are getting away with murdering innocent people and the World just sits back and watches saying how awful it is but does nothing about it. This isn’t about the UK and US being World police it’s about the rest of the World acting together to stop this.
Wars happen all over the World I get that but the use of chemical weapons is an absolute attrocity and a war crime which both Putin and Assad are committing and should be held responsible for.
Putin should be on trial in the Hague for plenty of other crimes not just Syria. He should be behind bars not in charge of Russia and doing whatever he wants globally with no retribution. He has taken Russia backwards and to the days of the USSR.
Last edited by An0n0m0us; 08 April 2018 at 03:35 PM.
08 April 2018, 04:08 PM
#2
You think Assad and the Russians are behind this? I don’t.
He’s not stupid - why risk using chemical weapons when he doesn’t need to. Has to be a set up in order to justify what is likely to be a much greater response than last time. Can’t help but think that the US is pissed that Russia has been successful in Syria....
He’s not stupid - why risk using chemical weapons when he doesn’t need to. Has to be a set up in order to justify what is likely to be a much greater response than last time. Can’t help but think that the US is pissed that Russia has been successful in Syria....
08 April 2018, 06:18 PM
#5
As Rossy says proof on this is rather dubious: press reporting rumour as fact.
I can make chlorine gas if I want. I did it by accident once (not totally my fault I may add) and that had rolling on the floor coughing unable to breath and temporarily blinded. If I can then any militant organisation can.
I can make chlorine gas if I want. I did it by accident once (not totally my fault I may add) and that had rolling on the floor coughing unable to breath and temporarily blinded. If I can then any militant organisation can.
08 April 2018, 08:30 PM
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You think Assad and the Russians are behind this? I don’t.
He’s not stupid - why risk using chemical weapons when he doesn’t need to. Has to be a set up in order to justify what is likely to be a much greater response than last time. Can’t help but think that the US is pissed that Russia has been successful in Syria....
He’s not stupid - why risk using chemical weapons when he doesn’t need to. Has to be a set up in order to justify what is likely to be a much greater response than last time. Can’t help but think that the US is pissed that Russia has been successful in Syria....
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08 April 2018, 09:03 PM
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08 April 2018, 09:44 PM
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Not to mention the fact Novichok has only ever been produced and owned by the USSR/Russia. It’s hardly something that can be made easily by anyone else.
But of course it’s all a conspiracy against Russia and Putin never said ‘traitors will kick the bucket’
Just like Litvinenko wasn’t killed by the Russians
Last edited by An0n0m0us; 08 April 2018 at 09:46 PM.
09 April 2018, 07:42 AM
#11
This latest chemical attack cannot go unpunished. The World has got to act as Putin is out of control just denying any involvement in anything Russia is implicated in. It’s time Russia were removed from the UN Security Council for starters. How can you have an organisation responsible for acting on what is happening in the World when one of it’s key members is responsible for many of the attrocities they are trying to prevent. Russia vetos absolutely anything that isn’t in their sole interest and prevents the Security Council from being able to successfully vote and act on attrocities being committed. It’s a pathetic and ridiculous situation.
Assad and Putin are getting away with murdering innocent people and the World just sits back and watches saying how awful it is but does nothing about it. This isn’t about the UK and US being World police it’s about the rest of the World acting together to stop this.
Wars happen all over the World I get that but the use of chemical weapons is an absolute attrocity and a war crime which both Putin and Assad are committing and should be held responsible for.
Putin should be on trial in the Hague for plenty of other crimes not just Syria. He should be behind bars not in charge of Russia and doing whatever he wants globally with no retribution. He has taken Russia backwards and to the days of the USSR.
Assad and Putin are getting away with murdering innocent people and the World just sits back and watches saying how awful it is but does nothing about it. This isn’t about the UK and US being World police it’s about the rest of the World acting together to stop this.
Wars happen all over the World I get that but the use of chemical weapons is an absolute attrocity and a war crime which both Putin and Assad are committing and should be held responsible for.
Putin should be on trial in the Hague for plenty of other crimes not just Syria. He should be behind bars not in charge of Russia and doing whatever he wants globally with no retribution. He has taken Russia backwards and to the days of the USSR.
Stop reading the daily star and the sun ffs
Remember weapons of mass destruction?
09 April 2018, 01:23 PM
#14
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09 April 2018, 05:06 PM
#16
This^^^^
TBH and brutal, do we REALLY want any more Arabic persons? There are so many factions, we have already seen trouble where I live between Kurds and Iraqis.
And the recent attack on a Russian national? Do we REALLY want their problems kicking off in the UK, on some ideological grounds that we OUGHT to have them, and feed, clothe, house them before our own?
TBH and brutal, do we REALLY want any more Arabic persons? There are so many factions, we have already seen trouble where I live between Kurds and Iraqis.
And the recent attack on a Russian national? Do we REALLY want their problems kicking off in the UK, on some ideological grounds that we OUGHT to have them, and feed, clothe, house them before our own?
10 April 2018, 12:24 AM
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Saudi claim to have taken half a million.
Therefore, that's an amazing and genuinely heart warming concession from you, but even sandal wearing lefties like me would say that's more than our fair share.
Therefore, that's an amazing and genuinely heart warming concession from you, but even sandal wearing lefties like me would say that's more than our fair share.
10 April 2018, 12:27 AM
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How have we managed to get to a point where what Russia and Syria say is more believed than a democratically and accountable government?
I mean seriously, just get a grip of yourself man.
WMD blah blah blah, the government, blah blah blah. Go live in Russia, then tell us how dishonest our leaders are!
We should of dealt with Assad when we had a chance. But oh no, WMD blah blah blah.
Last edited by Martin2005; 10 April 2018 at 12:49 AM.
13 April 2018, 12:48 AM
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This latest chemical attack cannot go unpunished. The World has got to act as Putin is out of control just denying any involvement in anything Russia is implicated in. It’s time Russia were removed from the UN Security Council for starters. How can you have an organisation responsible for acting on what is happening in the World when one of it’s key members is responsible for many of the attrocities they are trying to prevent. Russia vetos absolutely anything that isn’t in their sole interest and prevents the Security Council from being able to successfully vote and act on attrocities being committed. It’s a pathetic and ridiculous situation.
Assad and Putin are getting away with murdering innocent people and the World just sits back and watches saying how awful it is but does nothing about it. This isn’t about the UK and US being World police it’s about the rest of the World acting together to stop this.
Wars happen all over the World I get that but the use of chemical weapons is an absolute attrocity and a war crime which both Putin and Assad are committing and should be held responsible for.
Putin should be on trial in the Hague for plenty of other crimes not just Syria. He should be behind bars not in charge of Russia and doing whatever he wants globally with no retribution. He has taken Russia backwards and to the days of the USSR.
Assad and Putin are getting away with murdering innocent people and the World just sits back and watches saying how awful it is but does nothing about it. This isn’t about the UK and US being World police it’s about the rest of the World acting together to stop this.
Wars happen all over the World I get that but the use of chemical weapons is an absolute attrocity and a war crime which both Putin and Assad are committing and should be held responsible for.
Putin should be on trial in the Hague for plenty of other crimes not just Syria. He should be behind bars not in charge of Russia and doing whatever he wants globally with no retribution. He has taken Russia backwards and to the days of the USSR.
I find it hard to comprehend that we accept the deaths of many hundreds of thousands of civilians via artilery bombardment and barrel bombings (not to mention over 7 million refugees), yet suddenly get irrate over the relatively small number of casualties caused by the use of chemical weapons. This is all BS. We should of acted years ago to stop this carnage. The UN, the West and all civilised countries have completely failed any kind of morality test in Syria.
The ONLY country that comes out of this horror with any dignity is Germany, who at least offered sanctury to the displaced people of that blighted country. The rest of us were too busy making excuses and finding good reasons not to do the right thing. The UK's contribution to all this has been lamentable.
History will not look kindly upon us for this particular episode.
PS if we are going to take military action, then we should do something that might actually make a difference and target Assad.
Last edited by Martin2005; 13 April 2018 at 01:05 AM.
13 April 2018, 01:14 AM
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As Rossy says proof on this is rather dubious: press reporting rumour as fact.
I can make chlorine gas if I want. I did it by accident once (not totally my fault I may add) and that had rolling on the floor coughing unable to breath and temporarily blinded. If I can then any militant organisation can.
I can make chlorine gas if I want. I did it by accident once (not totally my fault I may add) and that had rolling on the floor coughing unable to breath and temporarily blinded. If I can then any militant organisation can.
The press haven't been reporting 'rumours as fact' that's just your latest hobby-horse. They've reported what they have, which is eye witnesses evidence and footage, all of which (at least from what I've seen) has been heavily caveated as 'alleged'.
Syria must have the most surveilled airspace in the world right now. We will know for sure what was in the air in that area at the time of this attack, and exactly where it came from.
The conspiracy theory here just doesn't stack up. The West has done all it can to avoid getting involved in Syria, Trump is clearly not an interventionist, so it's hardly likely that we'd be heading for intervention if there was any doubt, especially given the potential for escalation.
Last edited by Martin2005; 13 April 2018 at 01:29 AM.
13 April 2018, 08:05 AM
#24
Whilst accidently creating chlorine gas, did you also manage to accidently conjure up some to helicopters too?
The press haven't been reporting 'rumours as fact' that's just your latest hobby-horse. They've reported what they have, which is eye witnesses evidence and footage, all of which (at least from what I've seen) has been heavily caveated as 'alleged'.
Syria must have the most surveilled airspace in the world right now. We will know for sure what was in the air in that area at the time of this attack, and exactly where it came from.
The conspiracy theory here just doesn't stack up. The West has done all it can to avoid getting involved in Syria, Trump is clearly not an interventionist, so it's hardly likely that we'd be heading for intervention if there was any doubt, especially given the potential for escalation.
The press haven't been reporting 'rumours as fact' that's just your latest hobby-horse. They've reported what they have, which is eye witnesses evidence and footage, all of which (at least from what I've seen) has been heavily caveated as 'alleged'.
Syria must have the most surveilled airspace in the world right now. We will know for sure what was in the air in that area at the time of this attack, and exactly where it came from.
The conspiracy theory here just doesn't stack up. The West has done all it can to avoid getting involved in Syria, Trump is clearly not an interventionist, so it's hardly likely that we'd be heading for intervention if there was any doubt, especially given the potential for escalation.
May was highly non comittal throughout until yesterday. She started her responses with the words "if". This suggests the PM did not know either. Although some post-interview footage has been edited undermining the context.
It was only yesterday that May has been more committal, using the phrase "All indications suggest" that Assad attacked his own people. Take note of where the quotation marks are because again this is still not 100% comittal. She is being careful with her words for good reason. She also said the regieme, not Assad regieme, although we can be fairly confident that she means one of the same (and not the Russians Lol).
Going back to gassing myself, all I'm saying is a one-second, yes, one second exposure to a chlorine-gas based concoction without initially inhaling rendered me blind, the shock caused me to briefly gasp which then caused a burning sensation in my mouth and nose, next thing I knew I was on the ground barely conscious.
This was from a left-over 250gram Tri-Chlor (not its full name) tablet that a elderly neighbour placed, whilst wet into a unwashed used container that once contained muriactic acid granules with a sealed lid. All I did was open it.
If that's what 250grams is capable of, what would 250kg do? Bearing in mind I can freely buy it in 20kg containers from a EU supermarket. What I'm saying is this chemical weapon is not some complex potion that needs scarce ingredients or a laboratory/factory to make. Distribution can be done via rooftops as it is more than three times denser than air so will settle at street level.
In my opinion: For helicopters to distribute it, it would need to throw or drop incendiary type devices: It could not distribute from the air as the rotors would just blow it away. If helicopters were used, then there will be evidence on the ground. So let's get some inspectors in to see it.
As for the press, well, when you read a report where it says "sources say" early on, it's hard to take anything printed thereafter as anything but suggestive. All I can deduce from them is yes there was gas attacks, yes from the symptoms it 'probably' was chlorine based (we still don't know for sure what gases they were), and yes people are suffering. But beyond that there is little else credible or verifiable to persuade me on the actual perpetrators. As you say it's all "Alledged", it's the best we're going to get, the commentary columns would have you thinking it was more than that, meanwhile the Sun and Express does a write up on Assad's wife!
What is more bizarre and conflicting is the reports in Russia Today (RT)!
13 April 2018, 08:50 AM
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If the west is going to go getting involved in this kind of thing then they really need to do it with a proper sustainable succession plan. Otherwise you just end up with a power vacuum that ISIS/Al Qaeda/The Taliban are all more than happy to filly and they are just as (if not more) unpleasant than the bloke that came before them.
13 April 2018, 08:58 AM
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Yes because encouraging regime change in the middle east has worked out really well so far...
If the west is going to go getting involved in this kind of thing then they really need to do it with a proper sustainable succession plan. Otherwise you just end up with a power vacuum that ISIS/Al Qaeda/The Taliban are all more than happy to filly and they are just as (if not more) unpleasant than the bloke that came before them.
If the west is going to go getting involved in this kind of thing then they really need to do it with a proper sustainable succession plan. Otherwise you just end up with a power vacuum that ISIS/Al Qaeda/The Taliban are all more than happy to filly and they are just as (if not more) unpleasant than the bloke that came before them.
13 April 2018, 09:32 AM
#27
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Ali they dropped the gas in barrel bombs from helicopters.
As for regime change this won't happen without directly getting involved with a war with Russia. Syria is Russia's only foothold in the Middle East where all the major players want a presence. There is no way they are ever going to let Assad be toppled and it's why they are there now propping him up through the civil war ensuring the rebels never succeed. They will not give up their presence in the Middle East so Assad is here to stay all the time Putin is in power or until the US decide to take on Russia head on which I think everyone would agree would lead to a World war and cannot happen. It's already lining up as a World war with Syria/Russia/Iran ready to take on the US/France/UK and Israel and also Turkey is involved as they currently occupy the Syrian town of Afrin which Russia has demanded they hand back and Turkey has said no and will leave Afrin as and when they please. Turkey by taking Afrin attacked the US backed Kurds so that is another conflict the US is dealing with.
The action is to stop the production and use of chemical weapons by targeted missile strikes on the bases the attacks are launched from and the sites the chemicals are manufactured.
I get the point over no action being taken on all the artillery bombardment and airstrikes using conventional weapons but there is no international law being broken as Syria justifies it through being in a civil war. The use of chemical weapons is the only thing the international community has to act on and get involved with as it is a war crime which has been committed on several occasions.
As for regime change this won't happen without directly getting involved with a war with Russia. Syria is Russia's only foothold in the Middle East where all the major players want a presence. There is no way they are ever going to let Assad be toppled and it's why they are there now propping him up through the civil war ensuring the rebels never succeed. They will not give up their presence in the Middle East so Assad is here to stay all the time Putin is in power or until the US decide to take on Russia head on which I think everyone would agree would lead to a World war and cannot happen. It's already lining up as a World war with Syria/Russia/Iran ready to take on the US/France/UK and Israel and also Turkey is involved as they currently occupy the Syrian town of Afrin which Russia has demanded they hand back and Turkey has said no and will leave Afrin as and when they please. Turkey by taking Afrin attacked the US backed Kurds so that is another conflict the US is dealing with.
The action is to stop the production and use of chemical weapons by targeted missile strikes on the bases the attacks are launched from and the sites the chemicals are manufactured.
I get the point over no action being taken on all the artillery bombardment and airstrikes using conventional weapons but there is no international law being broken as Syria justifies it through being in a civil war. The use of chemical weapons is the only thing the international community has to act on and get involved with as it is a war crime which has been committed on several occasions.
Last edited by An0n0m0us; 13 April 2018 at 09:37 AM.
13 April 2018, 09:47 AM
#28
To be honest, I do not believe any of them. I think Assad will do whatever it takes to remain in power and I think the enemy of Assad will do whatever it takes to remove him, regardless of the death toll.
I remember in 2017 when America bombs Syria over the use of Sarin but then MIT disproved that as lies at worst and muddy waters at best
https://off-guardian.org/2017/04/14/...annot-be-true/
I remember in 2017 when America bombs Syria over the use of Sarin but then MIT disproved that as lies at worst and muddy waters at best
https://off-guardian.org/2017/04/14/...annot-be-true/
13 April 2018, 10:10 AM
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To be honest, I do not believe any of them. I think Assad will do whatever it takes to remain in power and I think the enemy of Assad will do whatever it takes to remove him, regardless of the death toll.
I remember in 2017 when America bombs Syria over the use of Sarin but then MIT disproved that as lies at worst and muddy waters at best
https://off-guardian.org/2017/04/14/...annot-be-true/
I remember in 2017 when America bombs Syria over the use of Sarin but then MIT disproved that as lies at worst and muddy waters at best
https://off-guardian.org/2017/04/14/...annot-be-true/
The UN investigation concluded that this was carried out by the Assad regime.