If a cyclist comes up your left and you turn left and hit them its your fault
07 August 2017, 07:03 PM
#1
If a cyclist comes up your left and you turn left and hit them its your fault
...the law has changed/been clarified to this effect , presumably to make car drivers more careful ,so.... be careful,us people with licenses have to keep an eye out for those who may not,and may have poor 'roadcraft', and that seems like a small price to pay for safety 
just a warning folks.
just a warning folks.
07 August 2017, 08:37 PM
#2
as long as you are indicating before they pass the rear of your car then you are fine, turning in at the last second is just cun tish, as a biker it happens a lot, and with bikes having even less respect on the road, I guess it happens even more to them.
07 August 2017, 08:37 PM
#3
Your fault doesn't mean points on your license it just means they can probably put a claim against you. That's still going to be hard as they will need hard evidence.
I think they should stop trying to argue with nearly two tons of moving metal, the amount of times I see cyclist on the road when there are dedicated cycle paths to the side. Head cams can show what happens but they can't stop serious injuries
I think they should stop trying to argue with nearly two tons of moving metal, the amount of times I see cyclist on the road when there are dedicated cycle paths to the side. Head cams can show what happens but they can't stop serious injuries
07 August 2017, 08:43 PM
#4
This sort of thing happened on my wedding day... we were stuck in traffic on way to the station. Mother decides **** it shes gonna walk its only couple of hundred yards so she opens passenger door to get out... BAM cyclist hits the door head on.. he was going flat out down the 18 inch gap between the cars and the curb... unfortunately he lived to put a claim in. Cos the father in law 3000 quid. Nice end to the day.
07 August 2017, 08:55 PM
#5
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Yes, they'll bleat about being given 2.5 metres of space when you overtake them but will quite happily squeeze down a gap a fraction of that width when they are going through stationary traffic. 
07 August 2017, 09:22 PM
#7
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You know there's a pretty substantial difference between the two scenarios right?
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07 August 2017, 10:05 PM
#8
sorry my mistake it was just a proposal , may happen though.....
07 August 2017, 10:24 PM
#9
Well many many moons ago I overtook a cyclist and turned left, he got a wobble on and fell off his bike... I never touched him and had witnesses to prove it... even a security guard that saw everything and said I was no where near him and never even got close... he had a good 30m.
Insurance company were having none of it as I never hit him... magistrate said otherwise despite witness statements.
I ended up having to pay around £300.
To be fair I was going a little fast and he wasn't the best of riders, I think I startled him and he hit a grate.. which was what I told the magistrate (not the startled bit obviously) at the time I thought he was a c u n t but with hindsight and an older head... I think it was a 50/50 and he probably wouldn't have fallen off if A; he was a better rider and B; I'd not gone past him at that moment... I should have just waited for him really.
P.S we worked at the same place and he would have been making the same turn.
Flame suit on.
Insurance company were having none of it as I never hit him... magistrate said otherwise despite witness statements.
I ended up having to pay around £300.
To be fair I was going a little fast and he wasn't the best of riders, I think I startled him and he hit a grate.. which was what I told the magistrate (not the startled bit obviously) at the time I thought he was a c u n t but with hindsight and an older head... I think it was a 50/50 and he probably wouldn't have fallen off if A; he was a better rider and B; I'd not gone past him at that moment... I should have just waited for him really.
P.S we worked at the same place and he would have been making the same turn.
Flame suit on.
07 August 2017, 11:37 PM
#10
Well many many moons ago I overtook a cyclist and turned left, he got a wobble on and fell off his bike... I never touched him and had witnesses to prove it... even a security guard that saw everything and said I was no where near him and never even got close... he had a good 30m.
Insurance company were having none of it as I never hit him... magistrate said otherwise despite witness statements.
I ended up having to pay around £300.
To be fair I was going a little fast and he wasn't the best of riders, I think I startled him and he hit a grate.. which was what I told the magistrate (not the startled bit obviously) at the time I thought he was a c u n t but with hindsight and an older head... I think it was a 50/50 and he probably wouldn't have fallen off if A; he was a better rider and B; I'd not gone past him at that moment... I should have just waited for him really.
P.S we worked at the same place and he would have been making the same turn.
Flame suit on.
Insurance company were having none of it as I never hit him... magistrate said otherwise despite witness statements.
I ended up having to pay around £300.
To be fair I was going a little fast and he wasn't the best of riders, I think I startled him and he hit a grate.. which was what I told the magistrate (not the startled bit obviously) at the time I thought he was a c u n t but with hindsight and an older head... I think it was a 50/50 and he probably wouldn't have fallen off if A; he was a better rider and B; I'd not gone past him at that moment... I should have just waited for him really.
P.S we worked at the same place and he would have been making the same turn.
Flame suit on.
08 August 2017, 06:54 AM
#11
More impatient, inconsiderate driving and I wasn't breaking the speed limit... 
but I was 18 at the time so not going to try and pretend I was some sort of angel.
My point was more about what the law says and what happens in practice.
With hindsight I've already admitted I should have just waited and there would of been no case to answer... but that's easily said after the event... also the situation could have been a lot worse had he cracked his scull on the curb... as it turned out he just had a bit of road rash and mild bruising... he did milk it a bit though... later discovered he was the sort to do that sort of thing and a bit work shy... where there's blame there's a claim.
On a plus note... it taught me to stay well clear of cyclists and just have a little more regard and patience for other road users... it's not worth the hassle or expense... that £300 was the best part of 3 weeks wages 33yrs ago.
but I was 18 at the time so not going to try and pretend I was some sort of angel.My point was more about what the law says and what happens in practice.
With hindsight I've already admitted I should have just waited and there would of been no case to answer... but that's easily said after the event... also the situation could have been a lot worse had he cracked his scull on the curb... as it turned out he just had a bit of road rash and mild bruising... he did milk it a bit though... later discovered he was the sort to do that sort of thing and a bit work shy... where there's blame there's a claim.
On a plus note... it taught me to stay well clear of cyclists and just have a little more regard and patience for other road users... it's not worth the hassle or expense... that £300 was the best part of 3 weeks wages 33yrs ago.
Last edited by ditchmyster; 08 August 2017 at 07:01 AM.
08 August 2017, 08:36 AM
#12
More impatient, inconsiderate driving and I wasn't breaking the speed limit... but I was 18 at the time so not going to try and pretend I was some sort of angel.
My point was more about what the law says and what happens in practice.
With hindsight I've already admitted I should have just waited and there would of been no case to answer... but that's easily said after the event... also the situation could have been a lot worse had he cracked his scull on the curb... as it turned out he just had a bit of road rash and mild bruising... he did milk it a bit though... later discovered he was the sort to do that sort of thing and a bit work shy... where there's blame there's a claim.
On a plus note... it taught me to stay well clear of cyclists and just have a little more regard and patience for other road users... it's not worth the hassle or expense... that £300 was the best part of 3 weeks wages 33yrs ago.
but I was 18 at the time so not going to try and pretend I was some sort of angel.My point was more about what the law says and what happens in practice.
With hindsight I've already admitted I should have just waited and there would of been no case to answer... but that's easily said after the event... also the situation could have been a lot worse had he cracked his scull on the curb... as it turned out he just had a bit of road rash and mild bruising... he did milk it a bit though... later discovered he was the sort to do that sort of thing and a bit work shy... where there's blame there's a claim.
On a plus note... it taught me to stay well clear of cyclists and just have a little more regard and patience for other road users... it's not worth the hassle or expense... that £300 was the best part of 3 weeks wages 33yrs ago.
I see this driving behaviour every day from the majority of drivers. All they want to do is get passed the slow(in comparison) moving cyclist. This is where most of the careless/dangerous driving comes from. I taught my kids to drive and drummed into them, the first thing they do when seeing a cyclist is take your foot off the throttle. This immediately alters the mindset to continue at current speed to get by. Alter your speed by braking and look for the space to pass by whilst on the other side of the road, slower as not to cause a wind blast from the car.
A friend of mine had to go to a speed awareness course, the subject of overtaking cyclists came up. The police officer summed up the correct manoeuvre, by saying "overtake a cyclist like you would overtake a horse and rider"
You just don't know how good or bad a cyclist is and whether your close overtake will spook/frighten them, even if you don't hit them you could make them fall into the path of the following vehicle
Last edited by andy97; 10 August 2017 at 07:52 AM.
08 August 2017, 06:22 PM
#14
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08 August 2017, 07:32 PM
#15
I always had the mindset of a car driver when I was cycling i.e don't undertake or if you do, suffer the consequences
08 August 2017, 10:18 PM
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08 August 2017, 10:43 PM
#19
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I think society in general is to blame.It now seems that everyone has the right to pursue their life in whatever form that may take & woe betide anyone who gets in their way or delays them.I can't count the number of times I have let people out or stopped to allow on-coming traffic come through when they have the right of way & people sound their horns or pull out & overtake.Surely not everyone is on a life & death mission where 30-60 secs is going to make a massive difference to their life.Just chill the f**k out people.
08 August 2017, 11:00 PM
#20
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The problem with drivers who leave 6' between you and them is it does annoys the cars behind cos waiting ( not what you need as cyclist ).
Together with no slipstream affect
Together with no slipstream affect
09 August 2017, 08:39 AM
#21
I think society in general is to blame.It now seems that everyone has the right to pursue their life in whatever form that may take & woe betide anyone who gets in their way or delays them.I can't count the number of times I have let people out or stopped to allow on-coming traffic come through when they have the right of way & people sound their horns or pull out & overtake.Surely not everyone is on a life & death mission where 30-60 secs is going to make a massive difference to their life.Just chill the f**k out people.
Impatient, take life a little easier, everyone will be happier
09 August 2017, 08:53 AM
#22
09 August 2017, 11:09 AM
#26
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but it wouldn't be a good thread about cyclists without someone saying "they don't pay road tax". Even if it is a wholely inaccurate statement.
09 August 2017, 01:45 PM
#28
The OP makes out the cyclist is undertaking and both causing the issue and them blaming the poor motorist, but that's not what the BBC article appears to be saying.
Not going to get into a debate about undertaking*, but there is a list on that article where the first 4 items suggest this is actually being considered because of motorists overtaking without due consideration and not cyclists undertaking.
If a car was in the left lane going slow and I overtook, then pulled back left and immediately into a side road causing the slow car to have to take avoiding action, no one would worry as that's being cut up and everyone agrees it's wrong. Subsitute slow car for cyclist and suddenly some people are all up in arms.
*FWIW I am always cautious that as a cyclist undertaking slow/stopped traffic, I am in a environment where someone can suddenly turn left out of that traffic at last minute - so always cautious as I am in no doubt I'll come off worse, regardless who is right or wrong.
Not going to get into a debate about undertaking*, but there is a list on that article where the first 4 items suggest this is actually being considered because of motorists overtaking without due consideration and not cyclists undertaking.
If a car was in the left lane going slow and I overtook, then pulled back left and immediately into a side road causing the slow car to have to take avoiding action, no one would worry as that's being cut up and everyone agrees it's wrong. Subsitute slow car for cyclist and suddenly some people are all up in arms.
*FWIW I am always cautious that as a cyclist undertaking slow/stopped traffic, I am in a environment where someone can suddenly turn left out of that traffic at last minute - so always cautious as I am in no doubt I'll come off worse, regardless who is right or wrong.
09 August 2017, 07:58 PM
#29
If I think a cyclist may be approaching my van when I'm stopping at lights I always stop right next to the curb so there is no room to sneak past me unless they go on the path and I have no issue with that cause that way I know where they are
Last edited by stevebt; 09 August 2017 at 07:59 PM.
09 August 2017, 10:38 PM
#30