Speeding Fines - heads up - ScoobyNet.com - Subaru Enthusiast Forum



Non Scooby Related Anything Non-Scooby related

Speeding Fines - heads up

Reply
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 19 April 2017, 01:37 PM   #1
Felix.
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,517
Default Speeding Fines - heads up

Just to make you aware, the fines for speeding are soon going to be based on a percentage of your earnings and not just a single figure.

Watch the speedo!
Felix. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 01:41 PM   #2
andy97
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Api 500+bhp MD321T @91dB Probably SN's longest owner of an Impreza Turbo
Posts: 4,395
Default

AFAIK it is for court appearance speeding. Most of the offences will be offered a SAC, because the police keep this money, which isn't the case if the offence is sent to the magistrates
andy97 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 01:43 PM   #3
Tidgy
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Notts
Posts: 20,817
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy97 View Post
AFAIK it is for court appearance speeding. Most of the offences will be offered a SAC, because the police keep this money, which isn't the case if the offence is sent to the magistrates
You sure? Derby constabulary was claiming yesterday they don't keep the money.
Tidgy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 03:27 PM   #4
andy97
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Api 500+bhp MD321T @91dB Probably SN's longest owner of an Impreza Turbo
Posts: 4,395
Default

The government about 5 years ago changed the way safety camera partnerships were funded. Instead of money from fines going to the local council (which were part of the SCP), it went direct to central government.. Local councils then had to fund the SCP out of their budgets. Miraculously the explosion of new cameras stopped overnight.

A get out clause was that payments for driver awareness courses needn't be paid to central government, the local councils could keep this. That is why the police relaxed the levels for speeding in which they offered SAC.

I have not fully research ed the funding for this new initiative for speeding fines, but a few comments on motoring news mentioned that these increased fines were for magistrate cases. In fact it was always the case that you should fill in a earnings form if you went to court and when found guilty they would levy a fine on available income. Most people just forgot to fill in the form so standard tariffs were virtually always applied.
andy97 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 03:30 PM   #5
ZANY
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: ....
Posts: 3,836
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix. View Post
Just to make you aware, the fines for speeding are soon going to be based on a percentage of your earnings and not just a single figure.

Watch the speedo!
Good news
shouldn't be speeding in first place anyway imo
ZANY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 09:03 PM   #6
markjmd
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,613
Default

It's one of the fundamental principles of our justice system that we're all equal before the law (or at least supposed to be), so it's hard to find this move anything other than loathsome and cynical. Just to add also, the argument that the better-off weren't put off by the existing penalties for speeding because they could easily afford the fines doesn't wash either, as ability to pay makes **** all difference to the points that also get dished out.
markjmd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 11:04 PM   #7
Uncle Creepy
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Chewing the fat
Posts: 983
Default

Absolutely.
Uncle Creepy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 11:12 PM   #8
scoobyboy1
Supporting Member
iTrader: (16)
 
scoobyboy1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Willenhall, West Midlands
Posts: 7,617
Default

Thats OK then, so my missus wont have to pay a penny as she earns fu6k all!!!
scoobyboy1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 April 2017, 11:37 PM   #9
Fabioso
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,114
Default

For many scenarios there is still a maximum fine applied and so for many people it makes absolutely no difference...........in fact you could argue it impacts people on lower incomes more because the maximum thresholds prevent high earners from paying a fine truly relative to their income.
Fabioso is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20 April 2017, 07:17 AM   #10
andy97
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Api 500+bhp MD321T @91dB Probably SN's longest owner of an Impreza Turbo
Posts: 4,395
Default

These are for court summarily convictions

taken from here. https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk...-revised-2017/

Boy/girl racers could end up with a huge fine/ban!

Steps 1 and 2 – Determining the offence seriousness

The starting point applies to all offenders irrespective of plea or previous convictions.

Speed limit (mph) Recorded speed (mph)
20 41 and above 31 – 40 21 – 30
30 51 and above 41 – 50 31 – 40
40 66 and above 56 – 65 41 – 55
50 76 and above 66 – 75 51 – 65
60 91 and above 81 – 90 61 – 80
70 101 and above 91 – 100 71 – 90
Sentencing range Band C fine Band B fine Band A fine

Points/disqualification Disqualify 7 – 56 days OR 6 points Disqualify 7 – 28
days OR 4 – 6 points 3 points

Must endorse and may disqualify. If no disqualification impose 3 – 6 points


Where an offender is driving grossly in excess of the speed limit the court should consider a disqualification in excess of 56 days.
Band ranges
Starting point Range
Fine Band A 50% of relevant weekly income 25 – 75% of relevant weekly income
Fine Band B 100% of relevant weekly income 75 – 125% of relevant weekly income
Fine Band C 150% of relevant weekly income 125 – 175% of relevant weekly income
Fine Band D 250% of relevant weekly income 200 – 300% of relevant weekly income
Fine Band E 400% of relevant weekly income 300 – 500% of relevant weekly income
Fine Band F 600% of relevant weekly income 500 – 700% of relevant weekly income

Last edited by andy97; 20 April 2017 at 07:21 AM.
andy97 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20 April 2017, 09:25 PM   #11
skoobidude
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,612
Default

I had a speeding ticket last Oct, it's taken them 5 months to process and I finally received a letter a couple of weeks ago. Within the letter I get a choice of pleading guilty or not guilty either on-line, by post or go to court. It also asked about my earnings which I was surprised about given the offence was commited last Oct.
If I receive a fine based on the new rules then I will appeal as imo they should only apply to offences that are committed post new legislation.

Clean licence for over 20yrs. Oops!
Nick
skoobidude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 07:46 AM   #12
ZANY
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: ....
Posts: 3,836
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobidude View Post
I had a speeding ticket last Oct, it's taken them 5 months to process and I finally received a letter a couple of weeks ago. Within the letter I get a choice of pleading guilty or not guilty either on-line, by post or go to court. It also asked about my earnings which I was surprised about given the offence was commited last Oct.
If I receive a fine based on the new rules then I will appeal as imo they should only apply to offences that are committed post new legislation.

Clean licence for over 20yrs. Oops!
Nick
Hope you weren't speeding too much pal as then they might give you one of them awareness courses and no points fingers crosses pal ....
ZANY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 08:31 AM   #13
pimmo2000
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (6)
 
pimmo2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: On a small Island near France
Posts: 14,403
Default

Age old question from me .. why are there no speed cameras outside schools, shopping areas, playgrounds etc? they are all on long open road were speeding it less risky but more people are likely to do it .. Oooooh it's not about saving lives
pimmo2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 11:28 AM   #14
ZANY
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: ....
Posts: 3,836
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pimmo2000 View Post
Age old question from me .. why are there no speed cameras outside schools, shopping areas, playgrounds etc? they are all on long open road were speeding it less risky but more people are likely to do it .. Oooooh it's not about saving lives
Excellent point indeed

+1 LIKE
ZANY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 12:08 PM   #15
^Qwerty^
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: East Yorkshire
Posts: 1,557
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pimmo2000 View Post
Age old question from me .. why are there no speed cameras outside schools, shopping areas, playgrounds etc? they are all on long open road were speeding it less risky but more people are likely to do it .. Oooooh it's not about saving lives
So when a driver sees a speed camera, chances are they will take their eyes off the road and look at their speedo? I'm sure most people would not want that happening outside schools, playgrounds etc. so putting up a camera outside a school, especially at around 9 and 3:30 is probably a bad idea.

Having said that, you'd be lucky to do 2mph past the local schools around here at arriving and kicking out time, it's chaos.
^Qwerty^ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 12:15 PM   #16
pimmo2000
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (6)
 
pimmo2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: On a small Island near France
Posts: 14,403
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ^Qwerty^ View Post
So when a driver sees a speed camera, chances are they will take their eyes off the road and look at their speedo? I'm sure most people would not want that happening outside schools, playgrounds etc. so putting up a camera outside a school, especially at around 9 and 3:30 is probably a bad idea.

Having said that, you'd be lucky to do 2mph past the local schools around here at arriving and kicking out time, it's chaos.
What an odd argument, you considered checking your speed to be more of a risk than speeding?
pimmo2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 12:15 PM   #17
neil-h
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Berks
Posts: 3,893
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pimmo2000 View Post
Age old question from me .. why are there no speed cameras outside schools, shopping areas, playgrounds etc? they are all on long open road were speeding it less risky but more people are likely to do it .. Oooooh it's not about saving lives
I see you're open straight roads and raise you a camera van I've seen parked in the same layby twice now, said layby is just behind a couple of trees and some large bushes on the inside of a left hand bend. So the van parks right in the corner and you can't see it till you're right on top of it. I'm in half a mind to try and snap a photo of it and see how TVP explain it 'cus it's clearly there for revenue making.
neil-h is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 12:35 PM   #18
Paben
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Taken to the hills
Posts: 2,520
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobidude View Post
I had a speeding ticket last Oct, it's taken them 5 months to process and I finally received a letter a couple of weeks ago. Within the letter I get a choice of pleading guilty or not guilty either on-line, by post or go to court. It also asked about my earnings which I was surprised about given the offence was commited last Oct.
If I receive a fine based on the new rules then I will appeal as imo they should only apply to offences that are committed post new legislation.

Clean licence for over 20yrs. Oops!
Nick

This was obviousy not a fixed penalty notice so probably comes under the Single Justice Procedure, which allows a single magistrate to deal with it rather than the usual three. It can take up to six months to issue the summons, assuming you were stopped and warned by the police. If you're guilty then pleading so by post is supposed to reduce the fine by 33%. The eventual fine is based on your earnings and savings, plus court costs. If you plead not guilty and choose to go to court then best contact a specialist solicitor first as this can be a costly mistake.
Paben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 12:53 PM   #19
Turbohot
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 48,540
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pimmo2000 View Post
Age old question from me .. why are there no speed cameras outside schools, shopping areas, playgrounds etc? they are all on long open road were speeding it less risky but more people are likely to do it .. Oooooh it's not about saving lives
+2.

I've just heard a talk on R4 and agree with what was said by someone that the fines aren't deterrent but punishment; that's after the crime has been committed. Static but functioning speed cameras are the preventative solution.

My advice to all-n-sundry is that stay mindful, ALWAYS drive within the law regardless, and DON'T give the authorities the satisfaction of pinching any penny from you. That should make them see their @rse. That's what I do, these days.
Turbohot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 12:56 PM   #20
boggissimo
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Kent
Posts: 205
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by markjmd View Post
It's one of the fundamental principles of our justice system that we're all equal before the law (or at least supposed to be), so it's hard to find this move anything other than loathsome and cynical. Just to add also, the argument that the better-off weren't put off by the existing penalties for speeding because they could easily afford the fines doesn't wash either, as ability to pay makes **** all difference to the points that also get dished out.
Ability to pay does make quite a difference to the amount you can spend on legal advice/representation though! In an ideal world those without the means to get legal assistance would have it provided free, but that doesn't happen any more.
boggissimo is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 01:03 PM   #21
Felix.
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,517
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by boggissimo View Post
Ability to pay does make quite a difference to the amount you can spend on legal advice/representation though! In an ideal world those without the means to get legal assistance would have it provided free, but that doesn't happen any more.
You can still get initial free legal advice - citizens advice bureau and public defender service to name but a few
Felix. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 01:05 PM   #22
Felix.
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,517
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbohot View Post
+2.

My advice to all-n-sundry is that stay mindful, ALWAYS drive within the law regardless, .
I agree with that
Felix. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 01:11 PM   #23
Felix.
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,517
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pimmo2000 View Post
Age old question from me .. why are there no speed cameras outside schools, shopping areas, playgrounds etc? they are all on long open road were speeding it less risky but more people are likely to do it .. Oooooh it's not about saving lives
As above in the reply - most people drive sensibly past schools, shops etc and statistics from the area will probably show a very low injury record for people on that stretch of road and no complaints from local residents of speeding or dangerous driving. Lets face it, you'll be lucky to get to 10mph or most days due to the traffic.

Its on the long open roads where more accidents will happen - and increasing speeds will increase the injury or death potential of all concerned.
Felix. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 02:09 PM   #24
Turbohot
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 48,540
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix. View Post
I agree with that
Yes, Felix. People should be so law abiding that their abidance should make the Police redundant. It can't totally happen because there's always going to be the ones with their responses in reverse gear.

Normally, it's not hard not to speed. Actually, it's really simple to stick to speed limits.

I felt like a right loser among a bunch of losers when I had to attend a Speed Awareness course. Since then, my obliviously committed speeding offences have completely stopped. You know, shaming people works as the best deterrent.
Turbohot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 02:33 PM   #25
Paben
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Taken to the hills
Posts: 2,520
Default

Speeding is endemic in the UK. You only have to drive down any reasonably clear motorway at a steady 70mph to prove it. You will be passed by almost everything other than trucks and grannies. Many cars will be exceeding 90, sometimes by a fair margin but with little chance of being caught. How dangerous such driving may be is open to debate as there seem to be relatively few accidents on our motorways per car/per mile driven, but when they occur they tend to be spectacular and serious.
Paben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 02:41 PM   #26
ZANY
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: ....
Posts: 3,836
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbohot View Post

I felt like a right loser among a bunch of losers when I had to attend a Speed Awareness course.
That makes 2 of us sis
better than 3points but I think they gave me the option as I was only over 3mph in a 50 zone!! And it was my first ever motoring offence I've not even had a parking ticket till this day

There's a reason why there are tracks and drag strips etc no need for speed just plan your journey with extra time and be patient and enjoy the green green grass around you
ZANY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 03:10 PM   #27
Turbohot
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 48,540
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paben View Post
Speeding is endemic in the UK. You only have to drive down any reasonably clear motorway at a steady 70mph to prove it. You will be passed by almost everything other than trucks and grannies. Many cars will be exceeding 90, sometimes by a fair margin but with little chance of being caught. How dangerous such driving may be is open to debate as there seem to be relatively few accidents on our motorways per car/per mile driven, but when they occur they tend to be spectacular and serious.
Frankly, if you are driving within the speed limit at a steady 67 to 70 mph on a motorway, then, not just the lorries and the actual grannies in the slow lane, but you will also be classed a granny by the law breaking majority that is bombing past you. Some of them are such bullies that they keep flashing at you to move out of their ways on any road, not just on the motorways. These bullies should also be fined for bullying. Most of us now have dash cams. Their bullying should be taken seriously, they should be traced and punished. They are potentially very hazardous on the roads.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZANY View Post
That makes 2 of us sis
better than 3points but I think they gave me the option as I was only over 3mph in a 50 zone!! And it was my first ever motoring offence I've not even had a parking ticket till this day

There's a reason why there are tracks and drag strips etc no need for speed just plan your journey with extra time and be patient and enjoy the green green grass around you
Zani bro, some of the ones on my course were repeat offenders! They told me that they keep coming back on this course every 3 years like a bad breath! I mean, what's wrong with them?? Are they de-ranged and so thick-skinned that being put among other 30 completely stranger losers doesn't make them think that they need to become more aware of their speed? Honest to God! Why is it so difficult for them not to speed FFS???

Let me also tell you that only one loser in the group was under 30, I was the only loser in 40-50 range, all other loser crims were well over 60. Made me think that perhaps younger under 25s are better drivers than this older, OCD bunch. Then again, perhaps under 25 law breakers could have already been banned, jailed or were forced to pay humungous fines with losing humungous number of points on their licence; for their more serious offences- hence not on that Speed Awareness course, which is considered to be a gentle slap on the wrist.
Turbohot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 03:28 PM   #28
ZANY
Scooby Regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: ....
Posts: 3,836
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbohot View Post



Zani bro, some of the ones on my course were repeat offenders! They told me that they keep coming back on this course every 3 years like a bad breath! I mean, what's wrong with them?? Are they de-ranged and so thick-skinned that being put among other 30 completely stranger losers doesn't make them think that they need to become more aware of their speed? Honest to God! Why is it so difficult for them not to speed FFS???

Let me also tell you that only one loser in the group was under 30, I was the only loser in 40-50 range, all other loser crims were well over 60. Made me think that perhaps younger under 25s are better drivers than this older, OCD bunch. Then again, perhaps under 25 law breakers could have already been banned, jailed or were forced to pay humungous fines with losing humungous number of points on their licence; for their more serious offences- hence not on that Speed Awareness course, which is considered to be a gentle slap on the wrist.


If it was me I would make new law for repeat offenders to have a tag on there licenses' so they can't get insurance anywhere else but a DVLA government run type insurance so the cash goes back on the roads and black box put on any motor the are driving this way they are more dangled by the 2veg/2melonz they might just learn there lesson then
Having 2 disabled kids in wheelchairs I wouldn't wish it upon anyone to have there child run over or killed especially with summer time coming up please think before ....
ZANY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 06:14 PM   #29
markjmd
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,613
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pimmo2000 View Post
Age old question from me .. why are there no speed cameras outside schools, shopping areas, playgrounds etc? they are all on long open road were speeding it less risky but more people are likely to do it .. Oooooh it's not about saving lives
I know for a fact that at least some of them are, as the very first time I was ever flashed by a Gatso (almost 20 years ago now) was right outside a school. In my defence, I'll add that it was 3 o'clock in the morning at the time, so in reality I was no more putting kids at risk there than I would have been driving down any other completely deserted road elsewhere in town.
markjmd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 April 2017, 06:25 PM   #30
markjmd
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,613
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbohot View Post
Yes, Felix. People should be so law abiding that their abidance should make the Police redundant. It can't totally happen because there's always going to be the ones with their responses in reverse gear.

Normally, it's not hard not to speed. Actually, it's really simple to stick to speed limits.


I felt like a right loser among a bunch of losers when I had to attend a Speed Awareness course. Since then, my obliviously committed speeding offences have completely stopped. You know, shaming people works as the best deterrent.
I would say there are some exceptions to this. Increasingly on rural or semi-urban B-roads and single-lane A-roads, there are non-standard limits applied on various stretches, and when you combine that with sparse use of reminder signs, it can sometimes be genuinely difficult to know what the limit actually is. I'm not sure if it's currently compulsory that reminder signs should be positioned a set distance before all camera sites, but it certainly should be.
markjmd is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:51 PM.


 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: