lozgti1

Such an angry thread.lol

joz8968

iTrader: (13)

lol

hodgy0_2

is this a serious post !!!!!

lozgti1

There are a comical 2673 posts so far . So add me to the list of nutters and pretend politicians

lozgti1

2672. Jos is a sensible head so knocking that post off the mad count.

Reminds me of that advert 'We won't make a drama out of a crisis'

Scoobynet will !

hodgy0_2

sure - I will add you to the Flat earthers thread

joz8968

iTrader: (13)

lozgti1

lozgti1

lol Chill !

It's only the economy

lozgti1

Oh **** it. I am becoming embroiled in the nuttiness. Argh.lol

dpb

Brexit: ‘taking back’ what we had never lost, in order to lose everything we had...

joz8968

iTrader: (13)

Love the word nuttiness.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

LoL @ the angry people, they've gone and pigeon-holed you

In real terms...what's our inflation going to be?
And what loss in GDP will there be? Growth, unemployment etc.

Worse than 2008? 1990?

Are we going to have 20%+ inflation like the 70's? If the angry people say 'yes' or say it's going to be worse...why haven't you left the UK yet? You can buy a hell of a lot of house near a beautiful European city for the price of a shabby London flat

And before I get pigeon holed as a ostrich or whatever, I am seriously considering emigration. Although somewhat difficult as the city I live near is currently booming, whilst the places in Europe I'd like to move to are stagnating, yet according to the majority of this thread leaving the EU should be putting us back into the 70's or worse, so do I sell short or ride the waves?

BMWhere?

Who knows how bad or good it will be, its just an unnecessary risk because the EU was never the problem. The lack of inward investment in affordable housing, schools, hospitals, infrastructure etc. is the real problem in the UK and leaving the EU is not a solution.


A big part of the equation of being worse off is the value of the pound. The weak pound post Brexit is already driving inflation, making imports, in particular food, more expensive and the const of foreign travel has gone through the roof - not just the travel costs, but the cost of everything when you're there!


Then there are the other risks to your way of life. Holiday entitlement, working hours, job security and other workers rights/benefits which are likely to be cut to lower the employment costs so we can be competitive on a global market against the likes of China.


Then there is the likely sell off of the NHS to american companies and you'll need expensive private health insurance. If you're lucky we might get "Boris-Care" for affordable healthcare with drastically reduced service!


The hardline Brexiteers in the Conservative party have a vision for exactly this! The things they don't like about the EU is the workers rights which prevents the UK becoming the pure capitalist nation like the US which they greedily dream of.


The EU has its problems, but in the most part it works and has made the UK and the rest of Europe much more affluent over the past 40 years. We're giving that up to become more like the US or China!


As for the angry people leaving, well it seems to me the angry people are the ones who voted for Brexit, not the remainers! The remainers are more sad and disappointed than angry! I left a long time before Brexit and have seen the UK deteriorating since I left. Living elsewhere in the EU, you can appreciate the benefits of the EU much more and you also have a direct comparison of how things can be done differently and work better. That's not to say that everything in Germany is perfect, but the balance that results in quality of life and general happiness is better here.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Good that you made the jump. I've procrastinated far too much, there was the issue in 2008 where if I had made the jump, returning back the UK in terms of property costs would have been financial suicide. The exchange rate now is the biggest hurdle financially, but as with any other financial constraints via the economy's health. It would be prudent to say there will be a need to adapt, certainly though moaning about it won't change that.

I'm with you on the UK's lack of investment on a wide scale of issues. It's my main push factor to get out of here. Having a few friends die on me focuses the mind on balances of staying or going.

I lost my faith in NHS years ago...I actually have a private healthcare plan. It's no guarantee though as its still reliant on the NHS for first point of contact as well as other bits and bobs: GPs and A&E...both of which are falling to pieces are inescapable regardless of the care plan. Something has to be done, and if privatisation is the only viable way, then so be it 'free for all' to me always seemed like 'one size fits all', for some it fits great, for others not so good.

Ps. I'm sat in an airport departure lounge due to the bloody French striking AGAIN

BMWhere?

The choice to move anywhere is not an easy one and moving abroad is an even bigger step and not to be underestimated. For me it was a great move and I've never looked back, but I know many other people who have really struggled leaving family and friends behind and often return after six months or a year.


That's what gets me the most about the whole anti-immigration, Daily Mail propaganda in the UK. They make out that all those immigrants are coming over just to claim benefits etc. (which is clearly not why they come), but they never tell the story about the hard and brave decisions those immigrants have to make to leave their family, friends and everything they know behind to go and work in a different country, speaking a different language and having to deal with regular encounters of racial prejudice. And since Brexit, the atmosphere for immigrants in the UK has only got a lot worse!


I have full respect for anyone who is brave enough to give it a go. Be it Brits leaving the UK or other nationalities going to the UK. Even if it doesn't work out for them, I know what a tough decision they have taken and how brave they have been to give life in another country a go!

JTaylor

mrtheedge2u2

^^^ This. Holland is not a utopia....but, my God, the quality of life is far above anything I ever had in Manchester.

hodgy0_2

yes its almost as if our lords and masters - the Rees Moggs of the world want to return to the era of serfdom, indentured workers who can't leave for opportunities in the wider world, tied to their lords and masters - ready to be exploited by zero hour contracts etc etc (often illegal in other parts of eth EU)

FOM was a two way street and undoubtedly has helped some of the lesser well off in the UK get better opportunities in the wider EU

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Italy is looking interesting at the moment. It would be nice if we could all our own affairs sorted before that lot implodes. Wishful thinking, I know.

andy97

iTrader: (1)

God help us!

BMWhere?

So, that's one less argument for Brexit:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44293265

Who'd have thought it; if EU rules aren't working quite as intended, then they can be changed

andy97

iTrader: (1)

Too little too late.

Looking forward to leaving

dpb

That special relationship will get us through brexit

https://www.theguardian.com/business...ada-and-mexico

dpb

Who do we sell to now ?

China ?? lol

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

At least our steel has a known purity; China adds all sorts to side step taxation so it can be sold as an alloy. It used to be boron (until that got taxed), which if welded can cause weakness....This is in rebar used for concrete structures...think about that bridge that collapsed in Florida.

mrtheedge2u2

Read a mind boggling story this morning....Nigel Lawson (who chaired the Brexit campaign) has applied for permanent residency in France. He stated "I love Europe. That is why I live in France".

He is basically just gone "I want the UK to leave the EU but I will not be left paying for it". I do hope the French government refuse his application.

dpb

That bridge collapse reeks time/cost savings as much as material failure

Dingdongler

Investment in infrastructure is without doubt an issue. However the millions that have emigrated here over the last ten years are one of the reasons why our infrastructure is creaking.

The lack of school, GP places, hospital beds etc.

A significant proportion of the immigrants from the last ten years don't pay enough tax to allow the investment to take place. They are a net drain even if they increase the nominal GDP numbers.

A net drain because they will never pay enough tax to make up for their hospital treatment, school places etc. They will receive housing benefit, child benefit etc.

Iirc a school place for a child costs circa £10k per year. So a family with 3 kids would have to pay £30k in tax a year just to be neutral for their school costs alone How many of the low skilled immigrants do you think pay that amount of tax.

And yes I do understand that I have only used one kind of demographic for my example but its worth bearing in mind

So yes, investment in infrastructure has been lacking but an influx of low skilled migrants has been a part of the problem, not the solution.

dpb

What about just poor people generally , how much are they costing?.

It looks like 6 k per child here

https://feweek.co.uk/wp-content/uplo...ing.pdf#page13