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Just saw Farage on the news, it's fair to say he's displeased.😀
No matter what else happens, that alone has made my day
There was some idiot on Question Time last night who was upset as we had "voted to leave the EU and stop paying all this money". Obviously he didn't read the question on that ballot paper......
It's perfectly valid to leave the EU and continue to pay for the access we have now, under the terms of the referendum as it was posed.
Is it mostly people who cannot read who voted Leave?
I think this is an unhelpful way of phrasing it tbh (although I am sure quite a few in the EU/Europe just want us to fvck off - we has a special deal inside the EU and now seem to want a special deal outside)
TH EU is a rules based institution - which is needed to create a SM
what the EU through Barnier have constantly said is that we can't have the benefits i.e. frictionless trade with the EU without abiding by the regulations
here is the text of his speech he made yesterday - as a precursorr to what May will say today
the crucial bit is here where he says
"At midnight on 29 March 2019, the United Kingdom will leave the European Union and will become a third country. This is the UK's sovereign decision. It must be respected."
the concept of a "third country" has a specific legal meaning and if you don't know the implications of what it means I suggest you look it up
and this is the crunch bit
"We have been a Global Europe for quite some time now.
We have trade deals with 60 countries with whom we trade goods and services, whilst respecting our social, environmental, data protection and food safety standards.
And we will continue to do so: with Canada and Japan, with Mexico and Mercosur, soon with Australia and New Zealand, as President Juncker announced in his speech last week.
We will obviously continue to trade with the United Kingdom.
The future trade deal with the United Kingdom will be particular, as it will be less about building convergence, and more about controlling future divergence. This is key to establishing fair competition.
Naturally, if the United Kingdom wanted to go further than the type of free trade agreement we have just signed with Canada, there are other models on the table.
For example, Norway and Iceland have chosen to be in the Single Market, to accept the rules, and to contribute financially to cohesion policy.
But one thing is sure: it is not – and will not – be possible for a third country to have the same benefits as the Norwegian model but the limited obligations of the Canadian model.
And naturally, any agreement must respect the regulatory autonomy of the EU, as well as the integrity of its legal order."
which is shorthand for no Cherrypicking - on which they have been 100% consistent
what the EU know and seemingly our pathetic politicians do not is that a "no deal" is simply not an option for the UK
and that any deal WILL be worse than the one we currently have
The EU are not punishing us - we are doing a pretty good job ourselves
Problem is EU are still unwilling to change, has to be their way (bear in mind some of the high ranking members are not even elected in their own countries) or nothing. That is where the issue came about in the first place.
You have the old cronies pushing ahead with a united state of Europe and closer ties, without a care in the world.
So looks more and more likely a no deal will be the outcome. BMW have already said it will cost 10k jobs in german so its gonna hit the EU just as hard.
No matter what else happens, that alone has made my day
Oh good grief........
Originally Posted by Mr Fuji
There was some idiot on Question Time last night who was upset as we had "voted to leave the EU and stop paying all this money". Obviously he didn't read the question on that ballot paper......
It's perfectly valid to leave the EU and continue to pay for the access we have now, under the terms of the referendum as it was posed.
Is it mostly people who cannot read who voted Leave?
And here we go again, keep peddling those lies....
It was great the speech, it didn't say anything. EU will reject it and the proposals. UK to leave March 19. Offer was made, but knowing it will be thrown back
Why would I waste time? You insult folk instead of arguing.
You peddle lies.
Go away
Because people have insulted you, and you have insulted them again and again, yet still answer. The simple reason is that they are not lies, you cannot refute them.
I have not offered you an opinion to discuss, they were pointed questions that required definitive answers. The fact you choose to hide behind some mock indignation speaks volumes.
Because people have insulted you, and you have insulted them again and again, yet still answer.
Where do i insult folk? Where and when have I ever insulted you?
Originally Posted by Mr Fuji
The simple reason is that they are not lies, you cannot refute them.
So you don't think that saying that all Brexit voters can't read, is a lie?
Originally Posted by Mr Fuji
I have not offered you an opinion to discuss, they were pointed questions that required definitive answers. The fact you choose to hide behind some mock indignation speaks volumes.
What pointed questions?
Of course there was ONE question...which seems to be something you remainers can't get your heads round.
So just goes to show how in touch you lefties are - here's a dose of reality - CDU/CSU (Merkels party) - lowest share of the vote since 1949. SPD, 20% - lowest since 1945.
Afd - 13.5% - far ahead of expected showing (unprecedented for a party that is only 5 years old), enough to be the first far-right party in German parliament since WW2.
In the former East Germany, Afd actually polled enough to be the second largest party, with 21.5%.
Like I've said before, you liberals (intolerant to anyone who doesn't share your opinions) are your own worst enemies.
All this is occurring on a backdrop of a strong global economy.. which is built on the biggest debt bubble in history. When that goes pop just watch the surge in support for the far right. You reap what you sow.
Last edited by Petem95; 24 September 2017 at 06:46 PM.
So just goes to show how in touch you lefties are - here's a dose of reality - CDU/CSU (Merkels party) - lowest share of the vote since 1949. SPD, 20% - lowest since 1945.
Afd - 13.5% - far ahead of expected showing (unprecedented for a party that is only 5 years old), enough to be the first far-right party in German parliament since WW2.
In the former East Germany, Afd actually polled enough to be the second largest party, with 21.5%.
Like I've said before, you liberals (intolerant to anyone who doesn't share your opinions) are your own worst enemies.
All this is occurring on a backdrop of a strong global economy.. which is built on the biggest debt bubble in history. When that goes pop just watch the surge in support for the far right. You reap what you sow.
I could of almost set my clock by the timing of this post. The contents are entirely predictable too.
Where do i insult folk? Where and when have I ever insulted you?
So you don't think that saying that all Brexit voters can't read, is a lie?
What pointed questions?
Of course there was ONE question...which seems to be something you remainers can't get your heads round.
So you think I insulted you personally by saying that it seems all people who voted Brexit cannot read? Yet you saying people are peddling lies is not? Calling people remoaners is not?
That's double standards, old chap.
As for the pointed questions, which you have still avoided, here they are again
What was the question on the ballot paper? If you're struggling, here's a reminder for you.....
So you think I insulted you personally by saying that it seems all people who voted Brexit cannot read? Yet you saying people are peddling lies is not? Calling people remoaners is not?
That's double standards, old chap.
And is Brexiteers an insult. grow up.
Originally Posted by Mr Fuji
As for the pointed questions, which you have still avoided, here they are again
We know what the question on the ballot paper was...what's your point? Do you even have one???
Yes.
No
satisfied?
Originally Posted by Mr Fuji
Whilst you're at it, please point out the lies we are peddling?
Quite apart from the amazing disappearing act you lot have pulled with the £350 million a week, the ONLY one I'm interested in is that you asserted that all who voted to leave cannot read.
No, because Brexiteer simply implies you voted Brexit. Remoan implies that a personality trait.
Now if I said Wrexiteer.......
Originally Posted by alcazar
We know what the question on the ballot paper was...what's your point? Do you even have one???
Yes.
No
satisfied?
Not really, as the question was posed because someone had said they voted to leave the EU and stop paying all that money. Clearly that is not what was voted for.
The other question was whether you know what all the voters voted for? I'm sure there were plenty of people who voted leave simply for immigration. Some for control.
I personally know people who wanted to remain but voted leave because of concerns over immigration. Things are never quite as clear cut as you think they are. I am also sure there are people who probably voted remain whilst being distinctly uncomfortable with the EU as it stands but recognised the benefits and hoped to change it.
What is clear, is that we have a terrible mess, Leave or Remain, but the situation could be managed better.
Originally Posted by alcazar
Quite apart from the amazing disappearing act you lot have pulled with the £350 million a week, the ONLY one I'm interested in is that you asserted that all who voted to leave cannot read.
THAT lie.
Who has disappeared it? If you mean that it was pointed out that as a result of Brexit we would not have £350million extra a week at our disposal, then please explain why that is a lie.
We never had £350 million extra to spend. As hodgy pointed out, if you spend £5 on a newspaper and get £4 change to spend as you wish, the paper didn't cost you £5!
As for 'THAT lie', what I actually posted was
Is it mostly people who cannot read who voted Leave?
So I didn't even assert that all people who voted leave cannot read
Quite apart from the amazing disappearing act you lot have pulled with the £350 million a week, the ONLY one I'm interested in is that you asserted that all who voted to leave cannot read.
THAT lie.
You keep banging on about 'disappearing the £350 million', but I haven't a clue what you might think you mean by this. But here we go again: the UK has never paid the EU £350 million a week. Leaving out completely what the EU pays to us, the actual gross figure we pay is £234 million, because the rebate is applied before the money is paid. It's a discount, not cash-back. Much like getting a discount on a new car, if the sticker price is £25k, and you negotiate a £2k reduction, you didn't pay £25k, you paid £23k. The figure of £350 million is a lie. Why is this so hard for you to grasp?
And by the way, a slightly sarcastic rhetorical question, i.e "Is it mostly people who cannot read who voted Leave?" is not an assertion, it's a question. How the hell can a question be a lie?
Leaving aside the irony of "how can a question be a lie", (remember the remoan outrage at "Let's spend it on the NHS instead", a suggestion, not a promise), I cannot get my head round why your lot seem to be able to just wave, airily and say, "It was only £234 million a week....".
Remind me what you said regarding the UK not paying a penny to leave the EU....
We won't be doing so. How can you not undestand that we will pay for our commitments UP TO THE DATE OF LEAVING, and NOT some made-up fee for leaving, which is what barnier seems to think.
As for pots, kettles etc, please grow up. I do not insult people.
22 September 2017, 04:01 PM
