P1 RAJ

Hi all,

Fitted the above turbo to the car and getting it mapped this week


Just wanted to here people opinions on it such as driveability, lag, spool up etc

Thanks in advance

Raj
p.s other mods include:
3" cat back system
Up pipe
De cat down pipe
Grouppe S Headers
550 cc injectors
NGK spark plugs
K + N induction kit
uprated fuel pump
sx fuel regulator
Link ECU

GBruce

Hi Mate,

See my thread "Might be remapped Friday what boost" I have a similar set up to you, I have got figures of 350hp and 325 torque on 1.2 bar but only revving to 6500 due to problems with faulty coil pack. I am getting remapped tomorrow so I can let you know how I get on. going to try 1.3/1.4 bar and now it revs to 7300 :-)

George

GBruce

Forgot to say, Drives nice, a lot more lag than my old TD04 but I like it, you can also drive it off boost easier which is nice when you dont want to be flat out all the time. Last time it was mapped I was told it surges a bit when you try to bring in boost too early.

George

911

What base engines are you both running?
I have the same pile of bits too, but with an Sti8 TMIC and Apexi FC, but the engine is an Sti v3.
Concerned at your comments about surging: at what rpm/load
What fuel are you mapped to?
What gearboxes are you running?

911

Pavlo

Well, I did mention that they surge weeks ago!

They can surge like a bastid, or they can be okay.

Paul

P1 RAJ

pavlo


What causes surge? and what can be done about it?

Thanks

Raj

Andy.F

Mapped correctly and using a dump valve they don't surge.

1 bar boost around 3000-3200 then 1.4 bar held from 3600 to the limiter, this will be capable of in the region of 370-420bhp depending on supporting mods.

Andy

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

Pavlo

Lol,

What Andy means, is they do surge, unless you slug the boost down. Now that's not always a bad thing, indeed I did it myself and it makes it possibly nicer to drive. But on Andy's old car, you couldn't go over 1.4 bar until 4500 rpm with the stock headers.

Paul

P.Cole

cant fault mine peaks 1.7 - 1.8 holds 1.45 bar some times holds a bit more depends how cold it is lag dont seem to be a problem
cheers andy

Andy.F

Nice one Paul (Cole)

Pavlo Paul, they don't surge when mapped properly. On my old car which you have, the oversize induction pipe in conjunction with the ported housing caused that problem. If you try to run 1.8 bar at 3500rpm there may well be an issue but thats OTT for std internals.
But you know that anyway

Andy

madou

P1 RAJ

Really depends on what you want from the car, but very capable turbo

http://bbs.22b.com/cgi-bin/ultimateb...=000378#000031

"If you like your car with the TD05 20G, fine enjoy it. Everyone has his own preferences and targets. For me personally a TD05 20G is too laggy on a 2 liter classic with standard European gearing."

Judging by "P1 RAJ" you have a P1, so let the bunfight continue ;-)

Andy.F

No bunfight required Show me a less laggy 440bhp capable bolt on turbo and I'll buy it !!

Andy

GBruce

Well I don't think its too laggy, even with my standard 98 uk gearing, you can drive it off boost and its nice and smooth good for an everyday driver or in traffic. When you want to go faster just let the revs build and off it goes.
When people said it was laggy I was expecting much more than this.

George

P1 RAJ

Thanks for all the replies!

I will let you guys know how I get on after my remap on saturday.

How does the TD05/20g compare to my p1 standard turbo(vf28) in terms of lag and spool up? The 22b.com link only mentioned vf34/35.

alanbell

iTrader: (6)

Ive a TD05 /06 on mine 96uk mapped by Andy F , with most of the mods needed , and its really really good ,,, LAG >> whats that???????????????? cheers,

911

But does an Sti engine cope as well with it all?
For hill climbs, you hold on to the red line rather than loose time changing gear between bends, slam the brakes on and pull out of the bend at 4500 in (say) 2nd. A bit of lag might make the drive better out of the bend.
I am looking yet for a good torquey engine, then a 380/340 engine with a 6 speeder to cope with the torque.
Still happy with the 20g / Apexi route, just always curious (worried) about the 'side effects' of such mods as the engine is such a gem at present!

911

alanbell

iTrader: (6)

911, mines a 96uk with >>>> I hate typing >>>uk 6 speed, apexi map Andy F , 550 inj, alloy headers, fmic, better pump and reg, 05/06 turbo, and lots more , mine at the moment is >> without side effects, must be nearly 399 Bhp,

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

just put the turbo on and get mapped there is less lag than with a td05 youve bought the stuff so worry about your gearbox later

alan

what do you think of the new turbo then??? do you think its much better, or are you of the same opinion as me and its only better over 5000rpm

alanbell

iTrader: (6)

Hi Steve, Turbo mated with uk 6 speed , >> great< its good all the way , BUT 3rd gear up wards WooooW

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

now isnt that exactly what i told you about 2 weeks ago 5th gear and foot down at 4000rpm

alanbell

iTrader: (6)

yes money well spent,

P.Cole

infact it was trin to hold 1.6 bar tonite

Pavlo

Why was that pipe considered oversized? At 63mm diameter before the turbo, with some 100mm in length before opening to 76mm, it was hardly a gargantuan inlet pipe. What was ported about the housing? Isn't that what we want to do anyway, to improve spoolup?

The problem I have with the turbo, is that many of the things we want to do to improve induction performance worsen the surge. I don't consider it to be the magical turbo on a 2.0 that everyone thinks it is. It's good value, and gets good top end power, but it has limitations which I don't think many people are aware of when buying one. Not everyone has RPM dependant boost control, some people may have already gone to the trouble of getting a large inlet pipe, and now when they get a 20g they should bin it? Just because some people get away with no surge, it doesn't mean everyone does. On Harvey's WRX he had to make various changes to his inlet piping to reduce the surge, and that was after having made a custom up and down pipe to put a straighter, larger inlet pipe on in the interests of power.

They surge because the compressor is prone to surge within the boost range that the small exhaust side allows. Now this may not be a problem for most people that only want to run 1.4 bar and get 360hp or so, but to me that's a waste of a high flowing turbo.

My guess is that they are just about perfect on a 2.2, as it should just skim round the surge line, and you obviously get more bang for your boost. On a 2.5 they give a very nice broad powerband and almost no lag, at the expense of giving a 2.5 uncapable of surpassing a 2.0 in terms of overall power.

Paul

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Just wondering who is mapping the Link ?? Bob Rawle ???

Midlife.....

Andy.F

Paul

I don't understand why you are only getting 360bhp at 1.4 bar on such an efficient turbo, typical results are anywhere between 370 and 440bhp at this boost on a 2.0
Thats without surge or rpm dependant boost control.
If you need some help with set up, let me know

Andy

ps Didn't Tweenyrobs set up which you were involved with make well over 400bhp at this sort of boost ? I must go dig up that old thread from my favourites folder

tweenierob

I is here

Yes i did make 419hp, it was at 1.56bar.

I have sung this turbo's praises many a time and should have commision on the number of people i have told to get a turbo from you...
Up until very very recently i could not recommend a turbo that could perform as well as the ones you supply for the same money, but if you look outside the box
In fact i fitted one of your turbo's last week

However, i do think it is a bit of a cop out that you say that they should not run more than X boost on std internals, this sound smore like a surge hiding statement.
Did you not have a two stage boost control set up on the car when Alan bought it? was this not because it surged too much?
Did you make 440@1.4bar? i think not not even with the forbidden fuels

The truth is that there are better turbo's that are coming out of the woodwork, better priced and no probs with surge.... After all 400+ is too much for std internals..
Rob

Andy.F

Rob it was 440 bhp at 1.47 bar.
My old car was a real pig with regard to surge, as mentioned this was a result of the oversize intake fitted.
I am not saying don't run more than 1.4bar, in fact I have just mapped two recently to pull 1.6 bar as soon as possible which is around 3700rpm.
With correct sizing of the intake, surge is non existant, this doesn't restrict power either........which is nice


Andy

PS Come on then Rob, put up or shut up ! Show me one

Pavlo

Andy,

What's the most torque you've seen out of a td05/06-20g?

The cars making 360 odd hp from a 20g are nothing to do with me.

Paul

CustomScoobyIOM

Very interested. What is it?

Jon.