Good Value for the Taxpayer??
We are being brainwashed into thinking that "to get the right man" to run a company they have to be paid millions. Bollox. I believe there are plenty of sound business people around who would be quite capable of running a company/organisation for a lot less than that.
Cameron is said to be worried that if he upsets RBS then they will all walk out in a sulk. Well I very much doubt that, and, if they did, they could find replacements tomorrow.
Cameron is said to be worried that if he upsets RBS then they will all walk out in a sulk. Well I very much doubt that, and, if they did, they could find replacements tomorrow.
One of the reasons banking is SO f**ked up is that in the 'noughties that is everyone thought. Good sound business people should be able to make a decent go at this.
HBoS hired a CEO with no banking background; RBS had a Chairman with no banking background. And it showed up very glaringly when the market started to get tough. Traditional bankers had far fewer challenges than these 'sound business people' from other industries.
As for people not walking. RBS has already lost a massive amount of talent as their packages have dropped and they cannot replace them.
For all the armchair critics on here - in my (limited - but direct) experience - most investment and universal bankers are some of the smartest people on the planet.
Without these individuals the innovation that you talk about is lost and so a UK global brand becomes hugely less competitive in a marketplace that is becoming increasingly cut-throat.
You're forgetting about the withdrawing funding for companies even if they are making a day to day profit and ultimately closing them down (so his mates at the big administration firms can asset strip them while making a pretty penny) as well as a woefull lack of interest in loaning money to any small business.
The majority of businesses that are making profit are currently de-leveraging as fast as they can. It is the number one corporate and sovereign trend.
And those that are not making profit are trying to restructure.
The banks want to lend to the former - but they won't take it and the last thing they want to do is lend to the latter as they will lose all their (our) money.
This is a time when the men will be separated from the boys.
As for the suggestion of asset stripping nepotism - you really are hilarious.
On the bonus issues - I suspect this is part of his LTIP which most executives get in most industries. Encouraged by the DTI and many boards - the LTIP will tie part of the overall package of the reward into variable pay that will not vest for 3-5 years.
The idea is, pay someone well to do their job, pay them better to stick around for the duration. And link the long term element to corporate performance by paying it in company shares that will not vest for at least three years.
Not quite as simple as the ridiculous headlines you are seeing in the press.
Sure encouraging executives to stick around and see through their good works is a good thing. Reduces short-termism.
I can assure you from personal experience - if you leave early - your LTIP will be worth nothing, zero, nada. Same if you get fired etc.
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
Joined: Apr 2002
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In deed it would seem he is under paid by quite some margin too amongst his peers.
Let's take a reality check.
The majority of businesses that are making profit are currently de-leveraging as fast as they can. It is the number one corporate and sovereign trend.
And those that are not making profit are trying to restructure.
The banks want to lend to the former - but they won't take it and the last thing they want to do is lend to the latter as they will lose all their (our) money.
This is a time when the men will be separated from the boys.
As for the suggestion of asset stripping nepotism - you really are hilarious.
The majority of businesses that are making profit are currently de-leveraging as fast as they can. It is the number one corporate and sovereign trend.
And those that are not making profit are trying to restructure.
The banks want to lend to the former - but they won't take it and the last thing they want to do is lend to the latter as they will lose all their (our) money.
This is a time when the men will be separated from the boys.
As for the suggestion of asset stripping nepotism - you really are hilarious.
The weak Labour government gave them all our money with zero conditions and they have used it to make a fat profit for themselves. The weak Tory government are now patting them on the back for being so clever!
Meanwhile everyone else is f**ked!
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
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Nope, just see it all for what it is rather than dressing it up in some rose tinted double speak that makes normal folk think these people are worthy of more consideration than pondlife.
The weak Labour government gave them all our money with zero conditions and they have used it to make a fat profit for themselves. The weak Tory government are now patting them on the back for being so clever!
Meanwhile everyone else is f**ked!
The weak Labour government gave them all our money with zero conditions and they have used it to make a fat profit for themselves. The weak Tory government are now patting them on the back for being so clever!
Meanwhile everyone else is f**ked!
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
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Ministers are outraged and demand that the RBS CEO to waiver his bonus in this economic climate of pay freezes, pension cutbacks and job losses. In that case Ministers should lead by example and start by waivering their claims for expenses. (like that is ever going to happen! 
)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-1676759
) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-1676759
Scooby Regular
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Very good value for his money. Fred the Shred was the actual ****** here.
Hester's actually very good at what he does even if red top newspapers and uniformed armchair observers don't understand it. Running a bank at that level, especially when it has been overburdened with ridiculously priced acquisitions like Abn Amro, is far from easy, especially when every move is dissected and criticised by vast swathes of people who don't have a clue what's going on. He could easily earn 3 or 4 times that instantly should he choose to walk away, and we, the tax payers, would have to pay probably far more than he's on to get anyone near as competent to accept such a poisoned chalice. The bonus was in shares that don't vest for some time so he's putting his money where his mouth is, and as for the £1.2m salary; Yes, it's lots of money, but not in the context of, say, Wayne Rooney - somebody who is arguably one of the better practitioners of his trade in the country like Hester is. Rooney's trade happens to be football and he earns more than Hester's annual salary in one month...
Let's not even look at the sort of players/donkeys Hester's salary level would get you in the Premier League.
I've met him a few times - back when he was a young / up and coming investment banker - around the late 80's- and at a couple of parties as he was a friend of a bloke I worked with. Very very bright and pretty pleasant - as bankers go...
FB
Hester's actually very good at what he does even if red top newspapers and uniformed armchair observers don't understand it. Running a bank at that level, especially when it has been overburdened with ridiculously priced acquisitions like Abn Amro, is far from easy, especially when every move is dissected and criticised by vast swathes of people who don't have a clue what's going on. He could easily earn 3 or 4 times that instantly should he choose to walk away, and we, the tax payers, would have to pay probably far more than he's on to get anyone near as competent to accept such a poisoned chalice. The bonus was in shares that don't vest for some time so he's putting his money where his mouth is, and as for the £1.2m salary; Yes, it's lots of money, but not in the context of, say, Wayne Rooney - somebody who is arguably one of the better practitioners of his trade in the country like Hester is. Rooney's trade happens to be football and he earns more than Hester's annual salary in one month...
Let's not even look at the sort of players/donkeys Hester's salary level would get you in the Premier League.
I've met him a few times - back when he was a young / up and coming investment banker - around the late 80's- and at a couple of parties as he was a friend of a bloke I worked with. Very very bright and pretty pleasant - as bankers go...
FB
Scooby Regular
Joined: Apr 2001
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From: Some country and western
How much would other bank leaders have earned over the same period?
I have no problem with it. You could not have got someone in paying them 250k and expect them to have the same results.
I have no problem with it. You could not have got someone in paying them 250k and expect them to have the same results.
Scooby Regular
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 15,634
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From: K
Very good value for his money. Fred the Shred was the actual ****** here.
Hester's actually very good at what he does even if red top newspapers and uniformed armchair observers don't understand it. Running a bank at that level, especially when it has been overburdened with ridiculously priced acquisitions like Abn Amro, is far from easy, especially when every move is dissected and criticised by vast swathes of people who don't have a clue what's going on. He could easily earn 3 or 4 times that instantly should he choose to walk away, and we, the tax payers, would have to pay probably far more than he's on to get anyone near as competent to accept such a poisoned chalice. The bonus was in shares that don't vest for some time so he's putting his money where his mouth is, and as for the £1.2m salary; Yes, it's lots of money, but not in the context of, say, Wayne Rooney - somebody who is arguably one of the better practitioners of his trade in the country like Hester is. Rooney's trade happens to be football and he earns more than Hester's annual salary in one month...
Let's not even look at the sort of players/donkeys Hester's salary level would get you in the Premier League.
I've met him a few times - back when he was a young / up and coming investment banker - around the late 80's- and at a couple of parties as he was a friend of a bloke I worked with. Very very bright and pretty pleasant - as bankers go...
FB
Hester's actually very good at what he does even if red top newspapers and uniformed armchair observers don't understand it. Running a bank at that level, especially when it has been overburdened with ridiculously priced acquisitions like Abn Amro, is far from easy, especially when every move is dissected and criticised by vast swathes of people who don't have a clue what's going on. He could easily earn 3 or 4 times that instantly should he choose to walk away, and we, the tax payers, would have to pay probably far more than he's on to get anyone near as competent to accept such a poisoned chalice. The bonus was in shares that don't vest for some time so he's putting his money where his mouth is, and as for the £1.2m salary; Yes, it's lots of money, but not in the context of, say, Wayne Rooney - somebody who is arguably one of the better practitioners of his trade in the country like Hester is. Rooney's trade happens to be football and he earns more than Hester's annual salary in one month...
Let's not even look at the sort of players/donkeys Hester's salary level would get you in the Premier League.
I've met him a few times - back when he was a young / up and coming investment banker - around the late 80's- and at a couple of parties as he was a friend of a bloke I worked with. Very very bright and pretty pleasant - as bankers go...
FB
I think earning 100% bonus is crazy but fair play to him. Rememeber that people that get paid these sums don't just do 9-5 they will be at disney land with their kids and will still do a conference call etc.It's not an easy job to make a company profit over 2 billion in a year.
My wife being one of these they get paid the sums they do becuase they are always working - might be a mugs game but 20% of your salary for just working is a nice incentive.
And if you don't like these bonuses then there is nothing stopping you from changing your lives and working where the money is.. Or the Gravy train (The DOLL)
My wife being one of these they get paid the sums they do becuase they are always working - might be a mugs game but 20% of your salary for just working is a nice incentive.
And if you don't like these bonuses then there is nothing stopping you from changing your lives and working where the money is.. Or the Gravy train (The DOLL)
A number of banks used to have a maximum salary of £100k and the rest could only be paid in bonuses. Part of the bonus culture.
It has changed now since the media portrays anyone who gets a bonus as the devil incarnate - so now they all get higher salaries and more bankers are getting fired as costs have gone up!! Well done media
No one mentions all the other people who get bonuses - infrastructure and software salesman can easily make a bonus of a £1m cash. Top performing IFAs, top performing recruitment consultants, and a lot of partners in management consultancy,
And in almost all cases their jobs are a sh*t load easier than Hester's.
It has changed now since the media portrays anyone who gets a bonus as the devil incarnate - so now they all get higher salaries and more bankers are getting fired as costs have gone up!! Well done media
No one mentions all the other people who get bonuses - infrastructure and software salesman can easily make a bonus of a £1m cash. Top performing IFAs, top performing recruitment consultants, and a lot of partners in management consultancy,
And in almost all cases their jobs are a sh*t load easier than Hester's.
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
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You could but then who would be willing to take the job when the going rate is a million plus? £250k for a head trader maybe, but for a CEO of a multinational? Suppose it will depend on what calibre of person taxpayers are willing to have in charge of "our" bank and "our" investment. The flips side is the more they get paid, the more tax they will pay and their tax bill will be many times my annual gross salary. So will the Government do more that dish out sound bites and curb bankers pay? I doubt it.
SN Fairy Godmother
Joined: Nov 2003
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From: Far Far Away
We really are becoming a nation of those who have and those who don't.
I have no understanding of what this bloke does, nor am I interested, but to justify that type of salary beggars belief. I work bloody hard in my own business, yet I could never see my work being valued so high, even though the Companies I work for, rely on me to keep their finances correct and in the black. I must be missing somthing here
I have no understanding of what this bloke does, nor am I interested, but to justify that type of salary beggars belief. I work bloody hard in my own business, yet I could never see my work being valued so high, even though the Companies I work for, rely on me to keep their finances correct and in the black. I must be missing somthing here
