rich uk300

did ya,what was the times

on boost

My sister & her husband have spent far more on their wrx than I have spent on my GTIR and the quarter mile results speak for themself.

Quarter mile results:
96 WRX STI = 13.1 seconds
91 GTIR = 12.079 seconds

So far the GTIR has never been off the road and runs those times every day of the year.
Need i say more

image doctor

Now I know Impreza's are good, but are they that good?

Porchse 996 C4
4.9 secs to 60 and
12 secs to 100

Now I know a Porsche is a bench mark, but to drastically do that off the lights you gotta have a lot of bhp.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Turbo Bob,
speak to Rich Wild about his MY95, he ran 1.4 bar quite happily (UK car) on its standard ecu (and 340ish BHP).
Lady,
the biggest reason you see alot of broken scoobs with engine failures is they have either been run on the wrong fuel, have the wrong oil in and havnt been maintained, now alot will be troublesome due to the people who can now get hold of these cars, lack of money for fuel, maintenance and parts mean they are run into the ground, also i would love to see actually how many performance cars owned by the "boy racer" marked people are maintained to a high standard (like my 2 cars) or just run into the ground....
Now the biggest difference here is that my scoob isnt quite 3 years old yet, most GTiR's are 12-10 years old (94 was the last year if i remember correctly) and there aint alot of 9 year old ones around and unless they have had caring owners from new i suspect alot will have dodgy history etc.... eventually this happens to virtually all cars but as scoobs are newer, there should be less "dogs" around than other performance cars in this bracket.

Tony

Mad4it

On boost - Out of curiosty, where did your friends run these times?

LadyCruzer

PPP - maybe because there were only a certain amount, 5000 (i think!?) imported as UK spec, apart from the fact they run about 16mpg and around 160 miles to a tank if driven sensibley .... i do see Pulsars about, just not during the day because im sure most people would have a second, cheaper-to-run, car as a daily driver!!

Toerag

The reason Scoobs are more common is 'cos the UK versions were not limited editions. Sunny GTiR's are rare, there are probably more Pulsars out there now.
I personally know Caleb very well (we work at the same place and I've known him since we were 7!) and can honestly say that he has spent a LOT of money on his car. Yes, it does look the dogs bits, but he has had a LOT of engine/gearbox related problems, and that's without doing much in the way of drag racing. OK, so it only cost him £8k-ish, but for the amount of time it has spent off the road I wouldn't have bothered.
I think miss Cruzer actually wants the pulsar for the umbrella in the drivers door!

madbazza95

I HAVE BEEN TO OVER 50 MEETINGS @ POD AND YORKDRAGWAY ETC OVER THE PAST 3 YEARS AND I HAVE NEVER SEEN OR HEARD OF A SCOOBY BREAK 12 SEC QUARTER BUT THERE ARE MANY GTI-Rs THAT RUN BETWEEN 360-400 BHP THAT BREAK 12s!!!!!
BRUCE SPENCE 11.02 @ 400BHP REVS DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DANNY FENNEL 11.7 @ YORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




JASON GANT LOW LOW 12s







GRANT 12.6 @ 295BHP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!













AND THE FASTEST RECORDED R @ 10.8 @400+
ALSO 0-60 MOST Rs @ 360-400bhp BREAK 4SECs!!!!!!!!!!!!
SOME HAVE BEEN RECORDED @ 3.6 0-60!!!!!!!!!

SO I THINK THIS SHOULD SETTLE WHO IS THE DADDY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SCOOBYs BEWARE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

turbo bob

image doctor,
i ment the gti-r,sorry.

cheers for that tony

nisr227

....I agree, "like for like" the Pulsars are quicker up the strip, its just because of the weak box that some Pulsars owners hold back on the launching and carefull gearchanging.

Once we have a few Pulsars fitted with the new PAR gearboxes there will be some very very quick times indeed for their bhp spec. I could name quite a few people aiming for over a genuine 400bhp being built at the moment.


....the times on that day were not that impessive due to the poor "early season" slippy pod, most 4wd times were about a second off their potential, but the Pulsars (low to high 13's) were still putting in quicker times than the scoobs (most 14s) "overall". The fastest pulsar on that "slipping day" was JG's with 12.9 which included flicking sideways off the line and having to back off before booting again, I would say that could get mid to low 11's in the dry, looks very promising. That genuine 600bhp blue R34 Skyline could only get high 12's due to the conditions.

You might beat us in the corners (just) but not up the strip..... game on. All good fun.

rich uk300

so going by that statement i can take a second of mine as i was only trundling off the line at about 2500rpm as it was so wet and i had bald tyres....13.6 for my standard scoob so hopefully gtr bashing next time with very low 12's

chrisp

As posted by one of the GTIROC moderators. Looks like the australians have it sorted

Top 10, 4 Cylinder 4 whel Drives in Aussie......

1 N.S.W Vic Elfes Impreza - Auto EJ20 9.40 147 Eastern Creek
2 N.S.W Bakker Arja Impreza - Auto EJ20 2ltr 9.71 148 Eastern Creek
3 QLD Dominic Rigoli Impreza WRX EJ20 2.2ltr 10.02 145 Willowbank
4 QLD Robert Barac Lancer Evolution 2 4G63 2ltr 10.08 145.35 Willowbank
5 N.S.W David Khoury Subaru Brumby EJ20 10.41 138 Heathcote
6 QLD Jamie Montesalvo Impreza WRX MY99 EJ20 2.2ltr 10.48 141 Willowbank
7 S.A. Simon Podleski Lancer GSR 4G63 2ltr 10.59 131 A.I.R
8 N.S.W Dario Zuffo Impreza WRX EJ20 2ltr 10.62 141 A.I.R
9 N.S.W David Khoury Subaru Liberty RS EJ20 10.72 138 Eastern Creek
10 QLD Shane Pavey Impreza WRX EJ25 TT 10.77 130 Willowbank

PPPscooby

LadyCruzer.....only 5000 imported isnt any excuse, supply always matches demand, if there is no demand for the car why would they keep importing them...... only a few cars produced get a following like the scoob.

To be honest, if more people thought the pulsar was better im sure they would have loved to have bought it and saved themselves some money.

Anyway 16mpg isnt a reason to make people buy a scoob instead, cos they only do a few miles more.

chrisp

madbazza one for you here :

http://www.scoobynet.co.uk/bbs/threa...D=87085&Page=1

jameswrx

iTrader: (4)

my gti-r is better on fuel than my wrx!, only just though! not even worth discussing fuel economy on these cars thats not what they are about.

Looks = personal pref, imo equal when modded right

Handling = scooby

performance in mild tune both approx 1bar = nissan

brakes = nissan(no abs on mine, couldn't believe how crap my wrx ones are)

reliability = nissan

interior = scooby

exterior = nissan (scooby panels are like paper!)

james

nisr227

i said "about" which means roughly, approximate, in some cases there were some cars less than this, I was talking overall, but whatever, the fact is the GtiRs were consistantly lower than the scoobs, see you at the pod;} in a few months for some fun

rich uk300

lol be exact will ya

if all is well and noand somethen i'll be up there on the 23rd of feb

marty_t3

PPPscooby.... supply does match demand, true,

The Pulsar is a 2 door performance hatch. It's demanded by people who want a 2 door preformance hatch.

The scoob comes in many guises. It's in demand by people who want either a 4 door family saloon, a 5 door family estate, 4 door performance saloon, a 5 door performance estate or a 2 door performance saloon. It has a much bigger market... that's why there are so common !!

The scoob also benefits from people who want to step up in performance and stay with the same brand. Buyers can go from Sport-->Turbo 2000-->WRX-->STi-->22B. There is only one GTiR.

Of course there are more Scoobs on the roads!!! Doesn't say anything about the car itself... there are more corsas on the roads than scoobs.. does that make the corsa a better car?? No.

PPPscooby

scoob may have a slightly bigger market, but the amount of competition that a scoob has these days is massive. The cars in the scoob market price, power and size wise are, evo's, golf r32's, escort cosworth, focus RS and soon a focus cosworth ( i hope), mazda 6 is coming out with a 280 bhp car, mondeo st220, rx7 and 8, audi s4, i prob missed a few out.

Pulsar was a 3 dr 230bhp (i think) car with virtually no competition in its day and still didnt attract the demand & nissan decided to stop making it. See u need more then tuning potential and 1/4 miles times to make a decent package.

Cant compare corsa sales to scooby sales, have to compare like for like.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

PPPScooby,
exactly how old are you??
I can actually remember the late 80's and early 90's and saying that there was no competition for the GTiR is like saying Cosworth never built a 2ltr turbo engine
You have mentioned some of the cars there (the RX7 for instance, the Mitsubishi Starion, the Sierra cosworth, Escort cosworth etc) unfortunately these cars were pretty much priced out of the market due to car thieves and high insurance premiums but they were around.
Subaru even had the odd car around then but the biggest name was the Cosworth at the time so i feel your a little mistaken about having no competition (and there were also impreza's around by 94....)

Tony

PPPscooby

sierras wernt in the same market as a pulsar, they were bigger 4 door cars like the scoob in later years. Pulsar gtir was a 3 dr hatch, how many other 3 dr hatches were around at that time with 230bhp as standard

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Did i forget to mention that there were also 3 door cosworths?
You also have to remember the 2 door Rover's (god help us for remembering those!)
There has always been competition in this class, as the class has taken on more than just a 3 door hot hatch feel, and even with 220bhp (the Sunny as the Pulsar was 227 with 100 ron fuel, ie 220 bhp on uk fuel) and the rovers, vauxhalls (mustnt forget the humble cav turbo or the calibra now can we ) and in a way you could also include cars like the 200sx (2 door turbo)....
Unfortunately the Sunny GTiR had the same following as the Sunny GTi, ie at the time, not many, even though the GTi was voted as the king of hot hatches at the time (93/94) and limited imports of the GTiR to the uk kept it a rare car (i use to see one around here about 11 years ago, now there are a few more.... all around 11 years old )

Tony

CraigH

So an RX7 is in the same market place as a Scoob? RWD, 2 seater coupe is the same as a 4 door saloon, or are you just looking at size? Yeah that makes sense.

The fact Nissan UK sold around 5000 - does that mean Integrales are not very good cos theres not many on the roads? Or Escort Cosworths - rarer than Scoobs - they rubbish as well? EVO's? How many of those over here? Are they not as good as Scoobs?

That's a fantastic argument - "they didn't sell as many so they can't be as good"

I'll remember that next time I pull up next to a Porker, Lambo or Ferrari. Not to mention a Mclaren F1 - they must be TOTALLY rubbish lol.

As std, a GTiR doesn't handle as well as a Scoob. Just like as std a Scoob doesn't handle as well as an EVO. But change the suspension on those 3, and assuming similar tyres and brakes there will be pretty much sweet FA in it between any of them.

Engines go bang? And Scoobs don't? Gone are the days you can play a Scoob reliability card.

Lady Cruzer, spend 4k on a GTiR, 3k on suspension, brakes and engine and it will be more than a match for an old 7k Scoob that's for sure.

Wizzbang

First off, Nissan UK had around 1000 cars not 5000, so genuine uk sunnys are rare as rocking horse poo, hence the 'poor sales'(they were all sold though).

Nissan Japan manufactured the Pulsar gtir from 90-95 and only around 7000 were made in total, dont forget that these were built to satisfy the 'homolagtion' ruling of the then Grp A, a minimum of 5000 production cars to compete. The car was unsucessful in Grp A because of the lack of development the car was allowed under the Grp A ruling, it really needed a front mounted intercooler for a start, but as Nissan produced the car with a topmount it had to stay.

In the end Nissan wanted to continue with its 'circuit racing' programmes across the world, and rather than trying to develop the pulsar further it pulled out of the rally scene after only 2 seasons, as they wanted a winner straight out of the box they didnt see that this car had any future, but think for a minute of any rally/race car that didnt perform early in its life that is now doing well, im sure a few spring to mind.

Now for the debate, ive had two pulsars and theyre great cars for what they are : 2ltr 16v turbo 4x4. and with a little fettling are astonshingly quick , eg, my first one had a mongoose exhaust, uprated actuator, k&n air filter and no offical setup ran 4.7 0-60 two years running at trax, the sceond one was basically the same but with a few electronic controllers and a decent clutch was faster but i never done a timed 0-60 with it. With pulsars now being available for around 4k for a clean example and still being around 2k cheaper for an equivilant scoob, this leaves money to sort the suspension and brakes, then you can wave goobye to the prezas especially round the infamous twisties.

Finally to all those people talking about how well their car handles, lets get one thing clear and thats a good handling car doesnt have to have astonishing grip levels, remember grip can be measured, but handling cant. Handling is all about feel, its about how the car comunicates to you, its not how quickly it dissapears round the twisties, and thats why Ive seen the light and junked four wheel drive cars, Ive now got a MR2 turbo which really does handle well.


WizzBang

MR2 turbo - sideways EVERYWHERE

CraigH

PPPScooby,

You really are quite stuck up aren't you.?

Take the blinkers off - just because a GTiR doesn't meet your criteria for a good car doesn't make it any worse than a Scoob.

If you want to talk about good all round cars, a Scoob is not one of them. They're crappily built, flimsy inside and out, expensive to service properly,expensive to insure, not particularly comfortable, very thirsty and quite noisy. Oh, but they go fast and handle quite well. That's not a particularly good all rounder is it?
A 330d beemer, is well built, cheap to service and insure, comfortable, economical and quiet. And it's quite quick and handles well. So it must be a better all round car surely?

As to modding "cheap" cars, so what? If you've modded your car in any way then the same can be said for you - why did you do it, why not spend the money on a better car?

nisr227

A standard GtiR back in 92 (magazine test) out-handled a Porshe Carrera 2 of its day on Castle Combe circuit with a quicker time, not bad for a car with puny 14 inch wheels, poor tyres, crap small brakes and a top mount intercooler. And yes, it was standard according to the sprint times.

The R's handling it very chuckable, predictable and mainly safe, if a bit too much understeer, but all can be improved. It might not have loads of grip, grip isn't everything, but if you want grip then you can improve it with the correct Supsension mods wheels,tyres etc. The very early scoobs weren't that good, they got better. I only run OZ 15inch Superlegs on my R becuase I like the chuckability, the uprated 290mm 4 pots are squeezed but thats the way I want it to "handle". Slidding quickly when the grip goes is more fun that grip, grip, grip. The feel and feedback is great, and far better than an many scoobs, including an early WRX Sti i've driven, but thats my opinion.

If only Nissan handn't pulled the plug and developed the R with decent brakes, front mount etc for rallying then the 90's might well of been different. A BIG if!

As for modifying, there will be some seriously fast R's for their output over the next couple of years on the scene, watch this space. The goalpost will be moved. People have only started to tune them over recent years, look how far cossies had to go before we got the quick powerful ones today.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Nisr,
Where nissan failed to continue to do manufacturing developement, Subaru did actually carry it on
Back in 93/4 when they tested a UK turbo against an ST24, the ST24 came out the best, now it would be different as the suspension was changed on later models, and when all balanced up correctly the car does handle pretty good (but there are still official accessories for performance, handling and comfort available from Subaru UK for their cars as we all want a little more )
As for quick GTiR's, that i dont doubt, but there are some very powerful scoobs out there also (sub 9 sec 1/4 times!) but not in this country DOH!

Tony

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

I should also point out that the GTiR is acutually heavier than a UK turbo
(It must be that intercooler scoop on the bonnet )

Tony

Wizzbang

What is the kerb weight for both a uk scoob and a pulsar ??

nisr227

Tony, the R's weight always causes different opinions, they vary from 1210kilos to 1269kilos depending what you believe. They also did a lightweight Dakar (off white colour) version that was only 1190kilos, but the shortratio box on that gave slower figures to 60 with it changing into 3rd gear beforehand. I know a few that have had their measured with heavier 17's and they got about 1240kilos.

Standard figures for the R's are 13.9 second 1/4 miles, and thats not at the pod but road test figures, I believe the standard UK scoob times are slightly slower than this (i've seen 14.2s to 14.6secs). A lot of R owners dump the Aircon when they fit front mounts, saving a few kgs too.

We all know the faster rally bred car this year will be ND's 716bhp (or more) new Evo7, and i'm not saying the R's will get anywhere near this, but there is a Jun 2.2 SR20DET (simlar to that in the GtiR) engine in Australia with a T88 Turbo running about 800bhp with more to come, so if someone had the money and a gearbox....

I don't know what the scoob scene is doing but there will be far more 400-500bhp R's around soon in the UK with boxes that can handle this. Hopefully we'll see a high 10 second 1/4 mile with road tyres by a particular R in the UK this summer. Still get beating by that evo though!