Have u raced a porshe???
23 August 2002, 04:33 PM
#123
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sorry the Porsche and skyline dont even come close.
The 3 door sierra RS Cosworth is the most successful track car ever built being undefeated in the uk touring car championship Asian touring car championship and bathurst race etc. Check your fact and history books.
As you are obviously unaware saxo many westfields use the coswort YB 2.0litre turbo engine.
Craig H seeing as though my GGR saff is so slow perhaps if you live up my way you would care to compare your own car to it.Lol if its a scooby or BMW M3 or 911 turbo
The ridiculous family slagging comments are a clear sign that you cant back up your arguements most of you are stupid spotty teenagers who spout cack.
[Edited by co55ie - 8/23/2002 4:38:49 PM]
The 3 door sierra RS Cosworth is the most successful track car ever built being undefeated in the uk touring car championship Asian touring car championship and bathurst race etc. Check your fact and history books.
As you are obviously unaware saxo many westfields use the coswort YB 2.0litre turbo engine.
Craig H seeing as though my GGR saff is so slow perhaps if you live up my way you would care to compare your own car to it.Lol if its a scooby or BMW M3 or 911 turbo
The ridiculous family slagging comments are a clear sign that you cant back up your arguements most of you are stupid spotty teenagers who spout cack.
[Edited by co55ie - 8/23/2002 4:38:49 PM]
23 August 2002, 04:38 PM
#124
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Crikey, I've just read this thread from the start and my eyes feel like a couple of fortune cookies. It's taken on an intersting line in "slagging" which I'm sure would have been picked up by the moderators in the "good ole days".
Anyway, if anyone's still interested in an objective comparison, my mates got a 996 S3 (or is S2?; it's the one below the GT2 apparently which he said was no good for him as it doesn't have back seats for his kid or something) and we decided to go head to head.
We came off a roundabout side by side in 2nd and on the signal went for it. I had an initial lead which got levelled off by 70ish and stayed that way up to about 90 when he changed gear and leapt about 2/3 of a cars length ahead (an awesome wave of torque).
Then there was a roundabout and we left it at that.
Just thought I'd mention it as you asked.
Neil. (STi4 Decat and panel filter)
Anyway, if anyone's still interested in an objective comparison, my mates got a 996 S3 (or is S2?; it's the one below the GT2 apparently which he said was no good for him as it doesn't have back seats for his kid or something) and we decided to go head to head.
We came off a roundabout side by side in 2nd and on the signal went for it. I had an initial lead which got levelled off by 70ish and stayed that way up to about 90 when he changed gear and leapt about 2/3 of a cars length ahead (an awesome wave of torque).
Then there was a roundabout and we left it at that.
Just thought I'd mention it as you asked.
Neil. (STi4 Decat and panel filter)
23 August 2002, 04:48 PM
#125
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I don't care if a westfield has a cossie engine or not its still a westfield!!! And still better than a poxy cossie!!
You don't see many people looking at elises and saying 'pah, just a rover with a pretty frock'
You don't see many people looking at elises and saying 'pah, just a rover with a pretty frock'
23 August 2002, 04:58 PM
#126
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Dingy if you built your escort surely you would have picked up on the fact that I had deliberately removed the inclusion of an exhaust manifold on my car you would surley have known seeing as though you know everything about YB tuning that the standard one will only flow enough for 420bhp.
I expect your car is more like 320 bhp dingy looking at the spec which is pretty poor and not very well balanced.
Craig HI have various articles and tests of tuners cossies the GGR escort v PE etc etc etc and every review read the same the GGR came out on top. They also have a very good reputation and there work is excellent but not cheap.
I expect your car is more like 320 bhp dingy looking at the spec which is pretty poor and not very well balanced.
Craig HI have various articles and tests of tuners cossies the GGR escort v PE etc etc etc and every review read the same the GGR came out on top. They also have a very good reputation and there work is excellent but not cheap.
23 August 2002, 05:03 PM
#129
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Co55ie,
Once again you've missed the point
Well done on editing most of your posts - makes for a very convincing argument.
As to your offer, thanks but no thanks -it's not going to be as fast as Dingys (as his car has similar power and much less weight), it's not going to be as fast as Mike Rainbirds was (with 500hp), it's not going to be as fast as Martin Hadlands Escort (with 517hp), or probably Jay Browns Escort Cossie either. They're just cars I have personal experience of. Then theres Rod Tarry, Derek Burleigh, Sean Bicknell, various MAD cars etc etc.
So I pretty much know exactly how fast your car would be - no point bringing the scoob up as I've sold the engine to help fund the new project.
Once again you've missed the point
Well done on editing most of your posts - makes for a very convincing argument.
As to your offer, thanks but no thanks -it's not going to be as fast as Dingys (as his car has similar power and much less weight), it's not going to be as fast as Mike Rainbirds was (with 500hp), it's not going to be as fast as Martin Hadlands Escort (with 517hp), or probably Jay Browns Escort Cossie either. They're just cars I have personal experience of. Then theres Rod Tarry, Derek Burleigh, Sean Bicknell, various MAD cars etc etc.
So I pretty much know exactly how fast your car would be - no point bringing the scoob up as I've sold the engine to help fund the new project.
23 August 2002, 05:09 PM
#130
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SOrry, I don't class the Zorst as a mod....
GGR zorst are made at Magnex, they also create lots of back pressure.
GGR 330 escort made 286 on the rollers.....very powerful.
Here is my dyno sheet, should be new to you as GGR don't map, Dyno or RR there engines, this was for my old engine, new one made more power at same spec.
GGR zorst are made at Magnex, they also create lots of back pressure.
GGR 330 escort made 286 on the rollers.....very powerful.
Here is my dyno sheet, should be new to you as GGR don't map, Dyno or RR there engines, this was for my old engine, new one made more power at same spec.
23 August 2002, 05:10 PM
#131
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I have been in a MAD saff awesome and yes quicker than my own. Mine was built as a compromise and all i said for what I payed the performance it offers is unbeatable.
I never claimed it was the ultimate posing car which its not it looks cack but I don't care. The reyland escort is awesome to.
I edited my posts to reply to other people rather than write a new post.
Nobody has answered my question just how is an early subaru so much more mechanically advanced and superior than a cosworth. Fact of the matter is it isnt. It is mechanically inferior.
I never claimed it was the ultimate posing car which its not it looks cack but I don't care. The reyland escort is awesome to.
I edited my posts to reply to other people rather than write a new post.
Nobody has answered my question just how is an early subaru so much more mechanically advanced and superior than a cosworth. Fact of the matter is it isnt. It is mechanically inferior.
23 August 2002, 05:20 PM
#133
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Co55ie
Oh where to start?
Well maybe here:
"The most successful track car ever built bar none"
Nice sweeping statement, total crap of course, but nice sweeping statement none the less.
Oh yes, this one made me smile to:
"You lot seem to know sod all about cars in general"
I do hope you count yourself in on that one, may I even suggest at the top of the list. Your comments across this excellent Scooby site seem to reflect the fact you have partial knowledge of everything but full knowledge on nothing.
When they raced in touring cars, and I was there when they did, including when Eggenberger won at Bathhurst (yes I know they got DQ), they handled like **** and needed excellent drivers to get the most from them. Sure, they had massive power, though never much more than 560BHP in their heyday, but they were not built to handle all that power. In their day they were some of the most spectacular cars going but their day has gone.
Now this one, this one is a true classic:
"Most of you seem jealous as you cant mod your own cars to this specification and performance without absolutely massive costs".
Do you really think anyone on this or any other site would be jealous of you, do ya?
I could sell my car tomorrow and buy 3 of yours and some beer with the cash, but somehow it’s just not that attractive a proposition, I wonder why....
Remember this Co55ie, you can't polish a turd and the fact is, for all the money you spend on it, it will always be a turd. Cosworths are so 80’s it hurts and no matter how much you spend on it 80’s is where it will stay.
Take an 80’s Turbo F1 car, massive power, massive, but would not hold a candle to a modern F1 car around a lap and do you understand why that is Co55ie?
EVOLUTION our kid and that evolution is why your pile of over powered **** will stay a pile of **** on today’s roads.
And this one finally had to be mentioned:
“I have repeatedly pointed out that I am not interested in its looks only performance going back to the original point of this thread it will absolutely destroy a 911 turbo handling wise performance wise etc etc with regards to braking I have a six pot 343mm AP setup on my car with bias valve so could outbrake pretty much anything too including the ten tonne Porsche.”
God you have no idea how stupid this single statement makes you look, but then why would you?
I don’t ever want to stop you posting Co55ie, well it gives us so much to talk about, but your really are gormless.
I my mind I have an image of a spotty 22 year old, with a back to front baseball cap and a shell suit, I wonder why that is……
HM
Oh where to start?
Well maybe here:
"The most successful track car ever built bar none"
Nice sweeping statement, total crap of course, but nice sweeping statement none the less.
Oh yes, this one made me smile to:
"You lot seem to know sod all about cars in general"
I do hope you count yourself in on that one, may I even suggest at the top of the list. Your comments across this excellent Scooby site seem to reflect the fact you have partial knowledge of everything but full knowledge on nothing.
When they raced in touring cars, and I was there when they did, including when Eggenberger won at Bathhurst (yes I know they got DQ), they handled like **** and needed excellent drivers to get the most from them. Sure, they had massive power, though never much more than 560BHP in their heyday, but they were not built to handle all that power. In their day they were some of the most spectacular cars going but their day has gone.
Now this one, this one is a true classic:
"Most of you seem jealous as you cant mod your own cars to this specification and performance without absolutely massive costs".
Do you really think anyone on this or any other site would be jealous of you, do ya?
I could sell my car tomorrow and buy 3 of yours and some beer with the cash, but somehow it’s just not that attractive a proposition, I wonder why....
Remember this Co55ie, you can't polish a turd and the fact is, for all the money you spend on it, it will always be a turd. Cosworths are so 80’s it hurts and no matter how much you spend on it 80’s is where it will stay.
Take an 80’s Turbo F1 car, massive power, massive, but would not hold a candle to a modern F1 car around a lap and do you understand why that is Co55ie?
EVOLUTION our kid and that evolution is why your pile of over powered **** will stay a pile of **** on today’s roads.
And this one finally had to be mentioned:
“I have repeatedly pointed out that I am not interested in its looks only performance going back to the original point of this thread it will absolutely destroy a 911 turbo handling wise performance wise etc etc with regards to braking I have a six pot 343mm AP setup on my car with bias valve so could outbrake pretty much anything too including the ten tonne Porsche.”
God you have no idea how stupid this single statement makes you look, but then why would you?
I don’t ever want to stop you posting Co55ie, well it gives us so much to talk about, but your really are gormless.
I my mind I have an image of a spotty 22 year old, with a back to front baseball cap and a shell suit, I wonder why that is……
HM
23 August 2002, 05:23 PM
#134
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You gotta love that bottom end torque on the cossie 
......but 35 PSI boost 
Co55ie, I think it's just that people are not 'pushing' the scoob engine development like the cossie was.
I've taken a few 'risks' and now have approx 360 bhp for 1K spent.
I aim to break the 400 this year for well under 2K. As I said earlier it needs more development time in the uk, scoobs have only been out of warranty for 4 years (ie serious tuning time) compared to the cossie's 13 years. Go back 9 years in cossie development and outside of touring cars, the most powerful cossie was about 330bhp.
ps watch you don't fall through the floor on your Sierra
......but 35 PSI boost Co55ie, I think it's just that people are not 'pushing' the scoob engine development like the cossie was.
I've taken a few 'risks' and now have approx 360 bhp for 1K spent.
I aim to break the 400 this year for well under 2K. As I said earlier it needs more development time in the uk, scoobs have only been out of warranty for 4 years (ie serious tuning time) compared to the cossie's 13 years. Go back 9 years in cossie development and outside of touring cars, the most powerful cossie was about 330bhp.
ps watch you don't fall through the floor on your Sierra
23 August 2002, 05:24 PM
#135
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NeilF,
996's come in a few flaves.
996 C2 2 wheel drive
996 C4 4 wheel drive
various engine displacemets depending on MY
996 C4s wide bodied turbo look (what i had)
996 targa and cabs i will ignore
996 GT3 raceing version of normally aspirated 996.
996 Turbo (what i have) awesome car
996 GT2 Racing version of Turbo. £115k. Without doubt the most awesome sub £200k production car bar none. Did hold production car record at nurburgring.
996's come in a few flaves.
996 C2 2 wheel drive
996 C4 4 wheel drive
various engine displacemets depending on MY
996 C4s wide bodied turbo look (what i had)
996 targa and cabs i will ignore
996 GT3 raceing version of normally aspirated 996.
996 Turbo (what i have) awesome car
996 GT2 Racing version of Turbo. £115k. Without doubt the most awesome sub £200k production car bar none. Did hold production car record at nurburgring.
23 August 2002, 05:25 PM
#136
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Past Winners of the Great Race, from Mount Panarama! I can only find 2 Sierras mate 
1980 Peter Brock/Jim Richards AUS/NZ Holden Commodore VC
1981 Dick Johnson/John French AUS Ford Falcon XD
1982 Peter Brock/Larry Perkins AUS Holden Commodore VH
1983 Peter Brock/Larry Perkins/John Harvey AUS Holden Commodore VH
1984 Peter Brock/Larry Perkins AUS Holden Commodore VK
1985 John Goss/Armin Hahne AUS/D Jaguar XJS
1986 Allan Grice/Graeme Bailey AUS Holden Commodore VK
1987 Peter Brock/Peter McLeod/D.Parsons AUS Holden Commodore VL
1988 Tony Longhurst/Tomas Mezera AUS Ford Sierra RS500
1989 Dick Johnson/John Bowe AUS Ford Sierra RS500
1990 Allan Grice/Win Percy AUS/GB Holden Commodore
1991 Jim Richards/Mark Skaife NZ/AUS Nissan Skyline GTR
1992 Jim Richards/Mark Skaife NZ/AUS Nissan Skyline GTR
1993 Larry Perkins/Gregg Hansford AUS Holden Commodore
1994 Dick Johnson/John Bowe AUS Ford Falcon EB
1995
1996 Craig Lowndes/Greg Murphy AUS Holden Commodore
1997 Russell Ingall/Larry Perkins AUS Holden Commodore
1998 Jim Richards/Rickard Rydell NZ/S TWR Volvo S40
1980 Peter Brock/Jim Richards AUS/NZ Holden Commodore VC
1981 Dick Johnson/John French AUS Ford Falcon XD
1982 Peter Brock/Larry Perkins AUS Holden Commodore VH
1983 Peter Brock/Larry Perkins/John Harvey AUS Holden Commodore VH
1984 Peter Brock/Larry Perkins AUS Holden Commodore VK
1985 John Goss/Armin Hahne AUS/D Jaguar XJS
1986 Allan Grice/Graeme Bailey AUS Holden Commodore VK
1987 Peter Brock/Peter McLeod/D.Parsons AUS Holden Commodore VL
1988 Tony Longhurst/Tomas Mezera AUS Ford Sierra RS500
1989 Dick Johnson/John Bowe AUS Ford Sierra RS500
1990 Allan Grice/Win Percy AUS/GB Holden Commodore
1991 Jim Richards/Mark Skaife NZ/AUS Nissan Skyline GTR
1992 Jim Richards/Mark Skaife NZ/AUS Nissan Skyline GTR
1993 Larry Perkins/Gregg Hansford AUS Holden Commodore
1994 Dick Johnson/John Bowe AUS Ford Falcon EB
1995
1996 Craig Lowndes/Greg Murphy AUS Holden Commodore
1997 Russell Ingall/Larry Perkins AUS Holden Commodore
1998 Jim Richards/Rickard Rydell NZ/S TWR Volvo S40
23 August 2002, 05:35 PM
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Rich 1231.
Thanks for that. It would be the C2 then, unless they made a 3 wheel drive!
I'm not much of a fan of Porsche styling but this one looks quite reasonable and has a beatiful interior. The boot however isn't much bigger than an Elises! I'd imagined that all that space under the "bonnet" was dedicated to storage but its far from it.
Neil.
Thanks for that. It would be the C2 then, unless they made a 3 wheel drive!
I'm not much of a fan of Porsche styling but this one looks quite reasonable and has a beatiful interior. The boot however isn't much bigger than an Elises! I'd imagined that all that space under the "bonnet" was dedicated to storage but its far from it.
Neil.
23 August 2002, 05:36 PM
#142
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Careful E46M3....I'm only 23 and have one or two spots Don't have a cap or shellsuit though so I think I'm safe
Andy F... the reason co55ie agrees with you is because he's scared of what will happen if he hacks you off and you decide to prove that a sh1tty scooby with only 360bhp will beat his 500bhp cossie in a straight line and totally stuff it round a track
Don't have a cap or shellsuit though so I think I'm safe Andy F... the reason co55ie agrees with you is because he's scared of what will happen if he hacks you off and you decide to prove that a sh1tty scooby with only 360bhp will beat his 500bhp cossie in a straight line and totally stuff it round a track
23 August 2002, 05:43 PM
#143
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rich,
Sorry if it annoys you, but its really not that important to me and im sure you'll get over it, after all its only a couple of words though I know you don't use it down sowff
;-)
Sorry if it annoys you, but its really not that important to me and im sure you'll get over it, after all its only a couple of words though I know you don't use it down sowff
;-)
23 August 2002, 07:40 PM
#145
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Where to start?
Mr Co55ie, it sounds as though not much of your car is actually cossie, that you had to chuck away most of it and start again. How can you call Scoobies Rep mobiles with such disdain when your car was built in that very same mould? If it was sooo good why don't you take it along to Ford and tell them to put Mr McRae in it for the next WRC event since you are so convinced it can beat Imprezas and Evos. In fact why did Ford stop rallying them, if they were so good they shouldn't have moved on to the Focus.
As for you watching a GT2 disappear in your mirrors, with your 0-100 being a claimed 9.3 and the GT2's being 8.6 and an 11.7s quarter mile I think there is something wrong with your figures, or somethin you aren't telling us.
Back to the original point about Imprezas Vs Porsche, the argument against the Boxster is a bit unfair as they weren't built to be incredible fast in a straight line or they would have done damage to the sales of 911s. It was built to be the best of the 'affordable' roadsters, it's competition being M Roadsters and the like. I haven't driven one, but they are meant to be one of the most pleasurable cars to drive, beautifully balanced, responsive and communicative. A direct comparison is unfair because some people want more to driving than 0-60 and lateral G and the Porsche (apparently) provides this.
Mr Co55ie, it sounds as though not much of your car is actually cossie, that you had to chuck away most of it and start again. How can you call Scoobies Rep mobiles with such disdain when your car was built in that very same mould? If it was sooo good why don't you take it along to Ford and tell them to put Mr McRae in it for the next WRC event since you are so convinced it can beat Imprezas and Evos. In fact why did Ford stop rallying them, if they were so good they shouldn't have moved on to the Focus.
As for you watching a GT2 disappear in your mirrors, with your 0-100 being a claimed 9.3 and the GT2's being 8.6 and an 11.7s quarter mile I think there is something wrong with your figures, or somethin you aren't telling us.
Back to the original point about Imprezas Vs Porsche, the argument against the Boxster is a bit unfair as they weren't built to be incredible fast in a straight line or they would have done damage to the sales of 911s. It was built to be the best of the 'affordable' roadsters, it's competition being M Roadsters and the like. I haven't driven one, but they are meant to be one of the most pleasurable cars to drive, beautifully balanced, responsive and communicative. A direct comparison is unfair because some people want more to driving than 0-60 and lateral G and the Porsche (apparently) provides this.
23 August 2002, 08:45 PM
#147
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I think CO55IE is the FASTEST's new posting name ! any way guys i own a evo and a rs500 i love the evo to bits but no doubt you don't want to hear my biased opinions on the evo vs scoob. As for the cossie i love them and will never sell mine but they just aint in the same era as the scoob or the evo as a point 2 point car. But think back 16 years to what was comeing out of japan when ford gave us the cossie !
24 August 2002, 11:30 AM
#148
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Davy Boy, I think the only reason there are 2 years the Sierras won is coz they only ran for 3 years and were beaten by the R32 Skyline. I think, but don't quote me!
Anyway, time to get stuck in!! Sierras are awesome for straight line speed, very little can touch them.
They are also a proper "man's" car being rwd. You have to really learn all about car control, throttle control etc to drive one at a lick on the track.
Where my Sierra loses out on the track to the EVOs and Subarus is applying power coming out of corners. You have to feather the throttle for what seems like ages.
The bottom line is that the Sierras are FUN!! I have owned a 243hp Scooby, a 380hp R32 GTR and now the 404hp, 416lbs/ft Sierra.
I assure you the Sierra is much much quicker but then I have spent a lot on the brakes and suspension.
The real summary is that EVOs are a bit boring to drive in my opinion having driven a couple and been in a couple on the track they sort you out too much. Any muppet can get in them, stamp on the brakes, hurl the wheel, floor the throttle and hey presto they are storming down the straight. Scoobys however are much more fun giving almost rear wheel driving characteristics as long as you trail brake into corners. That was my experience.
So, Sierras = BIG FUN, Scoobys = almost as much fun, EVOs = boring as!!
Laters
Ben
p.s. Is it me or are Subarus a bit too common? When I had one they were cool, now just any fat nobody or an I.T. nerd drives them as a company car
[Edited by Light Blues - 8/24/2002 11:36:34 AM]
Anyway, time to get stuck in!! Sierras are awesome for straight line speed, very little can touch them.
They are also a proper "man's" car being rwd. You have to really learn all about car control, throttle control etc to drive one at a lick on the track.
Where my Sierra loses out on the track to the EVOs and Subarus is applying power coming out of corners. You have to feather the throttle for what seems like ages.
The bottom line is that the Sierras are FUN!! I have owned a 243hp Scooby, a 380hp R32 GTR and now the 404hp, 416lbs/ft Sierra.
I assure you the Sierra is much much quicker but then I have spent a lot on the brakes and suspension.
The real summary is that EVOs are a bit boring to drive in my opinion having driven a couple and been in a couple on the track they sort you out too much. Any muppet can get in them, stamp on the brakes, hurl the wheel, floor the throttle and hey presto they are storming down the straight. Scoobys however are much more fun giving almost rear wheel driving characteristics as long as you trail brake into corners. That was my experience.
So, Sierras = BIG FUN, Scoobys = almost as much fun, EVOs = boring as!!
Laters
Ben
p.s. Is it me or are Subarus a bit too common? When I had one they were cool, now just any fat nobody or an I.T. nerd drives them as a company car
[Edited by Light Blues - 8/24/2002 11:36:34 AM]
24 August 2002, 12:20 PM
#149
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I was gonna say something bout 10 of the best as well. Like Cossie Rally car vs Road going Skyline. Now how about swapping that with a Race bred skyline, bi bi mr Cossie. On any race track, not a bloody twisty handling circuit, Ronnie's Skyline would have eaten that Cossie, which also had to have 7 gears to help it go fast. Also Skylines were so fsat they got banned from Bathurst which is why they dont fearture and more. And dont go on about the handling of a skyline, all those electronics will beat any mechanical system hands down, thats just life......
And what makes me laugh even more was at the RS show a while back, fastest car on the day was a GTi-R LOL
Nad
And what makes me laugh even more was at the RS show a while back, fastest car on the day was a GTi-R LOL
Nad
26 August 2002, 12:17 AM
#150
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Ok guys
I have a cossie a dyno proven 400+ bhp and steve dingy and others know
the handling on a cossie is not brillant to be honest Right!!
but if any of you think that your scooby is good on a TRACK and the handling is awesome i know 2 Escort cossie's that you won't pass or lap
1,is Steve's Scott orange WRC Escort cossie only has (300bhp) if you see it try and race it ,you will see how good it is
2 Grarth Llodys Escort cossie these i will put my money where my mouth is on this.........sorry to bring any scooby........
so none of you were at the top ten then i know Jonh fest was there
I have a cossie a dyno proven 400+ bhp and steve dingy and others know
the handling on a cossie is not brillant to be honest Right!!
but if any of you think that your scooby is good on a TRACK and the handling is awesome i know 2 Escort cossie's that you won't pass or lap
1,is Steve's Scott orange WRC Escort cossie only has (300bhp) if you see it try and race it ,you will see how good it is
2 Grarth Llodys Escort cossie these i will put my money where my mouth is on this.........sorry to bring any scooby........
so none of you were at the top ten then i know Jonh fest was there