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So Brexit seems to be a good thing then.

Old 18 November 2016, 02:05 PM
  #181  
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Originally Posted by hodgy0_2 View Post
yes, its the whinging blame culture we have

always someone else's fault for people **** lives
Indeed, I see it as a bit of a disease of a certain segment of British white working men as it doesn't appear to affect the Indians, Pakistani, Chinese, Jamaican or Polish people that come to the UK, along with the mentality that they are somehow too good to do certain jobs, even when they don't have a qualification to their name, after all it's the main reason the UK needs to import workers along with a generally poor attitude towards working hard, which was also part of the reason for the demise of large parts of British industry like the car industry, Nothing to do with the imported labour force 'stealing' jobs as the industries probably would of come to a standstill if not for imported labour, they were often bought to a standstill by the Unions and closed shop practices, no surprise companies want to move to places where people want to work.

I'll bet that this contingent were a large percentage of the leave voters, ironically they will probably suffer more as prices rise and work in unskilled sectors declines.

Last edited by ditchmyster; 18 November 2016 at 02:08 PM.
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Old 18 November 2016, 02:36 PM
  #182  
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More of the usual IAJFEE stuff from you ditchy.

How many of these unqualified lazy whingers do you actually KNOW?

And how many young people with worthless degrees, promised a better future by Lying labour if they got a degree?
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Old 18 November 2016, 02:37 PM
  #183  
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Originally Posted by hodgy0_2 View Post
yes, its the whinging blame culture we have

always someone else's fault for people **** lives

I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself.

D.H.Lawrence
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Old 18 November 2016, 03:05 PM
  #184  
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Originally Posted by ditchmyster View Post
Indeed, I see it as a bit of a disease of a certain segment of British white working men as it doesn't appear to affect the Indians, Pakistani, Chinese, Jamaican or Polish people that come to the UK, along with the mentality that they are somehow too good to do certain jobs, even when they don't have a qualification to their name, after all it's the main reason the UK needs to import workers along with a generally poor attitude towards working hard, which was also part of the reason for the demise of large parts of British industry like the car industry, Nothing to do with the imported labour force 'stealing' jobs as the industries probably would of come to a standstill if not for imported labour, they were often bought to a standstill by the Unions and closed shop practices, no surprise companies want to move to places where people want to work.

I'll bet that this contingent were a large percentage of the leave voters, ironically they will probably suffer more as prices rise and work in unskilled sectors declines.
yes, I mentioned a while ago a scene form a documentary on the Kent UKippers

It was two construction workers sitting in the Ramsgate (I think) UKIP office complaining that they used to only have to work till 4.00pm-ish and have a 3 or 4 tea breaks a day - EU workers worked till 6 or even 7

and they were now out of a job

deluded did not come into it

bless!!!
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Old 18 November 2016, 03:06 PM
  #185  
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Originally Posted by alcazar View Post
More of the usual IAJFEE stuff from you ditchy.

How many of these unqualified lazy whingers do you actually KNOW?

And how many young people with worthless degrees, promised a better future by Lying labour if they got a degree?
I have no idea what that means and google didn't appear to either.

I'll assume i'm being called a racist of some sort for pointing out something that I have seen over many years.

I don't know any personally because they're not the sort of people I associate with, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, it's a cultural thing in my mind which stems from the concept of 'Great Britain' National pride is no bad thing but it's brought along with it a superiority complex that has had and continues to have a negative effect.

It's an observation which I first made when I worked at Raleigh Cycles where the real dirty crappy jobs were done by the foreigners as the indigenous population refused to do them even the bloke who swept up was black all the cleaners were black women, the whole place functioned like it, strangely enough much like today the worst of it was handed out to the Polish workers.

As for getting a degree and being promised a better job I refer you back to my original comment about people expecting things to be handed to them, One has to get out there and grab the world by the scruff of the neck, not just go to school and expect it to fall at your feet when you finnish your course.

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Old 18 November 2016, 03:10 PM
  #186  
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I'm alright Jack, f**k everyone else.
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Old 18 November 2016, 03:26 PM
  #187  
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Originally Posted by joz8968 View Post
I'm alright Jack, f**k everyone else.
Indeed, but I applaud anyone that is doing well for themselves, yet a certain segment of uk society seems to poor scorn on hard work and the rewards it brings, they want the phones and TV's eat at maccydees and order a take out every weekend, fish and chips on a friday night, few pints down the pub and can't see that's why they've got **** all and complain they can't afford to live in a 4 bed detached in a posh area.
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Old 18 November 2016, 03:33 PM
  #188  
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Originally Posted by joz8968 View Post
I'm alright Jack, f**k everyone else.


Just got it.
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Old 18 November 2016, 03:44 PM
  #189  
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And actually I don't think like that, I like to inspire people, god knows I spent enough years in the wilderness heading in the wrong direction, doing the things i've said above, after all I am British born and breed, but I broke out of the cycle and recognised the system for what it is, which is why I tell people to channel their energy into something constructive for themselves instead of being bogged down by all the crap in the world get your head into something and keep pushing, small steps still get you somewhere, they just do it a little bit slower, if I can do it everyone else can, you just have to want it bad enough.
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Old 18 November 2016, 03:50 PM
  #190  
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lol

Yes, I was just explaining what that acronym was (seeing as you didn't know).

No judgement on my part, one way or t'other.

Just being the messenger lol

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Old 18 November 2016, 04:55 PM
  #191  
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This article highlights why the notion of Britain becoming some great manufacturing nation again is utterly misguided. OK, this actually pertains to Apple, but the true hold same for many Western nations.


OK, the German still make shed loads of cars in Germany, but we're not the Germans, nor do we make cars like them
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Old 18 November 2016, 05:12 PM
  #192  
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Originally Posted by ditchmyster View Post
People used to say to me that I had a real chip on my shoulder, I couldn't see it at the time but looking back they were right, you have one too but there's a difference between you and me in that I used my chip to my advantage, you just seem to sit about complaining, I have met many people like you over the years, you're like a big black hole sucking the life out of yourself and everything and one you come into contact with, spreading negativity, even over the internet I can feel it.

You're right though I have done a lot of things, not necessarily better than everyone else but at least I tried if I wasn't happy with something in my life I did something about it I couldn't afford to live in the fancy areas so I went to where I could afford it and made it happen by doing what needed to be done, a lesson you may want to learn from your co workers that leave their families in search of a better life for their offspring, Like I said previously you're the sort that thinks because he's a white man born in the UK that you have some sort of right to be given everything in life and that it shouldn't be so hard to get ahead wake up and smell the coffee pal, Life is difficult, it won't get better by complaining about it.

We are all the masters of our own destiny.

FYI it has taken me about 20yrs to get here and I still have a fair way to go, also the harder I try and the more I do for myself and my family the luckier I get. Strange that.
Pmsl, enough of the amateur psychology!
I was working before I'd left school. I moved away from home at the age of 16 to get an apprenticeship. By 19 I'd changed industry completely after gaining my qualifications. It's the same industry I'm in now. I've done all shifts, all aspects within that industry and spent a large amount of that doing 18 hour days. The people around me nominated me to be their supervisor, funny that, as I'm a black hole that sucks the life out of everything lol. I moved jobs as a low level manager on one shift, put the hours in at a legendary time in the business and got promoted. I'm currently running my own depot, I choose my hours but am the first to volounteer as I believe in leading by example. I'm employing, training and moulding my own people. We opened less than 2 weeks ago and sit at the very top of 60+ depots nationwide. At this time of year I'm working 7 days a week, starting at all times of day depending on where I think there may be a problem.
I organise nights out with my staff, have a bloody good relationship with them all. You are very welcome to look in on my Facebook, check out all the European chaps I'm pissed up with. Or I can send you a picture of my team, all holding placards saying we are the best in the network. That picture was taken Wednesday.
In the past year 2 of our leading competitors have approached me to go and work for them. They did so on the reccomendation from ex members of my staff.

However I've turned down promotion on a number of occasions. There is no overtime above my level, and stupidly without overtime I'd be financially worse off than I currently am. My wife works, she's gone from a clerk to a supervisor within a year. My 3 kids are at school, all attend clubs etc.

I'm not angry, the money is there if I wanted it but I don't. I could quite easily sell the type r for a shed load more than I paid for it. Could return the wife's car she got new a couple of years ago.

Life's too short the kids are young I'm not missing out on their childhood for material possessions. Judging by their behaviour compared to the middle class ****wits' kids it's definitely the right decision.

So in summary, your amateur attempt to define me is very poor lol. Come and spend the day with me at work, I guarantee the 'war zone' like pressure in my job would see you crying your eyes out in the corner. It's definitely an industry which defines a lot of people and certainly I'd say 'or I think lol' the majority couldn't handle it.

Last edited by Kwik; 18 November 2016 at 05:25 PM.
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Old 18 November 2016, 05:36 PM
  #193  
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Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
I was working before I'd left school. I moved away from home at the age of 16 to get an apprenticeship. By 19 I'd changed industry completely after gaining my qualifications. It's the same industry I'm in now. I've done all shifts, all aspects within that industry and spent a large amount of that doing 18 hour days. The people around me nominated me to be their supervisor, funny that, as I'm a black hole that sucks the life out of everything lol. I moved jobs as a low level manager on one shift, put the hours in at a legendary time in the business and got promoted. I'm currently running my own depot, I choose my hours but am the first to volounteer as I believe in leading by example. I'm employing, training and moulding my own people. We opened less than 2 weeks ago and sit at the very top of 60+ depots nationwide. At this time of year I'm working 7 days a week, starting at all times of day depending on where I think there may be a problem.
I organise nights out with my staff, have a bloody good relationship with them all. You are very welcome to look in on my Facebook, check out all the European chaps I'm pissed up with. Or I can send you a picture of my team, all holding placards saying we are the best in the network. That picture was taken Wednesday.
In the past year 2 of our leading competitors have approached me to go and work for them. They did so on the reccomendation from ex members of my staff.

However I've turned down promotion on a number of occasions. There is no overtime above my level, and stupidly without overtime I'd be financially worse off than I currently am. My wife works, she's gone from a clerk to a supervisor within a year. My 3 kids are at school, all attend clubs etc.

I'm not angry, the money is there if I wanted it but I don't. I could quite easily sell the type r for a shed load more than I paid for it. Could return the wife's car she got new a couple of years ago.

Life's too short the kids are young I'm not missing out on their childhood for material possessions. Judging by their behaviour compared to the middle class ****wits' kids it's definitely the right decision.

So in summary, your amateur attempt to define me is very poor lol. Come and spend the day with me at work, I guarantee the 'war zone' like pressure in my job would see you crying your eyes out in the corner. It's definitely an industry which defines a lot of people and certainly I'd say 'or I think lol' the majority couldn't handle it.
So you're doing alright for yourself and your family. That's good. It's all happened for you with the UK being part of the EU. So why did you vote for the unknown, putting it all at risk? What was so bad in your life that you needed change, no matter what it may actually be?
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Old 18 November 2016, 05:51 PM
  #194  
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@Kwik

Good for you.

In one breath you say you can't afford to buy a house and in the next you say life is too short and you don't want to miss out on it.

So the reality is that you're choosing one over the other which is basically what I have been saying and effectively you're complaining about your choices.

You can't have it both ways mate.

I wasn't trying to analyse you, you just come across as such a miserable git, so much so you give Alcazar a run for his money.
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Old 18 November 2016, 06:53 PM
  #195  
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Originally Posted by Sad Weevil View Post
So you're doing alright for yourself and your family. That's good. It's all happened for you with the UK being part of the EU. So why did you vote for the unknown, putting it all at risk? What was so bad in your life that you needed change, no matter what it may actually be?
As I've eluded to before my company is a U.K. Based company. And as I've said before my company will definitely benefit from leaving the EU in comparison to some of our competition which are international companies.
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Old 18 November 2016, 07:11 PM
  #196  
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Originally Posted by ditchmyster View Post
@Kwik

Good for you.

In one breath you say you can't afford to buy a house and in the next you say life is too short and you don't want to miss out on it.

So the reality is that you're choosing one over the other which is basically what I have been saying and effectively you're complaining about your choices.

You can't have it both ways mate.

I wasn't trying to analyse you, you just come across as such a miserable git, so much so you give Alcazar a run for his money.
Ditch, you're not getting it. My parents bought our house when we were kids at the age of 21 for 18,000. This was a new built 4 bedroom house in a brand new estate bang next to an airport so work was always available.
My current house is valued at 300k, and that's a very conservative estimate as the council devalue their properties.
It's not a posh area at all, the houses were built in the 50's and its almost a retirement village. Similar houses to mine less than a mile away as the crow flies in the 'posh areas' are well over half a million.

I can only imagine you are alone. I can't remember if you have children that live with you?
It certainly doesn't sound like you have a wife that also works and have to balance your life around their job, kids, kids activities etc. I can't imagine you have the faintest idea about the costs of childcare and how that drives a lot of women out of working.
You don't appear to live a 'normal' life. I'm lucky, my hard work put me in a position to earn a little extra.
Even with me and the wife working buying our house would be a massive struggle. The average family cannot afford to buy a house, this isn't my opinion it's a fact look into it. That's why there is currently 'a housing crisis'!.

It's also not so much about hard work. You need to weigh up people's options to understand why they are the way they are.
Why buy a house when your kids will get charged 40% when you die and they sell it?
Why buy it when you can have free maintenance for life?
Why bother working more than 20hrs when the government will pay your rent, council tax and give you a few quid as well?.
Why not claim any benefit you can, class your kid as 'special' and reap the cash rewards?.
This is england today. Unfortunately 'do some overtime' isn't always the answer.
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Old 18 November 2016, 07:24 PM
  #197  
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Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
As I've eluded to before my company is a U.K. Based company. And as I've said before my company will definitely benefit from leaving the EU in comparison to some of our competition which are international companies.
How do you know your company will benefit? How has it suffered from the EU? What will post-brexit UK look like, business-wise?
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Old 18 November 2016, 07:30 PM
  #198  
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Only have look news, the benefits been immediate
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Old 18 November 2016, 07:33 PM
  #199  
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Probably ease its way down from the North East , eventually reaching London
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Old 18 November 2016, 07:42 PM
  #200  
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Let's look at this as it is right now.

A few brexiters have agreed with me and dissapeared. They agreed they don't tend to say anything as they just get beaten down by the baying mob. How many didn't bother to post for the very same reason?.
You're all so blind to see that the MAJORITY disagree with you. You're all so blinded by your own opinion that you didn't think the vote would go the way it did.
People, including me had a genuine reason to vote leave. Not racist, not Ill informed, not bigoted. They were as informed as the remain voters, as in not informed at all really.

Rather than try to understand why it's easier to label the brexit voters as idiotic, name call, believe the propaganda that says we're all doomed, believe the hand picked interviews and stick your head in the sand yet again.

Look back on this thread. Gang mentality, bullying if you like, intellectual snobbery when you don't know what's really going on right in front of you. Borderline racism, bigotry (means to not accept others political views btw), labelling groups of people.
Notice there isn't any racism, bigotry or name calling coming from the brexit voters.

And that's what happened. 17m people feeling like they aren't allowed to speak in case they are ridiculed for their own opinions, branded racist, thick, knuckle draggers etc etc. But they had a voice in the voting booth.

Perhaps it would be worth doing something I don't think you've ever done. Open your mind. Try to understand those in a different social and financial position to your own.

And a little hint about racism. If you can't replace the word white with black in a sentence then it is racist. We live in an equal world, where it is as unacceptable to categorise groups of white people as it is black people, Chinese, Europeans etc.
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Old 18 November 2016, 07:53 PM
  #201  
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Originally Posted by Sad Weevil View Post
How do you know your company will benefit? How has it suffered from the EU? What will post-brexit UK look like, business-wise?
Nobody knows what post brexit uk business will be like. Not you, not anyone. Pointless question.
Some experts say it will be worse some say better.

The EU is stagnant, still people pick on my points but not that one. Staying in the EU meant we were part of the slowest growing economy in the world. That point really hurts ALL your arguements.
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Old 18 November 2016, 08:21 PM
  #202  
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Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
You're all so blind to see that the MAJORITY disagree with you. You're all so blinded by your own opinion that you didn't think the vote would go the way it did.
Just on a point of fact, the majority of the people who voted disagree, you do not know whether the majority of the population disagree.

Of course, it's a moot point in the question of the referendum result, and I accept that the majority of people who didn't vote could have voted to leave.

But, Farcage had been quite vocal about there being a second referendum if the result had been, funnily enough, the exact opposite of what it was, so the fact that the very near same amount of people who voted to leave not being quiet about it, is not really surprising, is it? I can imagine what UKIP would have been like.


This was always going to happen, it's very devisive.

As for your point about everyone who voted Leave being a racist, or xenophobe, of course they were not. However, I would be willing to place a fairly large bet that all the racist xenophobes voted leave. That is quite an important point.
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Old 18 November 2016, 08:28 PM
  #203  
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Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
Nobody knows what post brexit uk business will be like. Not you, not anyone. Pointless question.
Some experts say it will be worse some say better.

The EU is stagnant, still people pick on my points but not that one. Staying in the EU meant we were part of the slowest growing economy in the world. That point really hurts ALL your arguements.
Still, it is growing. I will be interested to hear your views if we contract post Brexit. Slow growth is better than none, is it not?

Early signs for isolationist Britain in trading are not good. One of our major hopes, ironically, may be Trump, and not because he likes us, but because if he steps away from NATO, the UK, as Europe's biggest military power, may have more of a bargaining chip in any discussions. The EU may have to concede things they say are sacrosanct.

On the flip side of that, Trump is making big noises about how free trade have hurt America, do you really think he is going to give is free trade?

Interesting (and worrying) times ahead

Last edited by Geezer; 18 November 2016 at 08:29 PM.
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Old 18 November 2016, 09:09 PM
  #204  
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Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
Let's look at this as it is right now.

A few brexiters have agreed with me and dissapeared. They agreed they don't tend to say anything as they just get beaten down by the baying mob. How many didn't bother to post for the very same reason?.
You're all so blind to see that the MAJORITY disagree with you. You're all so blinded by your own opinion that you didn't think the vote would go the way it did.
People, including me had a genuine reason to vote leave. Not racist, not Ill informed, not bigoted. They were as informed as the remain voters, as in not informed at all really.

Rather than try to understand why it's easier to label the brexit voters as idiotic, name call, believe the propaganda that says we're all doomed, believe the hand picked interviews and stick your head in the sand yet again.

Look back on this thread. Gang mentality, bullying if you like, intellectual snobbery when you don't know what's really going on right in front of you. Borderline racism, bigotry (means to not accept others political views btw), labelling groups of people.
Notice there isn't any racism, bigotry or name calling coming from the brexit voters.

And that's what happened. 17m people feeling like they aren't allowed to speak in case they are ridiculed for their own opinions, branded racist, thick, knuckle draggers etc etc. But they had a voice in the voting booth.

Perhaps it would be worth doing something I don't think you've ever done. Open your mind. Try to understand those in a different social and financial position to your own.

And a little hint about racism. If you can't replace the word white with black in a sentence then it is racist. We live in an equal world, where it is as unacceptable to categorise groups of white people as it is black people, Chinese, Europeans etc.
I do love it when Brexiteers do that
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Old 18 November 2016, 09:57 PM
  #205  
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Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
Nobody knows what post brexit uk business will be like. Not you, not anyone.
My point exactly. So how are you so sure that your employer's business will be better off?

Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
The EU is stagnant, still people pick on my points but not that one. Staying in the EU meant we were part of the slowest growing economy in the world.
Ok, picking on that point, it's totally not true.
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Old 18 November 2016, 10:02 PM
  #206  
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if 365 whites had drowned just today there'd be total uproar !
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Old 18 November 2016, 10:18 PM
  #207  
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Originally Posted by Kwik View Post
Ditch, you're not getting it. My parents bought our house when we were kids at the age of 21 for 18,000. This was a new built 4 bedroom house in a brand new estate bang next to an airport so work was always available.
My current house is valued at 300k, and that's a very conservative estimate as the council devalue their properties.
It's not a posh area at all, the houses were built in the 50's and its almost a retirement village. Similar houses to mine less than a mile away as the crow flies in the 'posh areas' are well over half a million.

I can only imagine you are alone. I can't remember if you have children that live with you?
It certainly doesn't sound like you have a wife that also works and have to balance your life around their job, kids, kids activities etc. I can't imagine you have the faintest idea about the costs of childcare and how that drives a lot of women out of working.
You don't appear to live a 'normal' life. I'm lucky, my hard work put me in a position to earn a little extra.
Even with me and the wife working buying our house would be a massive struggle. The average family cannot afford to buy a house, this isn't my opinion it's a fact look into it. That's why there is currently 'a housing crisis'!.

It's also not so much about hard work. You need to weigh up people's options to understand why they are the way they are.
Why buy a house when your kids will get charged 40% when you die and they sell it?
Why buy it when you can have free maintenance for life?
Why bother working more than 20hrs when the government will pay your rent, council tax and give you a few quid as well?.
Why not claim any benefit you can, class your kid as 'special' and reap the cash rewards?.
This is england today. Unfortunately 'do some overtime' isn't always the answer.
Wow that's amazing, you've described my life down to a tee.

House prices are all relative, if I could have moved my first one a mile down the road I could have sold it for 3 times what I got for it, and my current one in the UK would be worth at least double if I could move it a mile up the road.

You talk as though all houses cost 300/500k around the corner from me there are two and 3 bed houses that sell for about 110k to 150k the 3 beds are quite nice too. There are 3 bed houses in the UK that sell for less than that too so it's not all doom and gloom and there is nothing to stop you and others relocating, considering your in such high demand it shouldn't be a big problem, but again it comes down to people having there expectations set too high, looking at 4 bed detached when a 2/3bed terraced would be fine, if people move across the world another area isn't really a big deal in the greater scheme of things.

Just lol at the reasons not to buy a house, lets not even get out of bed because the world is a dangerous place.

A house is probably the best thing to put money into and considering a large proportion of renters are basically paying someone elses mortgage for them it seems stupid not to have it in your own name, well that's how I got into buying a house anyway.
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Old 19 November 2016, 12:16 PM
  #208  
alcazar
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Originally Posted by hodgy0_2 View Post
yes, I mentioned a while ago a scene form a documentary on the Kent UKippers

It was two construction workers sitting in the Ramsgate (I think) UKIP office complaining that they used to only have to work till 4.00pm-ish and have a 3 or 4 tea breaks a day - EU workers worked till 6 or even 7

and they were now out of a job

deluded did not come into it

bless!!!
More b/s from our resident b/s-er.

My lads both work(ed) long hours. My eldest was at work for 7am, finished at 4pm, got an hour for lunch. Steelworks, plater. Now at uni doing a Mech Eng. degree. And his work was brutal, often came home utterly filthy and working in conditions not many on here would do: inside furnaces or on top of live coke-ovens. The furnaces are never allowed to go completely cold, so conditions inside are miserable.

My youngest works for a stainless manufacturer in their labs. He does 12 hour shifts, with 45 minutes each way traveling. Last week he worked 84 hours. With another TEN hours driving to and from.

Meanwhile, over in France, they start at 8am, but EVERYTHING stops at 12 midday until 1430 for lunch. They resume and work until 6 or maybe seven.

Their supermarkets and most shops, works etc open at 9.30 am, shut at midday until 1445, reopen until 1900. They open 0930 to 1145 on Sundays. MOST shops don't open at all on Sundays.

THREE times now, I've ordered stuff in June, been told "ten to fourteen days" and then had some guy inform me it would be September before I got delivery, since, and I quote, "The factory is closed for summer". yes, two whole months.

YOU are simply repeating untruths and propaganda.
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Old 19 November 2016, 12:20 PM
  #209  
alcazar
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It's an observation which I first made when I worked at Raleigh Cycles where the real dirty crappy jobs were done by the foreigners as the indigenous population refused to do them even the bloke who swept up was black all the cleaners were black women, the whole place functioned like it, strangely enough much like today the worst of it was handed out to the Polish workers.
The horrid, filthy jobs on the works here USED to be done by a team of local labourers, supplemented in the summer "stop periods" by local students.

Now they are all agency and foreigners. Why?
Cheaper.
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Old 19 November 2016, 01:38 PM
  #210  
markjmd
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Originally Posted by alcazar View Post
More b/s from our resident b/s-er.

My lads both work(ed) long hours. My eldest was at work for 7am, finished at 4pm, got an hour for lunch. Steelworks, plater. Now at uni doing a Mech Eng. degree. And his work was brutal, often came home utterly filthy and working in conditions not many on here would do: inside furnaces or on top of live coke-ovens. The furnaces are never allowed to go completely cold, so conditions inside are miserable.

My youngest works for a stainless manufacturer in their labs. He does 12 hour shifts, with 45 minutes each way traveling. Last week he worked 84 hours. With another TEN hours driving to and from.

Meanwhile, over in France, they start at 8am, but EVERYTHING stops at 12 midday until 1430 for lunch. They resume and work until 6 or maybe seven.

Their supermarkets and most shops, works etc open at 9.30 am, shut at midday until 1445, reopen until 1900. They open 0930 to 1145 on Sundays. MOST shops don't open at all on Sundays.

THREE times now, I've ordered stuff in June, been told "ten to fourteen days" and then had some guy inform me it would be September before I got delivery, since, and I quote, "The factory is closed for summer". yes, two whole months.

YOU are simply repeating untruths and propaganda.
Just to point out two quite obvious but very important facts, France isn't the entire EU, and the conditions you describe there come at the price of an unemployment rate that hasn't dipped below double-digits since the 1970s.
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