Theres a gig for Children in Need on the 18th Nov at The Hard Rock Cafe London. 1 of the bands I like happen to be playing which is how I foound out about it.

Anyway I decided to ring Hard Rock to ask about T+C's on cameras at the event as I couldn't find them anywhere. Well, I have just had what is know as a result :D After answering the sales managers questions on why I was ringing, and the whole rigmarole of being mistaken for pro kit I now have written permission to take my gear in :D :D :D

You are looking at 1 happy snapper :D

I'm really happy for you Simon. I hope you enjoy it and enjoy the event to the max!!!

As this will hopefully be my first go at a decent stage setup with no flash. Some of the pics will be appearing here for critique.

I'm still in shock, I can't believe how easy it was to get the permission.

Still I've managed to confuse a few people :D For me I couldn't care less about the gigs, its the photographing of gigs that I enjoy, the fact a band I like is playing makes it all the more enjoyable for me, something my friends can't understand.

I honestly think you probably will need flash if they will let you use it (defintely go for rear and slow-synch). When I was shooting gigs -- albeit a long time ago now...anyone remember the Ramones, Siouxsie and the Banshees, Slaughter and the Dogs, The Cure, etc. etc.?) I used Ilford HP5 rated at 1600 and processed in Paterson Acuspeed for 16 minutes (thankyou Pennie Smith) and got some amazing results which were often published in Sounds, NME and Melody Maker. Digitally, I haven't even tried shooting at higher ISO's as I've found that the noise above ISO640 starts to really bother me and requires quite a bit of processing to get acceptable results.

STi-Frenchie, can you look at www.dannyclifford.com (especially his live shots of Bon Jovi) and tell me what techniques you think he is using please. I'd love to try and recreate the effects he's got there. I'm sure if I asked a couple of bands I know they would let me into their gigs to practice (which I need in truck loads).

Sorry to pick your brains on this, hope you don't mind :D

And yes I do rememeber Siouxsie and the Banshees and The Clash, I may be just sub 30, but I have a wide and varied taste in music :D

No worries Simon, I had a look (great link BTW, I enjoyed looking at many of the galleries)...he certainly isn't using flash -- Lenny Kravitz's glasses would have given it away -- and is simply using the stage lighting. In the Zucchero images I think he used some fill flash for the shot with Annie Lennox. The Bon Jovi, and other live pics look like they have been taken with a fast lens wide open as the backgrounds are very much out of focus which would suggest that he is shooting at f/2 or more. I was a bit disappointed with the Beyonce shots but still...they weren't half bad :)

Simon, the links below may also offer you some insight into shooting gigs:

http://www.apogeephoto.com/dec2000/rock_concert_photography.shtml

http://www.photo.net/learn/concerts/mirarchi/concer_i

Cheers for the links :D I'm in on OT tonight so I have 8 hours I can devote to studying them :D


Doesn't anyone want to buy 50mm primes anymore? I've just had a look at warehouse express's website, they have the following up at stupid prices.

AF 50mm @ F1.8 for £97
AF 50mm @ F1.4 for £216

These are both Nikkor lenses too :eek:

Any thoughts?

I've found that the noise above ISO640 starts to really bother me and requires quite a bit of processing to get acceptable results.

Not with a Canon! ;)

To be serious for a minute, ISO 800 should be plenty, depending on how bright the stage lighting is. Rear curtain sync flash could give you some nice results, but I would keep it to a minimum, as too much could annoy the band and audience.

Stage lighting will give you nice colour casts, which is essential to capture the 'live' feel of the event. A bit of grain just enhances that look to be honest. As for techniques, I would suggest shooting wide open and use manual focus, but just have a play around, after all you can take hundreds of shots and see what works best :)

I took these with a Canon Powershot S40, which has horrible shutter delay and only 4mp and I think they turned out OK :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v190/homerdog/tommy.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v190/homerdog/styx.jpg

General opinion is that the 1.8 is sharper than the 1.4.

I had a 1.8 and it was very nice but due to my limited time, talent and artistic vision, I got shot of it. It was just sitting in a drawer.
I like the flexibilty of my zooms and until I can use them properly, I'm resticting my prime purchases!!

Hee hee, looks like I have a phone call to Wharehouse Express on Tuesday :D

Daryl, that is the sort of thing I want to achieve. My only problem is I don't know what the venue is like or the satge for that matter. Now HRC only has a capacity of 200, so is a small place by venue standards. I just hope the have a couple of follow spots or Goldenscans lighting the stage. Parcans are nice for fill in light but useless for highlight illumination.

Don't dis the parcan, this will be where most of your lighting will come from, and if the angles are good, and you have nice colour contrst you will get a great looking picture. Anyway Golden scans are so old hat, too big and heavy and with very limited use.

Just remember, video is the new lighting...

Russell. Lighting designer.

Russell, I wasn't knocking Parcans at all, I've seen some very clever stuff done with them, and clever stuff done with Varilight kit too. But on the flip side, I've also seen stage sets that have only had Parcans on but could have done with some extra "zing".

The more I read on this subject the more aware I become, I'm heading for a major fall. Following the comments in 1 of Sti Frenchie's links, I've just tried pointing both my lenses around my house to see what shutter speeds its reading. :eek:

All I'll say is I'm in trouble, I can't hold the 70 - 200 steady at 200 @F2.8, I really hope its a well lit stage. Problem with lens I need to be 1.5 meters away from the subject, thats gonna put me in the crowd for this event.

Which is why you need faster than 2.8 if you aren't going to/be allowed to use flash. Try raising the ISO to 640 or 800 and shooting with a 50mm 1.8 or 1.4 and you should get into the right shutter speed bracket for handholding...a 50mm non-digital lens will get you about 75mm which isn't at all bad for shooting from the side or to the front left or right of the stage at a small venue. If the band are a metal band forget trying to shoot from the mosh pit!

Thankfully its not a metal event :D Well hopefully a 50mm prime will be here tomorrow. As soon as I've finished this course at work, then I'm going shopping for 1 it being payday and all that :D

I'm even tempted to get a couple of rolls of B+W for the Canon as thats got a 50mm prime already on it (the only lens I own for it) :D

I am finding with most theatre stuff I am having to shoot at 800ISO and using a tripod as I am in the 1/80 to 1/100 region even at f2.8, also remember to meter off the object/person not the lights or the background. You are not only faced with the problem of you shaking the camera, but also the subject moving about a lot!!!!

I keep meaning to try and go to a gig with the intention of taking photos, but never get the oppertunity...

Yeah, I learn't the spot meter off the person trick the hard way :mad:

Then a mate of mine, and the second photographer for www.upandcoming.tk (me being the other 1) told me what to do, makes perfect sense if I'd sat down an thought about it.

The problems I'm faced with at the mo, are
1) I don't know what the venue looks like (and haven't got a chance to recce)
2) Don't know what teh stage setup will be and my location to it.

With the 70 - 200 @F2.8 I can just hit 1/125th, which is ok, I can hold 100mm steady enough @F2.8 for my needs.

With the band I'm interested in shooting on Friday, thankfully they don't move around too much, but me being me told them I'm expecting plenty of showing off, I think I may have just shot myself in the foot.

Still practice makes perfect :D

If you can, try and have a word with the lighting techie and have him tell you what the plans for the lighting are for the songs they will be playing. He might even agree to working with you on a couple of songs to provide you with the best light. Use some fill flash for the first couple of songs if they will allow you to use it...I imagine with digicams being so small these days you'll not be the only one at the gig with a camera taking pics so you could expect to see some flashes going off.

I am expecting some digicams to be there, but their flashes are kinda puny when put up against my sigma even with the Stofen on. I found that out at Lakeside, the little cameras in the crowd were fine and didn't upset the band, when the pro's opened up with SB800's and a ring, we blinded them :D

I'm going to try and find the lighting engineer, but I'll be turning up after the event has started, or bang on it starting, damn work. The sound engineers no problem, all the fans know him so he would be easy to find and speak to :rolleyes:

Knew it was too good to be true, my luck just ran out. No one has teh 50mm prime in stock, and won't have for about 1 month!!! Looks like all popular nikon lenses are rare at the mo.

Si, I'd lend you one if I had one. I'm sure those Nikon guys on here are not as bad as we Canonites make out ;) Why not post a request to borrow a nice 50/1.4?

Didn't think of that :rolleyes:

I've just bought a Sigma 50mm F2.8 EX DG lens, which I'll sell once I can get my hands on a 50mm F1.8.

The only bit that wories me, is the fact it has a macro capability, is this gonna stuff me up? Mu Canon lens has a maginfication factor of about 1:1.4, the Sigma is 1:1, is it going to matter over a distance of about 6 feet?

As promised its I'd like your comments on these pics. I won't make excuses cos I did stuff up, I had the wrong lens on :rolleyes: New something had to go wrong, but I couldn't get the lens I wanted in time so had to make do, and it was my first go at no flash photography, although the portraits were taken using flash.

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0633admin-01.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0645admin-01.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0689-01admin.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0695admin-01.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0706-01admin.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0717-01admin.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0735-01admin.jpg

Nice pics, especially pic 5!!!! thats probably cos im an old perv:D . Seriously though a great start!

Well done, they are always difficult conditions to work in!

Paul:)

Its not just you mate, I spent all night perving ;D And made a comment to their sound engineer "Molly ain't making this any easier on me", to which he just wet himself :D

As Paul says, difficult conditions to work in and the choice of lens hasn't really done you any favours as it's including a bit more of the surroundings than you might have wanted -- in the second pic there's a speaker (?) in the top RH corner which takes my eye away from the main subject. Given the cramped quarters of the HRC, maybe it would have been better to select a longer lens and higher ISO to allow you to get in closer and focus on the musicians without including so much of the background. The last portrait is really well lit and you've caught the moment pretty well there! I won't make any comments about pictures of a girl with her legs astride...oops! Nearly did!!! What I like about that picture is the hint of motion blur on the machine heads and her hand although again, given the cramped conditions, the mike to the drum kit is distracting so perhaps a zoom could have been a solution:

http://www.alwyngreer.com/temp/molly.jpg

(I'm sure some won't appreciate me taking her legs away in this crop :D:):D:))

Overall an auspicious start! Well done.

Yeah that was a speaker, sadly the 2 zooms I own are an 18 - 70 F3.5 and the 70-200 F2.8, the bigger 1 was just to big, and the smaller 1 was just not wide enough in aperture even on ISO 1250, on ISO 1600 the shots just looked crap, even by my low standards.


Don't worry about cropping Mollys legs off, I won't call it sacralige :P

Cheers for the comets, I really apprecate them, I need to learn this game, and honest feedback give me pointers on where to improve, cos to be honest, the bands fans will accept anything I put up, where as I won't.
Hopefully more shots will be n their way soon, I'm just waiting for their sound engineer to email me.

Following your hints Sti-Frenchie, I have re-edited the first portrait.

What do you think now.

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a233/scoobysi/Faders%20at%20CIN/DSC_0717-012admin.jpg

What aperture did you use? Too much DOF I think